How would you have handled this????

Nurses General Nursing

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I had something happen to me today that has never happened to me in my 21 years of nursing and I pray that even though I was very angry inside that I handled it right. Please note right up front this is not meant to start a war here or another LPN vs. RN debate. Actually I feel many of you RN's will be a little ticked off too. For those of you that don't know me, I work LTC, by my choice, did hospital and it wasn't what made me happy. I have been a charge nurse for 11 years so far. I have this very dear and wonderful couple on my unit. I love them dearly and we have wonderful talks and are very close. Their daughter came to visit them today and the following happened. When I entered the room to give them their meds, the male resident introduced me to his family as the charge nurse. He also told me that his daughter was a nurse. With no further converstaion, she informed me that she felt no one below a BSN should be allowed to be a nurse for they just weren't qualified nor did they have the knowledge needed to properly care for a resident. I assume since I was introduced as the charge nurse, she thought I was an RN. Then she asked what my level of degee was??? I told her I was an LPN. She said, "Well that just isn't right!" To say I was taken aback is an understatement. Inside I started getting very angry. That is a hell of a statement to make. Not all RN's hold a BSN, they are very much worth something but after she found out I was ONLY an LPN, she did her best to try and get me to mouth off to her. I told her the following statement. I said, "In this facility, my duties are the same as the RN's. All of our current house supervisors are LPN's and the only RN in authority is our DON, which we all answer to equally, RN and LPN's alike. I am considered the charge nurse on this unit, even when an RN is working the other end. I do what is in my job description and I have never had a complaint lodged against me. I stated that I fully agreed that if I were working in a hospital, I would not hold the title I hold here, but this is my chosen field and I enjoy what I do. I am sorry if you do not feel I am qualified to do this job and I would be more than happy to call my DON for you to speak with if it would make you feel better." She then asked, "Well why don't you get your RN degree?" I answered frankly, "Because I plan to work here for some time to come, I am happy with what I do and I have no desire to do so." She really seemed to be trying to start an out and out arguement with me. I smiked at her, said it was nice meeting you, told my residents I'd be back later and to have a nice visit. Then I went into the bathroom and seethed almost to the point of crying, which is what I do when I get mad, but then I said....NOPE!!!!! ain't gonna do it and went on with my job. I have to be honest and tell you there was a million things I wanted to say to her, specifically that if her parents coded, their life would be in MY hands, and that we didn't even have an RN on our shift with her BSN but I tried very hard to smile, keep my mouth shut and just get out of there. Anyhow, later, I went back to their room to give them more meds. The male resident took my hands, with tears in his eyes and said, "Honey, I'd give anything if my daughter hadn't spoken to you like that. You are a wonderful nurse and I feel very blessed that my life is in your hands because I see the kind of nurse you are and I trust you completely." I told him not to worry about it, that she is very much entitled to her opinion and told him he would always be my buddy, nothing would change that." (We call each other Buddy) I have been posting here for quite some time and I have to say that while a few RN's may hve problems with LPN's in certain settings, none of you have ever spoken like this and I just want to know, how would you have handled it? I honestly don't know if I did the right thing or not. She did not shake my confidence in my ability, if that was her goal, but for the life of me, I cannot understand why a complete stranger would light into me like that, for no reason. Maybe if there had been some sort of converstaion leading up to it but I swear to you, all that was said between us was what I have told you. I am still floored by this and I am honest when I say, she made me angry, which is pretty darned hard to do. I would really appreciate some feedback on this to help me get a grip on my emotions.

Duckei,

I hit the submit reply button too soon oh well, I'm an LPN and I just want to tell you what one of my nursing instructors told our class. whether you have your masters, bachlors, Rn, a nurse ,is a nurse, is a nurse, is a nurse. You responded very well to her, I don't know what I would of said but it probably wouldn't of been good. Sometimes aren't family members the bes?!!!

I'd like to report the latest encounter with this nurse to you all. I feel very good about the way it went. When Mom and Dad moved into our facility, she took custody of their little dog for them. I am an animal lover and have never met a critter that I didn't like. One day I went in to give my residents their pills and she was there with the little dog. I noticed she( the dog) was panting, so I went out and found a little bowl and brought her some water. Miss BSN actually smiled at me and said that was a very caring thing to do. My "Buddy" spoke up and said that everything I did was very caring and the look in her eyes actually softened towards me. Maybe she was testing me, I don't know but with the help of that sweet little dog, just maybe the ice is broken and she will have more faith in me and my abilities to care for her parents. I hope so. I don't like hard feelings and I spent much time praying for this to resolve itself. I think God used that little critter to show her a side of me she could relate to somehow. They say God works is mysterious ways!!!! But even if she never really likes me, I'm there for my residents and I will give them the very best I can. You have all been so great, I cannot tell you how much your posts have helped me through this. It probably shows that I'm a real softie and I tend to get my feelings hurt easily. When I do, I usually retreat inside myself but my love for animals brought out that side of me and maybe that's what she needed to see to give me a break. Only time will tell.

