Kentucky Board KARE

DuckyGirl06 said:

Do you recommend getting an attorney? Seems like most of the posts I've seen state it's pointless. 

Probably not unless you are truly innocent. I was not. LOL He was "only" like $3,000 though and handled all communication with the board so unsure if he did more behind the scenes than I thought he did. I do think the outcome would have been the same with or without a lawyer though.

TIMFY said:

Probably not unless you are truly innocent. I was not. LOL He was "only" like $3,000 though and handled all communication with the board so unsure if he did more behind the scenes than I thought he did. I do think the outcome would have been the same with or without a lawyer though.

I didn't have money for a lawyer but I wish I did. They wanted a $3-5k retainer. I wasn't not guilty.  One guy did tell me that guilty or not, evidence or not, you're going to do some kind of punishment for any diversion accusation. I ended up only getting 1 year monitoring but it stays on my record forever 😮‍💨 I'm not sure if a lawyer would have made much difference. I wish I had a chance to find out bc they had 0 evidence to include no negative drug screens, no past addiction, and I passed my drug and addiction eval. Bananas. If you think you're def guilty of whatever the charge is, I would just go in hat in hand, take responsibility for your actions and do whatever they tell you to do. Almost all the KARE contracts are the same, so it's not like a lawyer would cut a better deal, ya know? But if you're not guilty and you can afford it, I'd def fight it. 

Has anyone had criminal charges placed against them for these scenarios? I didn't even realize it would be a possibility until I had my substance abuse evaluation. I have yet to hear from my employer about what they plan to do (it's been 3 weeks since I was sent for a drug screen during my shift). Now I'm absolutely terrified! 

DuckyGirl06 said:

Has anyone had criminal charges placed against them for these scenarios? I didn't even realize it would be a possibility until I had my substance abuse evaluation. I have yet to hear from my employer about what they plan to do (it's been 3 weeks since I was sent for a drug screen during my shift). Now I'm absolutely terrified! 

I was criminally charged with 3 felonies. 

I recommend this (just my opinion). If you are guilty and deep down, 99 percent of nurses know if they are guilty or innocent and when I say guilty, I mean....are the pixis pulls obvious, have 2 people seen you high at work, have you admitted it, have you failed a drug test. If ANY of the above apply, they got you and you will be forced into at least some time in monitoring regardless of what your SUD eval shows and lawyers are an absolute waist of time in this situation. They can't help you, Again.....this is IF you are guilty.

If you know you did nothing wrong and you don't have an SUD, then lawyer up and fight it.

Last thing, if you diverted at work and got caught, criminal charges are a real possibility and in that case, get a criminal defense attorney

NurseJackie69 said:

I was criminally charged with 3 felonies. 

I recommend this (just my opinion). If you are guilty and deep down, 99 percent of nurses know if they are guilty or innocent and when I say guilty, I mean....are the pixis pulls obvious, have 2 people seen you high at work, have you admitted it, have you failed a drug test. If ANY of the above apply, they got you and you will be forced into at least some time in monitoring regardless of what your SUD eval shows and lawyers are an absolute waist of time in this situation. They can't help you, Again.....this is IF you are guilty.

If you know you did nothing wrong and you don't have an SUD, then lawyer up and fight it.

Last thing, if you diverted at work and got caught, criminal charges are a real possibility and in that case, get a criminal defense attorney

How did that end up going for you? 

I have admitted to my wrongdoings, self-reported to the BON and have been in communication with them. I have also started the steps in getting enrolled with the KARE program. 
I will have a positive drug screen, but I was not fraudulently pulling medications nor was I ever high at work. My SUD counselor says he doesn't think it's a bad thing that I haven't heard from my employer in nearly 3 weeks - said it could be due to the holidays and they're just doing research. He said if criminal charges were going to happen, they probably would've already. But it still makes me super nervous! 

You said you are accused of drug diversion and didn't do it, but will test positive on a drug test. Why? Will you test positive for the drugs you are being accused of diverting? If so, enter monitoring now and self report. If you didn't divert, lawyer up and fight the charges. You will not be charged criminally. Unless you admit to diversion, it's unlikely. The burden of proof for the BON to discipline you is low and they have great power even if they can't absolutely prove you diverted. But, a prosecutor needs absolute certainty you diverted or they won't charge you or fool with the case.

If you will test positive for what you are being accused of diverting, you have a real problem with the BON and expect a minimum of 3 years at the least to 5 years of monitoring at most.

Overwhelming odds based on your case that you will not be criminally charged and overwhelming odds you would have already been charged by now if it were going to happen.

