I have been a "lurker" on the Allnurses boards and have received some very good advice esp. for taking Pre-reqs. I will be finished with my pre-reqs in May and wanted to know for those that have a BS degree in a different subject, who on the board chose the Direct Entry /Entry Level Masters of Nursing program and why.
What makes the difference other than having a Masters degree that makes it better than an ADN or BSN.
I really did not want to take more classes in things I already took (Sociology, Psych, etc.) for my BS in Health so I am basically going for either ADN or Direct Entry MSN programs (Not looking foward to sitting for a GRE though.)
I have read some threads on the "Great ADN vs. BSN" debate but I basically wanted to hear from those that have BS degrees in a different discipline and chose an ADN or Entry Level Master Nursing Program.
PS. I know technically you can earn more as an ELMSN but is it necessarily better?
Specializes in PICU, Nurse Educator, Clinical Research.
I have a BS in Public and Community Health, and I choose to do an ADN program. Like others said it was more economical, and the school was closer to home. I intend to to an RN to MSN program later.
Good luck to you.
I think a lot depends on the availability (and cost) of programs in your area. I went through a BFA program at UNC Chapel Hill 15 years ago, but because of AP credits from high school, didn't take many of the general college level courses that BSN programs require (sociology, introductory psych, etc.). I sat down with an advisor from UNC and did a side-by-side comparison of the money and time it would take to get a BSN versus ADN- the cost difference was mind-boggling to me...about $10K cheaper going the ADN route- and, in my area, the clinical sites are the same between the two programs. Also, it took a total of 5 semesters to finish an ADN and get back into the workforce (I had been unemployed for year before applying to nursing programs, so time was of the essence), versus a full 8 semesters for the BSN. In my area, at least, ADN, Diploma, and BSN nurses have equal pay and opportunity in the areas I plan to pursue- critical care for infants and children. The tidbit that tipped the scale, though, was that I could enter an RN-MSN bridge program by taking a paltry *two* BSN courses- something I can certainly do while working- so I can end up with my MSN *much* faster going the ADN route. Plus, I'll be able to earn a living wage 2 years sooner.
For the record, everyone I know in my area who chose the ADN-BSN route felt like it wasn't a worthwhile investment of time and money, as they didn't improve their career opportunities one whit, unless they planned to pursue management (and I don't know a soul who aspires to that particular path). Other geographic areas might be different...make sure you talk to people actually working in the field, and not just academic advisors, to get a good view on the situation in your area.
I have a BS in Biology and decided to go for the ELMSN program, which I guess makes me the odd man out on this thread! I was really attracted to getting my MSN right off the bat because of the flexibility it affords. My ideal job after school would really be a combination of several "part-time" positions - a couple shifts per week as a hospital RN, on or two shifts per week as an NP at one of the women's clinics, maybe serve as an instructor, international volunteer work....I just have a lot of varied interests, some of which are best achieved with an RN and some of which require an MSN/NP. I also don't have any kids (yet), so now seems like a wise time to invest in my education.
Just my two cents - I think the right degree varies substantially depending on each person's individual goals/financial situation/etc.
I had a BS in biology & went through an accelerated program for the BSN. Personally, I would recommend the MSN & sit for the NP or CNS test. It will only take you about one extra year, and you will have so many more options. The GRE is no big deal -- it's almost identical to the SAT's. There are lots of study guides out there that can help you out (I only studied for one week, and did fine -- many people do fine with minimal effort).
As for the other BS degree, it's not really an advantage in nursing. The BSN is more highly valued for some crazy reason (even though many other BS degrees are more difficult to get). But the BSN is not a requirement for nursing practice, though it is an advantage for promotions. The people with BSNs or MSNs are more competitive for managment, charge nurse in certain settings (ICU), and staff educational jobs -- in my hospital (Seattle) -- but probably not all hospitals. It really just depends on what you want to do.
I think a lot depends on the availability (and cost) of programs in your area. I went through a BFA program at UNC Chapel Hill 15 years ago, but because of AP credits from high school, didn't take many of the general college level courses that BSN programs require (sociology, introductory psych, etc.). I sat down with an advisor from UNC and did a side-by-side comparison of the money and time it would take to get a BSN versus ADN- the cost difference was mind-boggling to me...about $10K cheaper going the ADN route- and, in my area, the clinical sites are the same between the two programs. Also, it took a total of 5 semesters to finish an ADN and get back into the workforce (I had been unemployed for year before applying to nursing programs, so time was of the essence), versus a full 8 semesters for the BSN. In my area, at least, ADN, Diploma, and BSN nurses have equal pay and opportunity in the areas I plan to pursue- critical care for infants and children. The tidbit that tipped the scale, though, was that I could enter an RN-MSN bridge program by taking a paltry *two* BSN courses- something I can certainly do while working- so I can end up with my MSN *much* faster going the ADN route. Plus, I'll be able to earn a living wage 2 years sooner.
