Members are discussing negotiating salaries as new Nurse Practitioners, the importance of building relationships with physicians, the value of sharing salary information for negotiation, the impact of pursuing a Doctor of Nursing Practice degree on earning potential, and the reputation of certain online schools for nurse practitioner programs. Additionally, members are seeking advice on transitioning to a career as an NP, the differences between working in a community clinic versus a hospital, and the potential for career advancement in the field.
My reasons why I question going for a Nurse Practitioner license.
Working with some seasoned nurses in the ER over the last couple of years, they make more than starting NP's do.
Two doctors and a nurse who did recruit and hiring for a couple of years all stated that it was not worth it.
If I don't jump on the bandwagon right away...the rumors of the dreaded 2015 DNP may come true
The Drawbacks:
Increased liability without enough pay
Overworked and underpaid for their work. In our ER, the PA's do most of the work while the physicians kick back
PA's are preferred in hospital settings (which is my major interest...though I'm sure an office setting will be great later in life)
Again...financial. They did not agree that 2.5 years of schooling was worth a mediocre increase in salary (even long term). They collectively felt that working a 4th 12hr shift each week was better than spending another 2.5 years an lots of money for an NP degree.
The Positives:
Increased autonomy
I can do a full time NP program and still work
There are 2 great NP programs near me (TWU and UTA)
I believe I can get in without to much hassle
In state tuition is affordable
Self satisfaction
I understand that financial compensation is not all there is to a job though it is a necessity. Increased autonomy is very important to me and the main reason I would like an advanced practice degree. Med school would be great, but being hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt and taking 4 years off is not appealing to me.
So to the current NP's...
Would you NOT get your degree if you had to do it again?
Was it worth it more than just personal satisfaction?
Hm but negotiating is hard isn't it? I would have to basically push Doctor a little bit and if some new grad gets an interview and just says "yes" to everything and accepts 80k (which I am assuming most of them would) this would diminish my earning potentials and being hired. Do NPs do this? Or they start at 80-90k then realize they are making the practice a good amount of money with no complaints, then negotiate?
Good points. In my experience attempting to get a sizable increase after you have agreed to a rate is difficult even for a valued employee.
I don't negotiate on salary. In all cases I have been asked what my salary requirement is and I tell them. If they attempt to counter I respectfully decline and in most cases they will match my rate. If they want supporting documents I provide them with copies of my contracts or pay stubs. I have shared my pay rate information with other NPs I know who are attempting to justify the current going rate which is rather high in this area. I figure if they want me this is what it will cost them and I have had no shortage of jobs or offers.
Haha I see, well, as a first "job" NP do you think its a good idea just to accept what comes up until more experience rolls in? or shoot high? haha, I work in a retirement community in Florida I believe this biggest and most popular one in Florida so there is tons of jobs relating to healthcare, I just want to be prepared because I am planning on continuing school as soon as I get my RN and ill be working will getting my BSN as I am working and so on, so I want to be prepared... do you think actually talking to a Doctor/practice owner about it would provide more information? Working with the Doctor I have been open to much more personal relationships with Doctors due to dinners together etc.
Haha I see, well, as a first "job" NP do you think its a good idea just to accept what comes up until more experience rolls in? or shoot high? haha, I work in a retirement community in Florida I believe this biggest and most popular one in Florida so there is tons of jobs relating to healthcare, I just want to be prepared because I am planning on continuing school as soon as I get my RN and ill be working will getting my BSN as I am working and so on, so I want to be prepared... do you think actually talking to a Doctor/practice owner about it would provide more information? Working with the Doctor I have been open to much more personal relationships with Doctors due to dinners together etc.
If you aren't a nurse yet I'd hold off on wasting too much of anyone's time because opportunities will change although when you start working as a nurse it is a great time to start building relationships with physicians and NPs. In my experience NPs who are willing to share their salaries will be the best source for negotiating in a specific area.
Negotiating is only hard if you don't educate yourself beforehand. That's why I take a big interest in reimbursement. When I was a hospital RN, I was absolutely oblivious to what things cost, and how much insurance would reimburse. When I was an NP student I would find the office/account manager in each place I did clinicals and familiarize myself with the reimbursement data for basic visits, procedures like suturing, etc.