If you will test positive for a drug you are being accused of diverting, yet you did Not divert, you better be prepared to explain why or how you tested positive.

If charged criminally, most nurses go through a mandated court treatment program that gets your charged dropped after about 6 months of completing that recovery program and it's kind of common for nurses to have charges dropped IF...they are compliant with the BON/State Monitoring Program and the Court Program. This is what happened to me and it's what happens most commonly when nurses are charged.

NurseJackie69 said:

You said you are accused of drug diversion and didn't do it, but will test positive on a drug test. Why? Will you test positive for the drugs you are being accused of diverting? If so, enter monitoring now and self report. If you didn't divert, lawyer up and fight the charges. You will not be charged criminally. Unless you admit to diversion, it's unlikely. The burden of proof for the BON to discipline you is low and they have great power even if they can't absolutely prove you diverted. But, a prosecutor needs absolute certainty you diverted or they won't charge you or fool with the case.

If you will test positive for what you are being accused of diverting, you have a real problem with the BON and expect a minimum of 3 years at the least to 5 years of monitoring at most.

Overwhelming odds based on your case that you will not be criminally charged and overwhelming odds you would have already been charged by now if it were going to happen.

If you will test positive for a drug you are being accused of diverting, yet you did Not divert, you better be prepared to explain why or how you tested positive.

If charged criminally, most nurses go through a mandated court treatment program that gets your charged dropped after about 6 months of completing that recovery program and it's kind of common for nurses to have charges dropped IF...they are compliant with the BON/State Monitoring Program and the Court Program. This is what happened to me and it's what happens most commonly when nurses are charged.

I never said I didn't do it. I didn't remove extra medication or take anything away from my patients. I did, however, take home medication that should've been wasted. I have admitted to that, reported to the BON, and taken all the "right" steps in order to improve myself. I am happy to enter a monitoring program if it means I can still provide for my kids and I'm able to keep the license I worked my butt off for. 
I did wrong and I got caught. It sucks but I'm also glad it happened because I was in a quick downward spiral. I am terrified of being criminally charged, although I'm glad to hear it worked out in the end for you. 

DuckyGirl06 said:

I never said I didn't do it. I didn't remove extra medication or take anything away from my patients. I did, however, take home medication that should've been wasted. I have admitted to that, reported to the BON, and taken all the "right" steps in order to improve myself. I am happy to enter a monitoring program if it means I can still provide for my kids and I'm able to keep the license I worked my butt off for. 
I did wrong and I got caught. It sucks but I'm also glad it happened because I was in a quick downward spiral. I am terrified of being criminally charged, although I'm glad to hear it worked out in the end for you. 

I understand.  You diverted the waste.  Very unlikely you will be charged for diverting the waist.  The only exception is if you falsely labeled the waste, for example, you labeled saline as the drug you took home and wasted that saline with another nurse and the other nurse thought it was the actual drug you had in your pocket.  If you admitted to that, you STILL will not likely be charged because a prosecutor would literally want to see the medications proving it is in fact, saline, in hand.  Technically if you did the above, it's a felony.  What you did was MILD compared to most nurses who divert.  The one's that are more likely to get charged are...

1.  The falsified the chart for narcotics that the patient didn't receive.

2.  They took out the medication and placed saline back into the vial and re-sealed it.

3.  They took the narcotic and injected it or put it in their pocket and placed saline in a syringe and the syringe was labeled as the narcotic and it's wasted with another nurse who doesn't thinks she is wasting the narcotic with you AND your workplace has the syringe with saline in it.  If any of these 3 apply, a nurse is more likely to be charged COMPARED TO a nurse who simply took the left over medication home and didn't waste anything and or didn't falsely waste anything and didn't falsify the chart.  

You are fine.  You will not be charged.  In the absolutely very, very rare event that you were criminally charged and if you are criminally charged, it will be for Theft of the narcotic, but in your case which would be very, very rare to be charged, you will still be fine.  There are programs in every state for nurse and pharmacists and physicians who have an SUD and divert in some form or fashion and these programs give these people a one time opportunity to go through a court ordered treatment program in addition to their nurse-monitoring program and after approximately 6 months (varies by state) the charges are dropped and you have no criminal record.

Who are the people that actually go to jail?  For example, the nurse gets charged and they are not allowed to enter a court treatment program and they actually end up serving prison time?  These are people who take 5 or 10 vials of Fentanyl, withdrawal it carefully, then inject saline back into the vial, and carefully reseal it, which that choice can then effect 5 or 8 different patients in one shift.  And, this nurse does this act for weeks on end thus, possibly effecting well over 100 patients.  These are the nurses that actually do time.  And of course, the obvious.....a nurse who is literally selling the narcotics outside of work for profit.  That's prison time. If you read articles on nurses who actually go to prison, 99% of them will fall into one of the 2 scenarios above. 

