touched inappropriately by patient - page 2
I suppose this has happened to almost everyone at some time or another, but one of my male patients grabbed my breast tonight--after he did his best to crush my fingers on testing his grip strength. ... Read More
Oct 27, '07Specialty: 8 year(s) of experience in Acute care, Community Med, SANE, ASC ; From: US ; Joined: Apr '06; Posts: 237; Likes: 398I'm not a mom so I don't have that look in my repertoire but I'll work on it. I have seen it used by other nurses to great effect.
Oct 27, '07Joined: Oct '06; Posts: 23; Likes: 2ow, sorry to hear that from you, but a friend of mine was once grabbed his penis with a gay patient...
your not alone with this case....
but you did the right thing, called a security to do our duty even with that incident....
Oct 27, '07Occupation: Freelancing Specialty: 15 year(s) of experience in LTC, Med/Surg, Peds, ICU, Tele ; Joined: Jun '07; Posts: 5,292; Likes: 7,635If the guy was with it, I would press charges, no ifs, ands, or buts. Nurses shouldn't have to put up with humiliating crap like that!
Oct 27, '07Joined: Sep '07; Posts: 594; Likes: 244You do what you have to do. no matter what anyone tells you. if you feel the need to press charges DO IT. dont listten others telling you that yea it was inappropriate, but you shouldnt press charges. no offense to anyone, but that is her choice. I have not been in that situ, but i hope to gosh that i dont automatically knock his face. really, natural instinct, but i dont think it would come to that ina work situ, but you never know till it happens to you.
You do what you need to do! Dont let anyone tell you that you are wrong!
GL! and i am so sorry this had to happen
Oct 27, '07Occupation: LTC RN Specialty: 3 year(s) of experience in LTC ; From: US ; Joined: Jun '05; Posts: 2,120; Likes: 2,144I worked as a CNA on a dementia unit for nearly 3 years and I had to deal with a lot of groping. In most of these cases it was due to dementia and little old men deciding that I was their new girlfriend or wife that died years ago. The thing is even if it happens; it doesn't mean you have to put up with it. For nearly every one of these incidences I wrote up forms to communicate it to higher ups and my co-workers. I also called the charge nurse and told her that under no circumstances would I provide hands on care to these residents without a second aide in the room, preferably male for the rest of the night. Normally co-workers and higher-ups were okay with this.
You have a right to be safe in your work environment. You did a good job calling security.
Oct 27, '07Joined: Dec '06; Posts: 8,249; Likes: 15,451I had a hospice patient smack my backside once. He was a dirty ol' boy but I did not accept this behavior. I told him never to touch me again.
The next day he smacked my backside that hard it made me cry (out of his view though)
I just packed up my stuff, left his house and reported this to my PCC. I then requested not to be sent back there again!
This man's behavior was like this with a few nurses. He was hot for blondes!! Grrrrrrrrrrrrrr
I did report this to his son as well who thought it was pretty funny that his dad 'at that age' could still do things like this. Smart a## I told him I did not appreciate this and would not be going back to see his father.
We ended up sending a big ol' girl out there. She would only have to sit on him to make him behave!!!! LOL
Sorry this happened to you and YES it does make you feel so horrid.. You were violated and that leaves a nasty taste.... Hang in there.
Oct 27, '07Joined: Jun '06; Posts: 7,215; Likes: 7,969Quote from newohiorni knew when i read your title and post there was a discontect, somewhere.....your werent just inappropriately touched, you were genuinely assaulted....an inappropriate touch (to me) would be a pat on the fanny or some such.....not grabbing, which by definition is going to cause harm......good luckI suppose this has happened to almost everyone at some time or another, but one of my male patients grabbed my breast tonight--after he did his best to crush my fingers on testing his grip strength.
If another nurse told me this happened to her I would be furious. Oddly, upon having it happen to me I feel some anger but mostly I feel belittled, degraded and made to feel powerless, which I'm sure was the point. This patient had just arrived on our unit from PACU. The report from PACU was that he was being a jerk there and had been a jerk on the unit he was on prior to surgery but they hadn't had him do anything like this. This patient was totally uncooperative on my exam with the exception of the great glee he took in trying to crush my fingers and fling me while checking his upper extremity strength--even his wife told him not to hurt me after watching the spectacle he put on. After I asked him to logroll so I could see his surgical incision on his back he very deliberately reached out to me and grabbed my breast. I yelled at him and told him not to do that and my tech called security. Once security arrived on the floor he suddenly became cooperative and, as his family put it, was "coming around". He and his family were trying to convince us all he was "confused" from surgery.
