Do you feel the LVN/Lpn Is being left out in the nursing profession? - page 2

Alot of the issue lately being brought up in the senate concerns RNs do you feel the Lpn/Lvn is being left out in the issues presented?... Read More

  1. by   Russ Dowling
    Mimiboop, I agree that it's ridiculous that here in Pa we can't take VO/TOs, however, by doing so you're placing yourself in a very precarious position. If by chance something happens to the patient, you'll be held responsible. In addition, the RN covering you is ultimately responsible for any patients in your care. This means that you BOTH would be subject to disciplinary action. Please don't take my comments as criticism. I just want to make sure you understand the ramifications of doing something because the person responsible for doing it is busy.
  2. by   -jt
    <if I'm not mistaken, isn't there a professional organization specifically for LPNs? One that RNs aren't a part of? Kind of a parallel to the ANA? >

    yes. Its called the National Federation of LPNs. The website is at

    But most LPNs dont join it, and none that I have ever spoken to have even known it existed. An organization can only be as strong as the people it represents. If anybody is forgetting the LPNs & leaving them out it is themselves.

    As for the ANA, the legislation they are pushing nationally addresses workplace safety, safe staffing and elmination of mandatory OT for RNs AND LPNS & in most of what they are supporting, they use the term "nurse" - not RN.

    I find it ironic that people will complain that they cant join an organization that is specific for another group when they dont even make an effort to become part of the organization that represents their own group. check it out.
  3. by   NRSKarenRN
    Jamistlc and Russ have offered some excellent advice. How many nurses (RN AND LPN) are aware of and have read the nurse practice acts that your practice is based differs under each state. You will be held accountable to the practice standards under the state license you are working under.
    Here are some points to ponder on after my experience 3 yrs, HHA, 5 yrs LPN and almost 20yrs RN.

    What Are Boards of Nursing ( SBON)?
    Nearly 100 years ago, boards of nursing were established by state government to protect the public's health by overseeing and ensuring the safe practice of nursing. Boards of nursing achieve this mission by establishing the standards for safe nursing care and issuing licenses to practice nursing. Remember, these standards provide the MINIMUM to ensure safe practice. Karen. Once a license is issued, the board's job continues by monitoring licensees' compliance to state laws and taking action against the licenses of those nurses who have exhibited unsafe nursing practice.

    Individuals who serve on a board of nursing are appointed to their position. Your state law dictates the membership of the board of nursing, which usually includes a mix of registered nurses, licensed practical/vocational nurses, advanced practice registered nurses, and consumers. Together, they meet often to oversee board of nursing activities and to take disciplinary action on nurse licenses as necessary.

    The boards of nursing in the 50 states, the District of Columbia, and five United States territories--Guam, Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, American Samoa, and the Northern Mariana Islands--comprise the membership of the National Council of State Boards of Nursing. Five states have two boards of nursing, one for registered nurses and one for licensed practical/vocational nurses: California, Georgia, Louisiana, Texas and West Virginia.
    Links to state boards of nursing and websites can be found here. Most have practice acts on line for viewing.

    Miniboop, as a PA RN/ former LPN, here is the direct link to PA LPN

    scope of practice:

    and Board interpretations:

    Now, under the definition of practical nursing below (which is similar in most states), LPN'S practice is DEPENDENT on another practioner: licensed physician, dentist or professional registered nurse.

    " Practice of practical nursing--The performance of selected nursing acts in the care of the ill, injured or infirm under the direction of a licensed professional nurse, a licensed physician or a licensed dentist which do not require the specialized skill, judgment and knowledge required in professional nursing". [I] PA Practice Act definition.[I]

    Many LPN's are functioning at a higher level than this definition; some institutions have expanded to the limit what they expect their nurses to do...others aren't using LPN's at all in their hospitals/facilities.