You aren't going to be charged.  You will be fine.  And again, if that incredibly low chance happens and you are charged, you will actually STILL be fine and it will be over with in 6 months regarding the criminal side of things and in the past and you coming out with no record.  It's the 5 year monitoring agreement and dealing with the BON that is/has been FAR more stressful for me than the criminal stuff.  Believe it or not, that was easy compared to dealing with the BON and this 5 year fiasco.

I am realizing that every situation and person is different!! I'm currently facing another roadblock. I'm a nurse practitioner, just got reinstated in October 2024. I decided to enroll in KARE via agreed order. I have over 18mos clean. I never did anything in my practice wrong, it was all personal use of substances. So I thought I had that going. However my last time out in the madness I unfortunately caught a charge and on a current pre trial diversion. Bc of that I cannot write controlled substances, which is fine. I don't work at a place that requires that. However, I do work at a place that about 90% of billable services is Medicaid (like most healthcare places these days!) and today I just got denied Medicaid reinstatement number 😩😩😩I've cried all day. I've done everything asked of me plus some. Been clean for over 18mos, never had any workplace issues, again all personal. I had to submit written request for more info on denial. Another thing where consequences of my past affect me!! Anyone else have a similar situation?!? 

Here's the concern.  When you are a State Medicaid Individuals Exclusion List, it's very easy to get off of with one key event that they want to see...........the criminal case resolved and active in recovery.  A criminal charge will quickly land Advanced Practice Nurses on the State Exclusion List.  It is very easy to get off of this list (AFTER) the criminal case is resolved and you complete the pre-trial diversion program.  Here's how you do it, and yes, I was in your situation.  Every state and every nurse is different.  Same thing for Hypertension.  It's different in every case for each patient, but there are also similarities across the board with hypertension.  Same applies to nurses who are charged regardless of the state.  Different?  Sure.  But similarities and likelihoods?  Absolutely. 

1.  Ensure you get from the court your official dismissal of charges document upon completion of the court diversion program showing you completed the program and the charges are dropped.  This form is known as the Official Final Disposition of your Criminal Case.  It comes from the court and it shows where your charges are dismissed/case resolved.  This form is the one that on average, takes about 1 month for the court to finalize AFTER you complete the diversion program and this form is the one you will send to the State in your request to be removed from the exclusion list.  

2.  Ensure you have good communication with your monitoring (nurse-monitoring program) case manager since you just enrolled in monitoring.  Tell that person exactly what is going on (if you already haven't) and let him or her know that you will be needing a letter once your court diversion program is complete/charges are dismissed, and you want the letter to say when you enrolled in monitoring and that you are in 100% compliance.  Mail this letter in from your monitoring program case manager along with the Official Final Disposition from the Court showing your case is dismissed/charges are dropped.  3rd item needed is your personal letter literally stating your background, your story, show that you didn't use or have issues at work, but it was personal stuff.  Don't minimize, but simply make it clear no issues were at work and that you have improved your life and are active in recovery.  If you want a slam dunk, get into recovery meetings now, whether AA, NA, Cel. Recovery, Smart Recovery, etc.  Do 2 or 3 of those per week and keep a spreadsheet on meetings attended.  Mail this in to the state with the other documents above. You will be off the Exclusion List in short time once you send in your request for removal.

It's going to be VERY DIFFICULT to get off of the Medicaid Exclusion List Before your criminal case is resolved.  Is it worth a try?  Sure it is.  Give them a call first by phone and try to see your chances.  In the rare likelihood you get off of this list prior to the diversion program completion/criminal charges dropped, you are going to need a solid letter from an addiction provider or at least your case manager showing you have been in recovery for 18 months and sober.  This can be difficult because usually these people want Drug Testing over the last 18 months.  They don't usually simply "take your word for it" or look at the occasional AA or NA meetings over the last 18 months when there is no drug testing to go with the meetings, BUT sometimes an addiction provider will write that letter.  It's worth a shot at least, but very likely that you will not get off that list until the criminal court case stuff is resolved, but you can be sure of this, it's about 100% certain that once the criminal case is over and you complete the pre-trial diversion court program and charges are dismissed, you will get off of the list quickly.