If you're in a market where just getting your foot in the door for your first job as an NP is important, I don't blame anyone for accepting a lower offer. I personally am in a market with a lot of demand and turned down several offers before I found the right one, and was able to because I knew what I would be bringing to the table.
Hm but negotiating is hard isn't it? I would have to basically push Doctor a little bit and if some new grad gets an interview and just says "yes" to everything and accepts 80k (which I am assuming most of them would) this would diminish my earning potentials and being hired. Do NPs do this? Or they start at 80-90k then realize they are making the practice a good amount of money with no complaints, then negotiate?
You absolutely should negotiate. Don't worry about missing a job because you negotiated up front, it rarely happens, and when it does it is likely not a place where you want to work. They are investing in you. If they are looking for the cheapest candidate, is that really the environment you want to work in?
NPs generate considerable revenue for their practices. Be aware what you can/will generate prior to negotiating.
It is hit or miss and depends on a lot. While employers cannot state it directly, being a male greatly increases your chance of getting a job in my area. It is very sexist but that is how it is where I live. It also depends where you go to school and the connections you have. i got my job from being friends with a guy that did clinicals with a group of doctors and he put a good word in for me. We both have jobs paying about 155k at this time for 45 hours per week and we don't have to kill ourselves continually (some nights are crazy but that is anywhere). We work inpatient hospital nightshift and also do independent contracting for the psych center providing medical care to inpatient psych patients.
A few girls in the ER who graduated from a not so reputable school or at least our group will not hire from anybody from that school, I have no personal experience from there so I am just stating what the biggest medical group in town states, and a few of those students are still looking for jobs. It was an online school, I won't name it but it is mentioned on this forum a lot and starts with F and ends in rontier. This is just what the docs say, they have had a bad experience with many students from this fully online school.
So there are many factors that come into play. you just have to make sure most of them are in your favor.
I am currently finishing my BSN at Missouri State University and plan to continue on to the DNP program. It is good to hear that it is well worth it. Any of you out there doing the DNP currently? I would love to hear your opinions.....
I'm not sure if you meant this post to show up in this string or not. But in regards to "is it worth it?" ...then I don't know of anyone who got a DNP who got a substantial raise. I know for a fact I make more than at least two DNPs in my area.
I'm researching programs for my Masters in midwifery and I'm curious what you've heard in the professional community about Frontier. What don't the docs like about the NP's that come from there? (you may be saving me from a huge mistake, so please don't hold back!)
A few girls in the ER who graduated from a not so reputable school or at least our group will not hire from anybody from that school, I have no personal experience from there so I am just stating what the biggest medical group in town states, and a few of those students are still looking for jobs. It was an online school, I won't name it but it is mentioned on this forum a lot and starts with F and ends in rontier. This is just what the docs say, they have had a bad experience with many students from this fully online school.
I'm researching midwifery/NP programs and am looking at Frontier. What exactly have you heard that is negative about the program/graduates? You may be saving me from a huge mistake, so please don't hesitate to be frank.
I personally don't know myself, but the docs that own our group won't hire them due to previously poor experience.How true that may or may not be it still is important since they do the hiring. We are a small group though also.
I personally don't know myself, but the docs that own our group won't hire them due to previously poor experience.How true that may or may not be it still is important since they do the hiring. We are a small group though also.
Hmmm... difficult to make any real assessments without anything more specific to consider. Thank you for the info, though!
Jules A, MSN
8,864 Posts
Good points. In my experience attempting to get a sizable increase after you have agreed to a rate is difficult even for a valued employee.
I don't negotiate on salary. In all cases I have been asked what my salary requirement is and I tell them. If they attempt to counter I respectfully decline and in most cases they will match my rate. If they want supporting documents I provide them with copies of my contracts or pay stubs. I have shared my pay rate information with other NPs I know who are attempting to justify the current going rate which is rather high in this area. I figure if they want me this is what it will cost them and I have had no shortage of jobs or offers.