    Because of the dependent status of LPN nursing licensure, this has lead to dissention between some LPN's and RN's. We need both levels of practice in order to provide adequately for our clients. In the hospital and LTC setting, LPN's are practicing under the charge nurse supervision; or if no RN's on duty, under the director of nursing's license in the LTC setting. Otherwise, you function under the Doctor/Dentist's license-----they are the ones ultimately responsible for overall nursing care.

    As nurses, we tend to get caught up in our daily routines and practice settings, and fail to promote for ourselves as professionals. That is why only 10% of RNs are members of ANA, don't know statistics on membership of NFLPN. Boards of nursing are only there to guard the public. It is up to each one of use to belong to a nursing group which fights to promote and protect our right to practice. It is extremely difficult/impossible for only one organization (eg. ANA) to advocate for BOTH levels of nursing professionals as each practice has it's own unique needs, without seeming to favor one group over the other.

    I don't belong to the NFLPN because it has not shown me that it has any kind of clout at all.
    As Jt and Jenny P have stated on many occasions, an organization is only as strong as the MEMBERSHIP participation. Professional groups DON"T get outside funding, they provide services based on their membership if they have few members, they can only provide minimum services unless membership is 100% active( LOL).

    Last edit by NRSKarenRN on Jul 21, '01
  4. by   -jt
    I don't belong to the NFLPN because it has not shown me that it has any kind of clout at all.

    well how is an organization supposed to have any "clout" if it doesnt have any members??? People have to get involved because the MEMBERS are the clout! : )

    If LPNs are feeling left out, they can do something about it by getting involved & controlling their own professional destiny. Visit the NFLPN website. Theres lots of interesting stuff there & it looks like some exciting events coming up for LPNs nationally. There are also statewide LPN organizations.

    NFLPN Constituent State Addresses:

    Gregory Howard
    Alabama Federation of LPNs
    2803 7th Avenue
    Tuscaloosa, AL 35401

    Ann Fultz
    Kentucky State Association of LPNs
    2340 Griffith Street
    Ashland, KY 41101

    Elaine Taylor
    North Dakota LPN Association
    468 6th Avenue, N.E.
    Valley City, ND 58072-3149
    Office: 701/845-3129

    Irene Bruns
    Colorado Federation of LPNs
    1444 North Foote
    Colorado Springs, CO 80909
    Office: (719) 633-1968

    Faye Norton
    Louisiana Federation of LPNs
    1030Hickman St.
    West Lake, LA 70669-3110

    Helen Greenlee
    Ohio Federation of LPNs, Inc.
    120 Melwood Ave.
    Dayton, OH 45408

    Brother Francis X. Smith
    Connecticut LPN Association, Inc.
    85 New Park Avenue
    Hartford, CT 06106-2184

    Janie Brown
    Maine LPN Association
    Post Office Box 3893
    Portland, ME 04104

    Rosa Hewitt
    Oklahoma Assocation of LPNs
    318 W. Osage
    Nowata, OK 74048

    Linda McCreary
    LPN Association of Florida
    Post Office Box 47454
    St. Petersburg, FL 33743
    Office: 941/262-0151

    Charlene Hall, LPN
    Maryland LPN Association, Inc.
    151 Smith Avenue
    Westminster, MD 21157

    Thelma Glover
    South Carolina Federation of
    LPNs, Inc.
    1821Gadson St.
    Columbia, SC 29201

    Jean Anders
    LPNs of Idaho, Inc.
    306 S. Terrace
    Salmon, ID 83467

    Francis Butler
    LPN Association of New Hampshire
    567 Washburn Road
    Alexandria, NH 03222

    Mary Barbour
    Virginia LPN Association, Inc.
    1618 Trailridge Road
    Charlottesville, VA 22903-4034

    Jane Pond
    LPN Association of Illinois
    730 E. Vine Street, Suite 105
    Springfield, IL 62703
    Office: 217/522-8026

    Priscilla McCorkle
    New Mexico LPN Association
    1220 Traver Street
    Clovis, NM 88101