I know this is not a huge deal but I'm surprised how much it shook me up and made me feel vulnerable--and I'm 38 years old for cryin' out loud. I've only been a nurse a little over a year and this is the first time I've had anything like this happen. Anybody else feel this way if it's happened to you?
Oct 27, '07Joined: Oct '06; Posts: 823; Likes: 849Quote from newohiornNot a male , but I can speak for my husband (who is currently at work) who is a cardiac ICU nurse. Absolutely would he be right there if he was aware that a female colleague was being assaulted, regardless of whether or not he was in charge that day!!! And he would most certainly tell the jerk off (he's done it many times with inappropriate - for various reasons - pts). And then, he would make sure it got reported (being a witness to the pt's orientation, etc.) and swap assignments with the female nurse who should not have to put up with this kind of behavior - or the perpetrator - for another moment.I do have a question for any males out there who read this. There were 2 male nurses working on the unit (small unit, only 25 rooms and 4 nurses working). Neither of the male nurses came down to the room to see what's going on or stick their head in or just plain make their presence known. I realize it is not your jobs to "be the guy" on the floor and do all the heavy lifting/security/etc., but it struck me as odd. Even when one of my other female nurses has trouble with a patient I usually stick my head in the room just to let the patient know the nurse is not alone and that someone else is watching. I don't think it's a personality problem because I get along well with both of these guys and had been helping both of them earlier in the evening. It almost seemed as if they avoided coming down to the room and I've seen similar reactions to trouble patients in the past. I'm wondering if a guy just wouldn't perceive this as a big enough deal to even bother or do they just want to avoid starting with any "protective" behavior so it doesn't become their "job"? Perhaps there is another explanation--just curious if anyone has any thoughts. Sorry so long.
This is not acceptable, in no way. :angryfire Your supervisor is wrong (however, he didn't actually tell you not to report it. So go ahead, take it up the chain if necessary). Consider criminal charges as well. Your hospital should have a zero tolerance policy of any kind of abuse.
I'm sorry this happened to you. Although I have never been physically assaulted by a pt, I know how horrible it made me feel to be the victim of verbal abuse by patients. This would have to be so much worse
Oct 27, '07Specialty: 8 year(s) of experience in Acute care, Community Med, SANE, ASC ; From: US ; Joined: Apr '06; Posts: 237; Likes: 398Thanks for the reply, DeLana. My husband is a cop so I asked him his thoughts about the guys' responses (or lack there of). He didn't really know what to think one way or the other. The two security guys who came up were really good and stayed and stood over him while I restarted the IV he ripped out in his little fit. They seemed to understand why I wanted them there. The women on the floor were definitely more concerned and in my observations are more protective of each other when someone is being given a hard time. I'm not a little mouse who needs protected but I really am curious about what seems to be avoidance of the situation. I suppose maybe they get tired of being the guy on the unit, but I'll help them out when they need a female to help one of their patients. As I said, I know it's not their job to "protect" me and I know they were busy last night. I wonder if it just seems like such a minor incident to them that it doesn't show up on their radar screen.
P.S. I know much worse things have happened to many, many people at work and in their personal lives. I'm lucky in that I haven't really been treated like this ever before and it gave me a new perspective on how it makes somebody feel. I always wondered why people aren't angry when someone treats them like this--now I know how it made me feel and I can relate a little better. The jerk didn't win--I'm fine--just very surprised by the feelings it created--a valuable lesson I suppose.
Oct 27, '07Joined: Apr '00; Posts: 24,611; Likes: 35,453one time i got aggressively grabbed by an a&o pt.
i was so ticked off.
i leaned over close to his face and whispered, "don't you EVER touch me again or you will find yourself in 2 pt restraints. and i will have you arrested" followed by my scary nurse face.
next time i had to care for him, he just followed me w/his eyes around the room and when i neared his bed, he asked "are you going to hurt me?"
he looked so nervous.
cracked me up.
i'm sorry you had to experience this.
but you know what?
you have more power than you give yourself credit for.
rather than allow yourself to be violated, turn it into HOW DARE HE.
and take the proper steps to ensure this pt knows his behavior will not be tolerated.
i'm quite sure this will not happen again.