Hope this helps.  Hold on!  You got this.  There is a bright light at the end of the tunnel and you simply need to make it through the court diversion program and as soon as you do, you will get off the list. But again, it's worth giving the folks at the State level (Health Services-Medicaid) a phone call and explain your situation and ask if it's possible to get off of this list prior to the court case being resolved and what they might require. You might be surprised.  How do I know?  Same thing happened to me.  I was charged.

NurseJackie69 said:

Here's the concern.  When you are a State Medicaid Individuals Exclusion List, it's very easy to get off of with one key event that they want to see...........the criminal case resolved and active in recovery.  A criminal charge will quickly land Advanced Practice Nurses on the State Exclusion List.  It is very easy to get off of this list (AFTER) the criminal case is resolved and you complete the pre-trial diversion program.  Here's how you do it, and yes, I was in your situation.  Every state and every nurse is different.  Same thing for Hypertension.  It's different in every case for each patient, but there are also similarities across the board with hypertension.  Same applies to nurses who are charged regardless of the state.  Different?  Sure.  But similarities and likelihoods?  Absolutely. 

1.  Ensure you get from the court your official dismissal of charges document upon completion of the court diversion program showing you completed the program and the charges are dropped.  This form is known as the Official Final Disposition of your Criminal Case.  It comes from the court and it shows where your charges are dismissed/case resolved.  This form is the one that on average, takes about 1 month for the court to finalize AFTER you complete the diversion program and this form is the one you will send to the State in your request to be removed from the exclusion list.  

2.  Ensure you have good communication with your monitoring (nurse-monitoring program) case manager since you just enrolled in monitoring.  Tell that person exactly what is going on (if you already haven't) and let him or her know that you will be needing a letter once your court diversion program is complete/charges are dismissed, and you want the letter to say when you enrolled in monitoring and that you are in 100% compliance.  Mail this letter in from your monitoring program case manager along with the Official Final Disposition from the Court showing your case is dismissed/charges are dropped.  3rd item needed is your personal letter literally stating your background, your story, show that you didn't use or have issues at work, but it was personal stuff.  Don't minimize, but simply make it clear no issues were at work and that you have improved your life and are active in recovery.  If you want a slam dunk, get into recovery meetings now, whether AA, NA, Cel. Recovery, Smart Recovery, etc.  Do 2 or 3 of those per week and keep a spreadsheet on meetings attended.  Mail this in to the state with the other documents above. You will be off the Exclusion List in short time once you send in your request for removal.

It's going to be VERY DIFFICULT to get off of the Medicaid Exclusion List Before your criminal case is resolved.  Is it worth a try?  Sure it is.  Give them a call first by phone and try to see your chances.  In the rare likelihood you get off of this list prior to the diversion program completion/criminal charges dropped, you are going to need a solid letter from an addiction provider or at least your case manager showing you have been in recovery for 18 months and sober.  This can be difficult because usually these people want Drug Testing over the last 18 months.  They don't usually simply "take your word for it" or look at the occasional AA or NA meetings over the last 18 months when there is no drug testing to go with the meetings, BUT sometimes an addiction provider will write that letter.  It's worth a shot at least, but very likely that you will not get off that list until the criminal court case stuff is resolved, but you can be sure of this, it's about 100% certain that once the criminal case is over and you complete the pre-trial diversion court program and charges are dismissed, you will get off of the list quickly.

Hope this helps.  Hold on!  You got this.  There is a bright light at the end of the tunnel and you simply need to make it through the court diversion program and as soon as you do, you will get off the list. But again, it's worth giving the folks at the State level (Health Services-Medicaid) a phone call and explain your situation and ask if it's possible to get off of this list prior to the court case being resolved and what they might require. You might be surprised.  How do I know?  Same thing happened to me.  I was charged.

Well I'm screwed then! Thank you for this info. I'm not off pre trial diversion until 2029!! They are going to file for me to be inactive in April. I'm in total compliance and have done all the other things and have been drug testing with all passed test since October 2023! I'm on administrative supervision which means I don't even see my Po bc I've been compliant. Not sure k can beat this but I'm sure as hell going to try. I'm going to contact my PO and my attorney and see if I can file for early dismissal but my plea deal wasn't signed until March 2024 so I don't know if it is possible. Thank you for the info! 

Your best bet right now is gather letters from you PO and case manager and your attorney. The attorneys part needs to say you have been entered into a diversion program and are compliant and have Not been convicted and thst upon completion, your charges will be dropped. The PO officer needs to say you are complaint. Your monitoring case manager needs to say you are in monitoring and active in recovery. Send all of these into the Medicaid/Dept of Health and Human Services and try to get off of that list. There's a chance you can and it's worth taking that chance