    Carolyn Kaiser
    Wisconsin Association of LPNs
    One South Pinckney Street, Suite 725
    Madison, WI 53703
    Office: 608/256-5299

    Cherie Oetker
    Iowa Federation of LPNs
    7 S. 14th Street
    Marshalltown, IA 50158

    James Sweet
    New York Federation of LPN
    Post Office Box 601
    Newtonville, NY 12128
    Office: 518/783-6955

    Hilda Glass
    Individual Member Representative
    1204 Fargo Street
    Marion, IN 46952

    Dorothy Zook
    Kansas Federation of LPNs
    Post Office Box 922
    Hesston, KS 67062-0922

    Patricia Beverage
    North Carolina LPN Association
    Post Office Box 11407
    Durham, NC 27707
    Office: 919/596-8202

    Michael Jacobs
    Military Member Representative
    20 Emerson St.
    Rockland, MA 02370

    James V Blackledge
    Mississippi LPN Association, Inc.
    318 Buffalo Hill Road
    Ellisville, MS 39437
    Office: 601/763-5151

    National Federation of Licensed Practical Nurses, Inc.
    893 US Highway 70 West, Suite 202
    Garner, NC 27529
    919/779-0046 * 800/948-2511 * Fax 919/779-5642

    Charlene Barbour, Executive Director -

    Kristie Newton, Membership Services Director -

    Diana Mills, Convention Services Director -

    As far as collective bargaining, LPNs have that too. SEIU/AFL-CIO is the largest union representative of LPNs & healthcare workers in the country (excluding RNs).
  5. by   JillR
    This is taken right from the Wisconsin Statutes and Administrative Codes relating to the pracise of Nursing.

    Standard of practice for registered nurses.

    1. GENERAL NURSING PROCEDURES. An R.N. shall utilize the nursing process in the execution of general nursing procedures in the mainenance of health, prevention of illness or care of the ill. The nursing process consists of the steps of assessment, planning, intervention, and evaluation.
    (a) Assessment. Assessment is the systematic and continual collection and analysis of data about the health status of a patient of a patient cumulating in the formation of a nursing diagnosis.
    (b) Planning. Planning is developing a nursing plan of care for a patient which includes goals and priorities derived from the nursing diagnosis.
    (c) Intervention. Intervetion is the nursing action to impliment the plan of care by directly administering care or by directing and supervising nursing acts delegated to LPN's or less skilled assistants.
    (d) Evaluation. Evaluation is the deternination of a patients progress or lack of progress torward goal achievemnt which may lead to modifications of the nursing diagnosis.

    (a) Accept only those delegated medical acts for which there are protocols or written or verbal orders
    (b) Accept olnly those delegated medical acts for which the RN is competent o perform based on his or her education, training or experience
    (c) Consult with a physician, dentist or podiatrist in cases where the RN knows or should know a delegated medical act may harm a patient; and,
    (d) Perform delegated medical acts under the general supervision or direction of a physician, podiatrist, or dentist.

    (a) Delegate tasks commensurate with educational preparation and demonstrated abilities of the person supervised.
    (b) Provide direction and assistance to those supervised
    (c) Observe and monitor the activities of those supervised; and,
    (d) Evaluate the effectiveness of acts performed under supervision.

    Standards of practice for licenced practical nurses.