Duckie,

You have a tender and loving heart. You had it long before you went to nursing school and you will have it long after you retire from what you love and do so well. Such qualities are God-given and cannot be "bought" by any amount of higher education. When a cup of liquid is jostled it will splash whatever is inside. When you were attacked by this fellow nurse what came out of you was GRACIOUSNESS. Dry your tears...and thank the Lord that you do not carry within you the bitterness and hatred that "splashed" out of her. ((((((A BIG HUG and a PAT ON THE BACK)))))

Specializes in LTC/Peds/ICU/PACU/CDI.

...for you've obivously & quite wisely made the right decision on not reacting to this lady...& i use the term very loosely.

i, too, fear that your patient's daughter had some personal issues going on here.

  • first, i too believe that she had guilty feelings going on here.
  • second, she may feel overwhelmed in caring for both...it's hard enough to care for one elderly person.
  • third, maybe the daughter has no bedside experience what-so-ever & is "out of her element".
  • maybe she's not used to being a caretaker or she's just self-centered as evidenced by the lack of immediately asking for water for the pet dog...i'd bet she had something to drink though.
  • perhaps she was jealous of you because of her parents open esteem & affection towards you...maybe she never got a pat on the back from them regarding her nursing abilities as they probably never seen her in action...or maybe she's daddy's only "little girl" or should i say..."brat".:rolleyes:
  • lastly, maybe she's not even a bsn nurse, diploma nurse, or aas/adn nurse at all...but a nurse impersonator...lol!

as you can see, it's difficult for me to try to understand this woman without me getting unprofessional about it...grrr:( - for this i must appologize!:imbar

Duckie, you handled yourself far better than I would have, like a true lady and a real professional. As Gary said, breeding tells. First of all I would have gotten angry and when I get angry I cry. I hate it because it is difficult to remain professional when you have tears swimming in your eyes and really can't see who you are talking to! So then it is hard to be articulate, as you were. You were able to make your point, stand up for yourself and your profession, and make your "Buddy" feel comfortable about you, and uncomfortable about his own daughter's actions-all with dignity.

I agree with so many of the other posters who said this daughter has other issues-guilt appears to be the biggest. But as others have also said, some people just need to tear others down in order to build themselves up. A fragile ego, insecurity in her role, and guilt all probably played a part in this woman's unkind words. And even though I dislike generalizations, I have run across a few (very few) BSNs who think this way (sorry Susy K, I am NOT generalizing here!). But in all cases, it was the personality of the nurse and not the degree that caused this attitude, They were also the ones that didn't remain long at the bedside, as they felt it was 'beneath them'. I don't care if someone finds that the bedside doesn't work for them, but for God's sake, don't cut down others for whom it does work. Most of us remain at the bedside because we LIKE it there-not because we don't have the means (either intellectual, academic, or financial) to do something else. And as a doggie person myself, I am so happy that this little guy was there to help you & the daughter reach a place where you can begin to respect each other as poeple who have different roles, but common goals-the excellence of care of those 2 beloved residents.

PS: Thank you SKM-NURSIEPOOH. This thread was heartwarming and did me a lot of good. It was wonderful to see how all types of nurses, and even non-nurses came to this LPN's defense with encouraging and kind words. THAT is how our profession should always be-caring and supportive of each other as well as our patients!

Quote from SKM-NURSIEPOOH on another thread about this thread,

"I noticed many replies lending support to Duckie except for some usual key people absent posts replies...which is a loud & clear message in of it self!"

Now I am really confused! What message? I read Duckies post, saw that others supported her and posted early in the thread supportive messages. They said the same things I thought. When this happens I don't usually post because it has already been said. Since when does not posting something to a thread send a message????? I am considering leaving this BB if that is the message that people get when I don't post! I don't have time to keep up with every post and respond to them all. I am ready to leave due to the assumptions that I see all over this BB. It's gotten a little too deep for my waiders.

But, now that I am here I'll go ahead and post this message

to Duckie: You go nurse!!! You can be my nurse anytime! You are obviously an outstanding nurse with excellent communication skills, creativity, intelligence, patence, understanding,...I could go on but lets just say you probably have ALL the ingredients that make a great nurse! You handled the situation like the pro that you are and I only hope that I too would handle similar situations like you did and rise above the nastiness that was thrown you way!

