No more rudeness!

[WheatGerm]

What is it going to take to change the nursing culture? I'm not talking about nurses eating their young necessarily, but just the superiority attitudes in general.

Here's my example: I went to the zoo the other day to take my mind off the NCLEX that I was unsure whether or not I passed. There were three girls sitting at a table beside me who were discussing the NCLEX (not ideal to get my mind off of it, haha). But one girl was saying that she would have been so upset if she didn't pass, and thinks if you don't pass the first time you shouldn't be a nurse. They were talking about one classmate in particular and saying how he failed and was such a loser and they would hate to know their nurse failed the NCLEX because that means you are stupid.

I've heard similar attitudes in the past. I mean, they were barely even nurses and already they have this attitude of not passing the NCLEX = you're a stupid person who shouldn't be a nurse. That is so bothersome to me as someone who considered not getting into the field due to the cattiness I had heard so much about.

Anyway, I personally think the education about kindness and consideration in the field needs to start early in nursing school to start changing the culture of nursing. It just seems like a high school clique issue that needs to be addressed before people hit the workplace. Am I the only one??

[Axgrinder]

I agree: other professions have their own fair share of interpersonal relationship issues too, therefore nursing is not unique, or even in special in that regard.

Do I believe that nursing itself is the causative factor for much of this friction? When put that way it sounds pretty ludicrous - however one could spend an entire day arguing a really good case in support for both sides of the equation … so for me the jury is still out on that one.

Logically it just stands to reason that if you create a cluster or group of people who are not necessarily together specifically because they chose to be in each other's company, there is bound to be some personalities that repel each other like oil and water.

However … I've often wondered if perhaps the College of Nursing subconsciously, and unintentionally fostered specific self destructive behaviors and habits that I most certainly didn't have prior to graduating from nursing school?

If I remember correctly, the quest to "Perfectionism" (with a capital "P") had become quite a nasty and ferocious little illness/disorder/syndrome amongst my graduating class of 40 nursing students.

What had begun quite innocently as random groups of students getting together in the court yard after finishing a test to indulge in a bit of commiserating over test question answers ("What did you put for question # 951? Ahhh man! I put: 'Not C, not D, not Z, possibly X, Q, Y & A, but unquestionably E, P & W!'. Oh no … I failed! I just know it!" …) quickly became mass hysteria and obsession. It passed from person to person, contagious like the flu.

Soon, passing the test - or even earning an "A" was no longer good enough: all answers had to be right - every test, quiz, project, and paper had to be 100%. Behaviors in clinicals were even worse. The message was clear: "You're not good enough if you get any answers wrong, or don't get full points". The thing was though that this message was coming from ourselves!

And where would any self depreciating perfectionist migrate to after graduation and passing the NCLX? You guessed it: ICU - where I could obsess over the small details all day long, often not get time for my measly 30 minutes lunch, leave late, and work overtime. That is until a chronic health condition swooped down on me to almost swallow me whole.

Yeah, another clear message: "Stop these behaviors, or die".

I was 32 years old.

I spent the next 10 years on SSI, and nearly did anyway (die that is).

Not sure what it is with many first nursing jobs causing so much grief - making people so miserable, however if that is the usual expectations for many new grad's then I conformed to a "T".

You see, I had accepted a new grad RN position in the 7th Circle of Hell. I crossed the River Styx during my daily commute to work/home, and I even car pooled with Charon.

It was pretty horrible. And although my brain resolutely blocked out most of that particular employment experience as best it could, I'm pretty sure there was fire, brimestone, and pitch forks.

Oh yeah, and demons too … lot's and lot's of demons, and a few devils too (all with "RN" after their names).

My health recovered enough to return to nursing 2.5 years ago - a genuine miracle. Despite the fact that I've had many nursing positions over the years since that first disastrous new grad RN job (nearly all of them better, and none of them worse) I can honestly say that I love my current nursing job, and it is the very best one I've ever had. All of my coworkers are awesome, and I trust each and every one of them to watch my back when things go sideways, as they often do. It truly is an amazing group of nurses: we work well together, each of us secure in the knowledge that the other's are looking out for one another. To say my supervisor is spectacular is really not doing her justice: she's the type of boss you get on your knees to thank God for.

If cattiness is still out there - and I don't have any reason to believe that it isn't - It packed up and hit the road a long time ago from my present employer.

[BeenThere2012, ASN, RN]

I agree with professional behavior being taught in Nursing school....as a start, and then carried on by modeling the appropriate behavior in practice. You would never see doctors treating one another this way or making this sort of comment in public. No doubt, MD friends talk amongst each other outside of work. We are all entitled to our opinions and have plenty of them. Even MDs who have been friends of mine do not speak badly of each other when it would be "safe" to do so.