For the record, everyone I know in my area who chose the ADN-BSN route felt like it wasn't a worthwhile investment of time and money, as they didn't improve their career opportunities one whit, unless they planned to pursue management (and I don't know a soul who aspires to that particular path). Other geographic areas might be different...make sure you talk to people actually working in the field, and not just academic advisors, to get a good view on the situation in your area.
Good luck!
Cost is not really an issue in NC. You can take out loans to finance the education & then have all the loan $ dismissed by working in the state. I also went to UNC-CH -- many of my classmates did this. Other states may work the same way. Regardless, there is also a federal program that dimisses accumulated debt in exchange for service (& working in most major hospitals, for full pay of course, qualifies as "service").
Good post! I've had many of the same questions. I have a liberal arts bachelors and am applying for an ADN program in the fall. I'm choosing the ADN because it is affordable and commutable - the nearest BSN program is about 40 mi, and where I live (Northern VA) that kind of commute into traffic is horrible. I may eventually go towards a masters, but right now I want to develop marketable skills without taking on loans. I want to work as an RN and really get a feel for the profession and how I fit into it before considering an advanced degree.
I, too, was wondering whether a BS in another field would help out at all in terms of promotions.
Good luck to you! :)
I don't know where you live in Northern VA, but UVA and VCU have accelerated BSNs, and UVA has a Direct Entry Masters Program.
Common sense tells me you've checked this already...so forgive me if I'm restating the obvious!
Cost is not really an issue in NC. You can take out loans to finance the education & then have all the loan $ dismissed by working in the state. I also went to UNC-CH -- many of my classmates did this. Other states may work the same way. Regardless, there is also a federal program that dimisses accumulated debt in exchange for service (& working in most major hospitals, for full pay of course, qualifies as "service").
OOOH, pass on the loan forgiveness information please! I've been looking for this stuff to no avail...
Specializes in PICU, Nurse Educator, Clinical Research.
But the BSN is not a requirement for nursing practice, though it is an advantage for promotions. The people with BSNs or MSNs are more competitive for managment, charge nurse in certain settings (ICU), and staff educational jobs -- in my hospital (Seattle) -- but probably not all hospitals. It really just depends on what you want to do.
lady_jezebel is so right....these things seem to be so variable in different geographical areas. Where I work (big research university hospital), there are almost no staff nurses with MSNs, and the only MSN staff nurse educators run the programs for the entire hospital- unit educators have a BSN. The nurses with MSN degrees are working in NP or CNS roles. In nearby rural areas, though, a couple of the NPs I know moonlight as staff nurses in small hospitals where they don't use advanced practice nurses, but they don't get a dime more than BSN and ADN staff nurses.
In the ICU where I worked during school, degree didn't matter at all- the hospital recently started requiring charge nurses to pass a charge nurse class (really annoyed people who'd been working as charge for 15 years), and probably a little more than half of the regular charge nurses have an ADN only. Incidentally, several of the BSN nurses who had graduated within the last 2-3 years said they chose *not* to orient to charge, as they didn't want the hassle, and only wanted to work at the bedside long enough to get into grad school.
As I mentioned in my earlier post, I researched this extensively before I went to nursing school, as time and money were major factors in my decision. I think the most important thing for anyone to keep in mind when starting the process is that *most* people have a biased opinion, so you really have to talk to the people doing what you eventually want to do, preferably in the area where you intend to live and work. It can vary from unit to unit in the same hospital, too...I'll be working in a PICU (assuming I pass the NCLEX monday!! :behindpc: ), and the NM who hired me was a fellow ADN grad, enrolled in an RN-MSN bridge program, so she had absolutely no reservations about hiring a new grad from an ADN program...but a classmate (who, incidentally, has a Pharm D) applied to the MICU in the same hospital, and was told by *that* NM that she wouldn't hire new ADN grads in the ICU, but put them in stepdown for a year first.
Sorry for the long post, but I find this topic fascinating; this is a field where you can truly tailor your educational path to meet your needs, and realities and requirements vary tremendously from place to place. the debate about *ideal* nursing education often has little influence on the individual's situation, and I enjoy hearing what others have discovered and pursued in their own educational paths.
I think a lot depends on the availability (and cost) of programs in your area. I went through a BFA program at UNC Chapel Hill 15 years ago, but because of AP credits from high school, didn't take many of the general college level courses that BSN programs require (sociology, introductory psych, etc.). I sat down with an advisor from UNC and did a side-by-side comparison of the money and time it would take to get a BSN versus ADN- the cost difference was mind-boggling to me...about $10K cheaper going the ADN route- and, in my area, the clinical sites are the same between the two programs. Also, it took a total of 5 semesters to finish an ADN and get back into the workforce (I had been unemployed for year before applying to nursing programs, so time was of the essence), versus a full 8 semesters for the BSN. In my area, at least, ADN, Diploma, and BSN nurses have equal pay and opportunity in the areas I plan to pursue- critical care for infants and children. The tidbit that tipped the scale, though, was that I could enter an RN-MSN bridge program by taking a paltry *two* BSN courses- something I can certainly do while working- so I can end up with my MSN *much* faster going the ADN route. Plus, I'll be able to earn a living wage 2 years sooner.