MAYBE WE SHOULD CHANGE THE SAYING TO DOGS ARE A NURSES BEST FRIEND:)

Greetings to all from the Entertainment Capitol of the WORLD! Woo! Woo!

Everything I know and everything I owe is to the CNA's, LPN's, LVN's, technicians, housekeepers, security guards, and anyone else I've ever had contact with in the health field. Each and every one of us, no matter which area, has contributed something to the nurse and his/her evolution into becoming one. Think about it.

Much Love! :D

Specializes in LTC/Peds/ICU/PACU/CDI.
originally posted by huganurse

quote from skm-nursiepooh on another thread about this thread,

"i noticed many replies lending support to duckie except for some usual key people absent posts replies...which is a loud & clear message in of it self!"

now i am really confused! what message? i read duckies post, saw that others supported her and posted early in the thread supportive messages. they said the same things i thought. when this happens i don't usually post because it has already been said. since when does not posting something to a thread send a message????? i am considering leaving this bb if that is the message that people get when i don't post! i don't have time to keep up with every post and respond to them all. i am ready to leave due to the assumptions that i see all over this bb. it's gotten a little too deep for my waiders.

but, now that i am here i'll go ahead and post this message

to duckie: you go nurse!!! you can be my nurse anytime! you are obviously an outstanding nurse with excellent communication skills, creativity, intelligence, patence, understanding,...i could go on but lets just say you probably have all the ingredients that make a great nurse! you handled the situation like the pro that you are and i only hope that i too would handle similar situations like you did and rise above the nastiness that was thrown you way!

...my point on another thread, "proper entry level for nursing....post #105", was that duckie so eloquently expressed her experience as another example of how some people think & or act about lpns. i only cited her thread there as further proof that there are plenty of people whom are against this type of unprofessional behavior...all having various range of speicality. that other thread was becoming a tit-for-tat bashing between certain individuals & was getting out of hand. i just wanted the thread to become civil so that the topic problem could be discussed in a professional manner so that some suggestions could be made towards a solution.:zzzzz

in no way did i intend to bash, disrespect, or insult any supportive posters here. if i left that impression...let me be the first to say...i'm truely sorry!!!:kiss sometimes when i get on my "soap box", i tend to get carried away.:rolleyes::p

again, i would like to thank duckie for sharing & venting her experience...i hope she & her buddy's daughter relationship develop into a real friendship. good luck duckie!

love - moe:kiss

Duckie, Hi!

I too am so sorry that you were talked too and treated so unfairly by "the BSN Daughter alias Nut"... I certainly think you must be a sort of saint for not retaliating... I'm not so sure I would have done half as well...

Obviously, "Daughter/BSN/Nut" was desperate to feel bigger or better in front of Mommy and Daddy... Looks to me like she has alot of issues with Mom and Dad being in a LTC - probably feels really inadequate as a nurse and daughter... and guilty that she's not the one taking care of them - after all I'm sure they took care of her a long time... It's really hard to accept the fact that your parents are aging and can't care for theirselves, anymore...

Good chance too that innocently Mom or Dad raved about you and told her what a good kind, caring, nurse you are and how much they like you - which would most definitely only further fuel her insecure fire...

I think you just happened to be in the wrong place at the wrong time and what she said to you was intended more to make her feel/look better with her parents... Sounds like for some reason she's in so much pain that she's not even considering anyone's feelings but her own - again no excuse for her totally inappropriate behavior and abuse to you...

Again, I think you're right and most probably Mom, Dad, or both let her know that her treatment of you was not acceptable...

so, if she has any kind of a conscience or heart, maybe she'll actually take responsibility and apologize to you ...

I am sure that when she comes to her senses, she will feel even worse than you... maybe she'll apologize to you...

...anyway, just pity her and let it go...

Everytime I see or hear something like this happening I get so angry I want to scream! I'm so sorry you had to go through that but the way you handled yourself was perfect. The daughter apparently has some self-esteem issues to deal with and likes to put herself on a pedestal. When I started out working on a busy med-surg unit as a GN/RN, I was so fortunate to work with a good mixture of RNs, LPNs, CNAs, and orderlies. I hadn't had very good clinical rotations while in school so I even had trouble with some of the basic skills and my nerves made things worse. I learned so much from all of the LPNs, CNAs, and orderlies that I can honestly credit them with getting me through a very tough first year. Many times I went home after my shift and cried myself to sleep. I think that with all of the labels put on people and all of the "letters" that follow some of their names, that we sometimes forget that we have to look past all of that and find out what that person is capable of doing before making such judgements. I've worked with many nurses that had a higher degree than me but in the end the only thing that will impress me is how well they do their job and treat their patients.

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