Is it okay to slug an oncologist?

Specialties Oncology

Published

My Dad was dx'd w/Colon CA 12/03. He went through 6 months of 5FU and did quite well. A full year after his original dx he perf'ed his viscus, had emergency surgery and it was found that CA is everywhere. On his stomach, two tumors in his liver, throughout his colon, everywhere.

At the time of surgery the oncologist and GI surgeon explained the only thing they could do is more chemo but they were quite clear the best they could hope for was to shrink the tumors on a short term basis. There is no cure here.

Here is my problem, right after telling us the news the oncologist went in and told my Dad that with massive amounts of chemo on a pump in his home he has a 50%-80% chance of a FULL cure.

That's a load, there is no chance for a full cure. My Dad wants to try absolutely anything in an effort to survive this. He's just not ready to go.

I don't want him to destroy whatever quality time he has left with chemo. I've had patients before where the doc wasn't totally honest but never flat out lied like this bozo.

My Dad is calling me asking me for my opinion. I really don't know how to handle this. Some advice from my fellow brothers and sisters would be greatly appreciated.

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Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

Slugging an oncologist might break your hand, and land you in jail or court, and both would keep you from helping to care for and be with your dad.

If this was my dad, i would tell him "Whatever you want to do, i will support your decision. I love you and i'm here for you."

I would also recommend getting a second opinion from another doctor, and if possible, one that's at another facility. Your dad might need to hear some more medical opinions before deciding what he should do.

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I would also recommend getting a second opinion from another doctor, and if possible, one that's at another facility. Your dad might need to hear some more medical opinions before deciding what he should do.

Good Advice, I agree.

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Definitely fire the oncologist, if you dad will allow it, and get a second opinion at another facility.

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I think you should pull that oncologist aside and point blank ask him why on earth he told you one thing and then went and told your dad another. I think you need to say "which is it?" and if he says its what he told you then you need to be up front with your dad and tell him that the oncologist mislead him. Then he can make the decision whether he wants to get an honest oncologist. He deserves to know the truth so he can make INFORMED choices and decide how he wants to spend his time. Its a terrible thing to fill someone with false hope.

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Specializes in forensic psych, corrections.

This is distressing. When I worked onc, I never had the misfortune to work with an oncologist who wasn't open and honest about curative vs palliative measures with his or her patients.

If you think its worth it to speak to the onc, I would do that. Otherwise I would gently encourage your dad to get a second opinion from another oncologist, and see where that takes you.

I wouldn't assault him, though. That's not really helping anybody.

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Sounds as if the onc has also violated some ethical boundaries here -- if you ask him why he would give different stories to you and your father, there's that to consider also.

My best for you and your family, whatever your dad decides to do.

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Specializes in Oncology/Haemetology/HIV.

One point.

Were you present when the oncologist spoke to your Father?

Many parents will deny the severity of their disease to their children/SO/loved ones. They do not want to "hurt" them....despite the fact that we will be more hurt that we were not given the truth of the situation. It can also be a coping mechanism for him.

Another is that patients hear what they want to hear, not necessarily what is said. We tell them that they will be "treated" with X% of "response" by the disease, and they hear "treat" and "response" as cure, when it is not.

If you were present when the oncologist spoke to your father, then you should have confronted him as soon as he left the room. There is no excuse for such unethical behavior.

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Definitely fire the oncologist, if you dad will allow it, and get a second opinion at another facility.

He won't. He totally trusts and believes this guy. I even approached him by saying ... look, we have to be realistic. You can't afford a mistake. What's the harm in getting a 2nd or 3rd or even 4th opinion?

Nope, he won't do it. This guy is gonna "cure" him.

AAAAAAHHHHHH :angryfire

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Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

Might want to consult a social worker?

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I think you should pull that oncologist aside and point blank ask him why on earth he told you one thing and then went and told your dad another. I think you need to say "which is it?" and if he says its what he told you then you need to be up front with your dad and tell him that the oncologist mislead him. Then he can make the decision whether he wants to get an honest oncologist. He deserves to know the truth so he can make INFORMED choices and decide how he wants to spend his time. Its a terrible thing to fill someone with false hope.

My Dad lives in Iowa, I live in Arizona. I've been calling the onc for two weeks now and he isn't returning my calls. His receptionist type person said he can't talk to me, he can only speak with his patient.

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One point.

Were you present when the oncologist spoke to your Father?

Many parents will deny the severity of their disease to their children/SO/loved ones. They do not want to "hurt" them....despite the fact that we will be more hurt that we were not given the truth of the situation. It can also be a coping mechanism for him.

Another is that patients hear what they want to hear, not necessarily what is said. We tell them that they will be "treated" with X% of "response" by the disease, and they hear "treat" and "response" as cure, when it is not.

If you were present when the oncologist spoke to your father, then you should have confronted him as soon as he left the room. There is no excuse for such unethical behavior.

You know what? This is exactly what I thought was going on. I thought he either heard what he wanted to hear (he does that lots of times) or he was trying to protect me. I'm a big 'ol daddy's girl in every way.

I was there during his surgery and that is when the oncologist told me, my sis, and the evil stepmother the 'truth'. Several weeks later after my Dad went to this guy's office is when he told my Dad the line about a 50% - 80% chance of a full cure. The evil stepmother was there during both conversations. I asked her if she confronted him on the original conversation and she didn't. I asked why not and she said she didn't know what to say.

This is a difficult time for her as well and I know that. She doesn't have a lot of medical knowledge and I know she finds all the things going on now to be confusing. I also know she doesn't want to bust my Dad's bubble either. If he loses all hope he won't last long.

You know, it's hard enough getting used to the idea of everything that is happening. This doctor is just making a bad situation worse.

It's odd, I always watched my patient's with their family members and realized I might be in the same boat someday. But I can't really say I ever expected to relate to them to this degree. When it comes to family members, illnesses, death... I've had it pretty darn easy.

Three months ago my Dad was cutting down trees, building things, doing his woodworking, traveling, the works. Now he has a walker and poops in a bag. It's just happening so fast, too fast, you know?

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