For the record, everyone I know in my area who chose the ADN-BSN route felt like it wasn't a worthwhile investment of time and money, as they didn't improve their career opportunities one whit, unless they planned to pursue management (and I don't know a soul who aspires to that particular path). Other geographic areas might be different...make sure you talk to people actually working in the field, and not just academic advisors, to get a good view on the situation in your area.
Good luck!
See, that's why UNC drives me spare. I have a college degree, served in the USAF, AND lived in Saudi Arabia for three years in Riyadh as a civilian (including during 9/11 and a year before and after), yet they want me to take a Cultural Perspective course, the only prereq I'm lacking for their BSN?
Are they NUTS? I know more about real life in the Middle East than the Caucasian instructor teaching it from a book. (Trust me when I say CNN is a fine purveyor of bovine scatology. Believe very little of what they and Fox have to say. In fact, at our house, most news is banned.)
AP credits apparently sneak up on you later. I think that stinks.
I'm lucky that finances aren't a problem for us, so I can tool out of state for a year (which is what I'll probably do; VCU, Vanderbilt, MUSC, and Belmont University are figuring highly on my list) for an Accelerated BSN. Vanderbilt is an MSN program. If finances were an issue, I'd go to DTCC for an ADN in a heartbeat. You'll have all kinds of credible online options at that point.
As I've heard said, the NCLEX is the same for all of us.
I have a BA in Psych and a BA in sociology...I have chosen to go the direct entry masters program and I love it:) It is a 15 month program and its accelerated. The teachers expect a lot out of you and it is very challenging but very worth it! I agree with those though who say it depends on availability of a program. There were NO ADN programs in my area that had a waiting list for cliniclas shorter than 18 months...
After graduating with my BA though I really wanted to find a program that would utilize my BA. There are only 30 people in my program and it has been so wonderful:) All of my instructors are great and we have great clinical sites. I love the fast pace environment. My masters program focuses a lot on critical thinking skills and also writing skills. Eventually I plan on going into management and possibly teaching so these skills to me, are invaluable. According to my instructors, masters programs, to be considered masters level must contain so many hours of analytical writing courses and research methods and theory. Also we must have a certain amount of hours in leadership, professional theories and what not...while some may not value those courses, I find them to be extremely helpful in preparing me for my future....the more I learn the more I learn to think...lol...its amazing the more I learn how differently I view the world...it is very much all about how much you know:) Im not saying that ADN or BSN nurses arent prepared as well, there are many great ADN/BSN nurses, but I will never say that any education is wasted. Its more about what YOU want out of your degree.....Im all for higher education for anyone who wants it soo if you want it go for it:)
There are cons though also, time is always an issue for me, I absolutely have no time for a job:( also cost is a factor...Since I already had one bachelors degree the gov. wouldnt give me any more financial aid (well they would give me loans but i wasnt even eligible for many more) for another bachelors...but once I entered the masters program it opened up some more possibilities for aid for me...you may want to check into that as well? Another thing to think about is maybe you could get the ADN and get a job and have the hospital or where you work to pay for some of your college...most places that I know of have some type of tuition reimbursement. For me, I essentially chose the shortest route I could find, Im glad I did but I cant say if the ADN program was quicker that I wouldnt have chosen that way either:) soo good luck to you and with your decision, I know how hard it is to struggle with this decision!
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I've been looking for this stuff to no avail...
rach_nc_03
372 Posts
I think a lot depends on the availability (and cost) of programs in your area. I went through a BFA program at UNC Chapel Hill 15 years ago, but because of AP credits from high school, didn't take many of the general college level courses that BSN programs require (sociology, introductory psych, etc.). I sat down with an advisor from UNC and did a side-by-side comparison of the money and time it would take to get a BSN versus ADN- the cost difference was mind-boggling to me...about $10K cheaper going the ADN route- and, in my area, the clinical sites are the same between the two programs. Also, it took a total of 5 semesters to finish an ADN and get back into the workforce (I had been unemployed for year before applying to nursing programs, so time was of the essence), versus a full 8 semesters for the BSN. In my area, at least, ADN, Diploma, and BSN nurses have equal pay and opportunity in the areas I plan to pursue- critical care for infants and children. The tidbit that tipped the scale, though, was that I could enter an RN-MSN bridge program by taking a paltry *two* BSN courses- something I can certainly do while working- so I can end up with my MSN *much* faster going the ADN route. Plus, I'll be able to earn a living wage 2 years sooner.
For the record, everyone I know in my area who chose the ADN-BSN route felt like it wasn't a worthwhile investment of time and money, as they didn't improve their career opportunities one whit, unless they planned to pursue management (and I don't know a soul who aspires to that particular path). Other geographic areas might be different...make sure you talk to people actually working in the field, and not just academic advisors, to get a good view on the situation in your area.
Good luck!