Med Techs work under your license?

RNOTODAY, BSN, RN · Jun 10, 2007

I work for a facility that utilizes Med Techs.How can I be held responsible for a med error they make when They pass meds before Im even on duty????I dont delegate them to do this task.And theyve been doing this for years.I work at a residential facility for abused kids.The laws are different I think.The Don trained them andthey got signed off.Would she be responsible??Even if shes not on duty???

HI allantiques4me!!!

uhh, yeah, ditto that question for me, since I work in the same type of facility..but ours are not techs, just line staff, and get about 45 min of being shown the bubble packs, the mar's, and thats it.

what does it really mean "under our license".*what* can actually happen to us (the licensed nurse) if they make a major error? Does anybody know?

I also am not present when these meds are given.

rnewmanjunkie · Jun 10, 2007

Just for the record, I'm a Med Tech and we DO NOT dispense meds. We are not trained, or licensed. We cannot instruct nurses on how to use a blood warmer because blood is considered a drug.

antidote · Jun 10, 2007

I'm all for the work of CNA's and CNA II's. If it wasn't for them, any hospital or LTC would not be able to function properly. They definetly are a big help and make things possible.

However, personally, I think that no one below the training of an LPN should be passing medications of any sort! I understand that they're not prescribing or pushing I.V medications, but suppose they "accidentally" give the wrong medications (since they don't know which medications do what I would assume after a couple hour course). Now, if a CNA was able to take a full pharm. course I would be less worried but still have concerns.

This definetly sounds like something you should talk to your manager about. If I were you and just to be on the safe side, don't decline any interviews.

MelodyRNurse · Jun 10, 2007

I was offered a position at an assisted living facility. I am a new LPN and they wanted me to be responsible for over 70 people with no one else in the building. They justified that by using the med techs, who passed meds to about 20 out of 70. I asked if I would be responsible for any mistakes they might make. The interviewer said no, unless you knew about it. Well, if I would have taken the position I would have requested that in writing.

pagandeva2000, LPN · Jun 10, 2007

They have the old med cart system at this facility. No computer to dispense meds. I honestly don't know if they do narcs but I will find out during my shift tonight. I have a feeling I'm going to start interviewing elsewhere :-/ It sucks because I really liked this place too.

I used to be certified to pass meds as an aide at a psychiatric hospital. We did not pass narcs, it was usually an LPN that did that. Now, looking in as an LPN, I would say that I would not wish to work with aides that pass meds because their judgement would not be the same as it would be for me as a trained nurse. I have seen too much.

pagandeva2000, LPN · Jun 10, 2007

What I believe is that the med-tech should be responsible for their errors, not me. But, the other side of the coin is that if they are certifying med techs, where would this leave me as an LPN.

pagandeva2000, LPN · Jun 10, 2007

I went to an Urgent Care Facility for my ear. The M.D. "assigned" the "tech" to do an invasive procedure-well not majorly invasive-but it did involve placing an instrument in my ear. As I noted the tech to be shaking I asked if she had ever "done" this before (flushed an ear/removed wax). She indicated "nope" and I then ascertained she was not an RN or LPN. Grant it- this is not cardiac surgery... but as the syringe with needle came to my ear....
All I can say is that the general public better wake up. (Obviously I did not "let" the tech continue.)

I was taught this skill (flush and remove ear wax) as a patient care technician, never as a nurse. And, I never utilized the skill, I just learned if for orientation. I have seen some people use syringes without the needle to flush the ears...it is easier than using the other apparatus that I was taught to use.

One of the issues is that people naturally assume that nurses know each and every medication, procedure and skill. Most nursing schools do not cover those things, and even if so, unless you are practicing each skill each day, you WILL forget once you begin practice. For example, I was taught how to calculate pediatric dosages. Now, I don't remember for the life of me because I don't have a reason to practice this skill.

Mama Val, ASN, RN · Jun 10, 2007

The nursing home here lets CNA pass meds after they take a mini-med course. But who knows...the dementia pt can't tell you that she has been getting Bayer (asprin) with her Coumadin for her headaches from that nice nurse in the afternoon. Its too risky, and I am sorry I known in the end the admin will blame the LPNs (Lowest Paid Nurses) because we are easier to get rid of.

I don't care if its a Med Tech or an RN. I would hope that the first time anyone does anything that there would be an instructor or supervisor there to assist them. If she is shaking that bad then I don't need her tapping my eardrum with the catheter then flushing my ear like she's washing her car....yes that does hurt. This is after she's looked in your ear first to know the area she is working on ......right. Sorry to be so sarcastic. I do know some great techs out there who have the brains and common sense to be LPNs.

TrudyRN · Jun 10, 2007

Who gets the meds for the MT's - do they draw them from the pyxis or what, do they also give narcotics?

I doubt narcs or pyxis are involved.

TrudyRN · Jun 10, 2007

Is this true? I just started a new job at an assisted living facility and they have about 6 med techs passing meds during my shift. I'm basically in the nurses station taking care of orders, charts and phone calls from family. I'm rarely on the floor of this facility that has about 244 residents.
If a med tech makes an error, does that fall back on me? These med techs have been there for YEARS and I've been there 2 days so far. Anyone know what would happen in a situation where a med tech made an error? How do I protect myself?

Ask a few lawyers in your state. Ask your state BON, too. Require a written response from them. Read the nurse practice act in your state and read the laws regarding med techs, too.

I believe they are responsible for themselves. How could you possibly be responsible for them? Are you putting the pills in the patients' mouths?They have been trained, "educated", given the Rx by Pharmacy and their orders are by docs, they have been hired by the employer and not by you. You are not expected to stand over them or directly supervise them in this task, are you?

TrudyRN · Jun 10, 2007

Just for the record, I'm a Med Tech and we DO NOT dispense meds. We are not trained, or licensed. We cannot instruct nurses on how to use a blood warmer because blood is considered a drug.

If you are a Med Tech but you don't dispense meds, what do you do? :uhoh21: :uhoh21: :uhoh21: :uhoh3: :uhoh3:

TrudyRN · Jun 10, 2007

As the licensed nurse in the facility, anyone working there in an unlicensed position is under your license. Same as for a CNA, they have a certificate, but they are under your license.
Suzanne, what exactly does "under your license" mean? I think we need a clear and precise definition of this term.
Example: a resident is slapped or otherwise abused by someone other than the nurse. How is the nurse responsible for this? It happens out of her sight, without her knowledge, certainly not at her behest. How is she responsible and how does the concept of the slapper being "under her license" come into play?
I believe the nurse would have a duty to care for the patient and notify the doc and N. Sup, document, do the Inc Rept, stuff like that. But she is not at fault unless she knew there was bad blood or saw the slapper impaired and still let her work.