Oct 27, '07Occupation: RN Specialty: correctional, psych, ICU, CCU, ER ; Joined: Jun '02; Posts: 620; Likes: 85:angryfire:angryfire:angryfire:angryfire:angryfire :angryfire:angryfire:angryfire
This is sexual battery (243.4 California Penal Code) don't know about the state you live in
Wait, wait...your hubby is a cop and he didn't encourage you to file criminal charges on this clown?? I must have misread the post...sorry, if I did, but I went a little crazy when I read this one...
If ANY patient touched me in a way that was inappropriate, I would file criminal charges on them in a heartbeat. (unless they were 90 and dimented and I was aware of their behavior)
The fact that his wife blew it off screams to me that this is a pattern..she may be a victim of domestic violence, too...wonder if he's inappropriate with kids too, or to any female in public, or he just limits it to nurses, when he can have his behavior 'excused'....
I'm not too thrilled with your charge nurse, either...
As for the male staff on the floor, like it was said before, they take their cues from the charge nurse, BUT, I can tell you without hesitation, had my RN hubby, Doug, been there, things would have been handled differently....he would have become involved and not in a way this clown would have liked...he always protected his female counterparts (just the way he was)
Don't let this bozo make you feel bad, you didn't sign up for this abuse when you got a nursing license. and you're not being paid as his entertainment..they make a LOT more money than we do...
Please let us know....
Oct 27, '07Specialty: 8 year(s) of experience in Acute care, Community Med, SANE, ASC ; From: US ; Joined: Apr '06; Posts: 237; Likes: 398Jail RN,
I would imagine it is sexual battery here in Ohio too but I don't think I
would get anywhere with filing charges when he supposedly didn't know his own family, didn't know where he was or his own name, etc. I don't believe any of his charade for one minute but I have no way to prove he was A&O. He was putting on this act for his wife, two men I believe were his sons, two security officers and two other younger females--maybe daughters or daughters-in-law. This behavior was obviously not shocking to the family because their reaction was very weird. The wife told him to stop but that was about it. The sons didn't say a word. One daughter type person was on my side by the things she said when one family member said something about patients being this confused must be funny for us--yeah, hilarious. The daughter type person said something to the effect of, "I doubt it." One son type person did have an apologetic attitude toward me but the other acted like nothing happened. None of them apologized. The patient finally apologized when I went back in 2 hours later to medicate him--his story at that point was that he didn't remember any of it. If my dad or husband did that to a nurse I would apologize to her profusely and I would also handle my dad or spouse in no uncertain terms.
The PACU nurse even had the anesthesiologist come back to see this jerk while in recovery because he had been refusing to answer questions about orientation, etc. Anesthesia said he was fine and basically said they couldn't fix the fact that he was a jerk.
I'm sure I wouldn't get anywhere with filing charges because the only other person who witnessed it was the wife and, while she clearly admitted he did it, she was also very much on the "oh he's so confused after surgery bandwagon." I've see lots of people confused after surgery--clearly the patient has not because his impression of one wasn't very good.
I appreciate everybody's support--it's helps me process it by talking about it. Thanks.
Oct 27, '07Joined: May '07; Posts: 311; Likes: 291Quote from rita359Criminal charges seems to be going a bit overboard unless this guy doesn't learn from his mistake. Having security show up is good. Incident report is good but probably won't be seen by nursing supervisors unless your hospital works different than mine. Make sure nursing managers at all levels are aware so that any nurse having future problems with pt doesn't get ignored and pt isn't allowed to continue this behavior. Changing his behavior is the goal.
I wonder if you would feel the same if some guy walked up to you on the street and grabbed your breasts?
If the police showed up....representing the security in the OP post....
and that guy calmed down from the presence of the police, would you be okay with not filing charges? If he said he'd learned his lesson and wouldn't do it again?
Personally, I would not be okay with it, in or out of the hospital. My body is mine, not for any strange man to grab as he please.
It's not normal for men to grab women's breasts whether they're in the hospital or on the street. If they show any sign of having A&O they should have charges filed against them. And I believe that from the OP post she showed evidence that he was A&O.