    1. PERFOMANCE OF ACTS IN BASIC PATIENT SITUATIONS. In the performance of acts in the basic patient situations, the L.P.N. shall, under the general supervision of an R.N., or the direction of a physician, podiatrist or dentist:
    (a) Accept only patient care assignments which the L.P.N. is compentent to perform:
    (b) Provide basic nursing care
    (c) Record nusing care given and report to the appropriate person changes in the condition of the patient:
    (d) Consult with an R.N. or a physician in cases where an LPN knows or should know a delegated nursing or medical act may harm a patient: and
    (e) Perform the following acts when applicable;
    1. Assist with the collection of data
    2. Assist with the development and revision of a nursing care plan;
    3. Reinforce the teaching provided by an RN,physician,podiatrist, or dentist and provide basic health care instructions
    4. Participate with other health care team memebers in meeting the patients needs.
    (a) Meet standards under sub (1) under the general supervision of an RN, physician, podiatrist, or dentist.
    (b) Peform delegated nursing or medical acts beyond basic nursing care under the direct supervision of an R.N. physician, podiatrist, or dentist. An L.P.N. shall, upon request of the board, provide documentation of his or her nursing education, training or experience which prepare the LPN to competently perform these assignments.
    3. ASSUMTION OF CHARGE NURSING POSITION IN NURSING HOMES. In assuming the position of charge nurse in a nursing home the LPN shall:
    (a) Follow written protocol and procedure developed by an approved RN.
    (b) Manage and direct the nursing care and other activities of LPN's and nursing support personnel under the general supervision on and RN, and;
    (c) Accept the charge nurse position only if prepared to competently perform this assignment based on his or her nursing education, including education, training or experience or active involvement in education or training for resposibilites not included in the basic LPN curriculum.

    So, as you can tell by reading, in the state of WI, the LPN's do not and cannot do the job of an RN.
  6. by   kcsun3
    There is also another national organization for LPNs besides the NFLPN:

    American Licensed Practical Nurses Association
    1090 Vermont Avenue, NW, Suite 1200
    Washington, DC 20005
    (202) 682-9000

    I don't know anything about them personally, but thought I would pass the info along to those who might be interested.

    The Student Nurse Forum
  7. by   night owl

    Well I visited the ALPNA website and it sure doesn't look like it's a website for LPN's! Registered nurse all over it. Are you sure the P stands for practical??? or does it stand for professional? gotta stand for professional at that website. I consider myself a professional nurse after all of these years even if the books say NOT! I'm a professional practical nurse. How's them apples... a PPN AND d@mn proud of it!!!
  8. by   kcsun3

    What is the url for ALPNA? I could find many references to the organization itself, but no website when I searched via Yahoo. As I said, I have no personal experience with them, but now you have me curious *g*

    By the way - PPN - love it!

    The Student Nurse Forum
  9. by   night owl

    ~ night owl ~
  10. by   La8dyDi
    You go Night Owl! "P" stands for professional! LPN's are Just as "Professional" as any other nurse. RN, BSN, whatever! Professional is how we percieve ourselves, and conduct ourselves.

    I resent the fact that just because we are LPN's we are not considered professional nurses. We have chosen nursing as our "profession". after almost 25 years as an LPN, I consider myself quite "professional!"
  11. by   La8dyDi
    You go Night Owl! "P" stands for professional! LPN's are Just as "Professional" as any other nurse. RN, BSN, whatever! Professional is how we percieve ourselves, and conduct ourselves.

    I resent the fact that just because we are LPN's we are not considered professional nurses. We have chosen nursing as our "profession". after almost 25 years as an LPN, I consider myself quite "professional!"
  12. by   auntmimi57
    Last edit by auntmimi57 on May 15, '04
  13. by   nurseleigh
    I have a simple question. If you feel as though the RN's are being treated better, why not further your education and become one?
    Nurses as a whole need to unite in order to fight for better wages, safer working conditions and so on and so forth. BUT, there is no reason why different levels of nurses can't have their own organizations.
    Personally, i am in school now to become an LPN. I have no intention at this time to go any further in my education than that. Why, you ask? Simple, I dont want the responsibilities, the stress, the headaches, that RN's seem to have to deal with. I dont want to be the boss. I have always been happy being the worker bee in every job i have had. I would rather leave the decision making and paperwork and politics to someone else and just be left to work. Of course, this could all change in time. Maybe when i am 40 i will want to do all that. Right now i just want to be a nurse, regardless of how many letters i get behind my name.
    Or i could just be a highly delusional student that doesnt have a clue what she is talking about. Either way, if we are all fighting each other it is making managements job of keeping us down easier.
    Take care.