[BeenThere2012, ASN, RN]

I want to propose, and maybe this came up already (I apologize if it did) but: OP, is it possible that usually this girls opinion would not have even made you bat an eye but you were oversensitive that particular day?

You said you were at the zoo to get your mind off the test.

I agree with the poster who says the 'rudeness' and 'eating of the young' stuff is more myth than reality. You can't believe it every time someone tells you they were mistreated by their fellow nurses.

I used to be a preceptor and I can tell you this for a fact: I've seen too many nurses who have messed up try to fall on the 'You're just being a nasty old nurse eating their young' when they are told what they're doing must be corrected.

Was training a young new grad who had decided I was a social retard who eats young nurses (never mind that I was only three years older than her age wise and only two years her senior a nurse). To her, I was a social retard because I couldn't understand why she needed to disappear into the bathroom for nearly an hour at the end of every shift. This extended absence from the unit went past report hand off time mind you. She was prettying herself up for going out after work. When I informed her the makeover had to wait until she was off the clock, she erupted and CRIED. Yes, she had tears and red eyes and all that........because I had attacked her. (sigh)

Now, imagine this girl later on that night, sitting at her computer on AN. "Oh, my preceptor is just another crabby know it all. I hate her. She eats the young." And I'm sure what it was that she had done, disappearing for an hour, would have been.....left out. (sigh)

Point is, don't get caught up in the whole thing about nurses hate each other. It's a bit of a myth.

You bring up some very important points r/t perspective and how some wrongly accuse based upon their own denial or defensiveness. I do feel as nurses we need to improve our professional behavior...on both sides. Those who accuse of being bullied, and those who actually do treat one another poorly/unprofessionally. As I mentioned in a different thread, you would never find doctors talking about each other or gossiping the way many nurses do. They usually err on the side of protecting one another if an err is made as opposed to attacking or jumping on one another. I've been guilty, myself, because as others have said, to a degree it is human nature, but.....BIG BUT, I personally want to see more professional behavior than what is often still common place in our profession, and I work to change the "human nature" in myself.

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

I spent the next 10 years on SSI, and nearly did anyway (die that is).

Not sure what it is with many first nursing jobs causing so much grief - making people so miserable, however if that is the usual expectations for many new grad's then I conformed to a "T".

I think lot of it is the dichotomy between what you expect when you graduate from nursing school and take that first job and what you actually get. Even if you worked as a CNA for years, you don't fully comprehend the tremendous responsibility that settles squarely on your shoulders as "the nurse" until you become "the nurse." New grads who have fantasies of sitting, holding the patient's hand and comforting him in his hour of need very quickly find out that instead, they're going to be passing dozens of medications, cleaning up rivers of poop and dealing with that patient's crazy family instead. New grads who envisioned grateful patients thanking them for making their surgery a little easier instead find verbally abusive patients who can't understand why they have to be NPO, want a nurse of a different complexion, or want the OTHER "D drug", the only one that helps their terrible pain. Coupled with the fact that many of today's new nurses have never actually had a real job before, the reality does not match the expectation in any way. Someone who has never had to get up at 5am to be to work by 6:45 may have difficulty curtailing her evening to get enough sleep and someone who has never had to work an overnight shift (and didn't believe she'd ever actually HAVE to) is going to be miserable. If you're smart, you realize that you don't really know anything. Everything you do, every decision you make, every med you give is a source of anxiety until you develop enough experience to know when to worry and when not to. And if you're stupid enough to believe that you know everything, reality will inevitably slap you down, hopefully before you kill someone.

Going from student to nurse is a gigantic step for anyone, and most of us were quaking in our boots at first. It gets easier over time and with experience, but that first year is often miserable.

[Ruby Vee, BSN]

I agree with professional behavior being taught in Nursing school....as a start, and then carried on by modeling the appropriate behavior in practice. You would never see doctors treating one another this way or making this sort of comment in public. No doubt, MD friends talk amongst each other outside of work. We are all entitled to our opinions and have plenty of them. Even MDs who have been friends of mine do not speak badly of each other when it would be "safe" to do so.

You never see doctors treating each other this way or making comments in public because they have private dining rooms, private offices and private conference rooms in which to engage their snarky behavior.

[Jensmom7, BSN, RN]

I agree with professional behavior being taught in Nursing school....as a start, and then carried on by modeling the appropriate behavior in practice. You would never see doctors treating one another this way or making this sort of comment in public. No doubt, MD friends talk amongst each other outside of work. We are all entitled to our opinions and have plenty of them. Even MDs who have been friends of mine do not speak badly of each other when it would be "safe" to do so.

Our Hospice Medical Directors are VERY vocal about some of the less than stellar decisions made by attendings who don't know borscht about managing a terminal patient but refuse to let anyone else give them recommendations, even another doctor.

If nothing else, it provides free entertainment during our bi-weekly team meetings lol.