Help re Jehovah's Witness and death

Nurses General Nursing

Published

You are reading page 3 of Help re Jehovah's Witness and death

Jerry1234

9 Posts

This thread raises numerous different issues regarding JWs, so I will not try to address single one, unless someone asks. However, this thread also contains a number of misconceptions and inaccuracies which should not be relied on by a reader. I will briefly address a few of those in an abbreviated fashion, and if someone wants more info, I will try to come back and address such more fully. I will probably even have to use more than one post right now.

First, (in no particular order), Mexarican's comments are completely inaccurate. The general rule is that most courts do intervene when JW Parents attempt to prevent their children from receiving life-saving blood transfusions. In some states, if the child is nearing the legal age of majority, a court may declare a child to be a "mature minor", and allow that child to choose to die rather than receiving the life-saving transfusion. Many, if not most, states have linked this issue with precedents set in abortion cases, and now allow pregnant JWs to refuse transfusions to the detriment of their unborn "fetuses" (aka "children").

Jerry1234

9 Posts

The original poster asked whether JWs believe in cremation, and at least one comment above seemed to indicate that JWs do not, or prefer not, due to their religious beliefs.

Actually, in recent years, more and more older JWs, who do their own funeral/burial planning, are choosing to be cremated. Such is often due to economic reasons. Many older JWs spent their lives in the door-to-door service of the group, preaching that "Armageddon" would occur at any time. Because they never had a career, and never expected to die, they now come to the end of their lives with few economic resources. In years past, for the same reasons, JWs were discouraged from having children, so many older JWs have no children who can help with such expenses.

Actually, the religious beliefs of the JWs are quite in tune with "cremation".

Christians believe that a "person" is composed of a soul/spirit housed in a fleshly body. The soul/spirit are the personality, intellect, and other factors that make a "person" a unique being. The fleshly body is merely the "vehicle" which allows the "person" to live on the earth. The soul/spirit survive death. Some go to "heaven" or "paradise". Some go to "hell". All will later be "resurrected" -- which is the rejoining of the soul/spirit with a "resurrection body" -- just as was Jesus Christ on the third day after His death at Calvary.

However, JWs do NOT believe such. JWs do NOT believe that a "person" has a separate "soul". Instead, JWs believe that the definition of "soul" is "BODY + SPIRIT". That may not sound that different from Christians, except that JWs do NOT define "spirit" as do Christians. JWs do NOT believe that "spirit" is something unique, but rather that "spirit" is nothing more than the "life-force" (sometimes compared to electricity) used to invigorate the "body". The best way to understand the JW belief is to think of a human as an electrical appliance --like a radio. A body without spirit is like a radio without electricity -- useless. Adding spirit to the body equals "soul" -- just like a radio is useless without power.

JWs say they believe in "resurrection", but they do NOT. JWs believe in REPLICATION. Since there is no soul/spirit containing the unique characteristics of a "person" to survive death, JWs simply believe at the "resurrection" that GOD "replicates" their previous "thought patterns", and puts those replicated thought patterns into a replicated body (not perfect, but rather imperfect).

Thus, since JWs do not believe anything about their current "person" (body, nor soul, nor spirit) survives death, they really are not concerned about how their body is treated once they die.

Therefore, CREMATION is acceptable, and often preferred.

Jerry1234

9 Posts

I don't have time right now to fully address why JWs are permitted to accept organ transplants, but not blood transfusions. Just let me say that when the Watchtower Society outlawed transfusions in 1945, it also prohibited transplants -- for the obvious reason that a living organ also contains the blood of the donor.

However, the transplant prohibition was eventually dropped in either the 1960s or 1970s -- also for obvious reasons.

Will come back.

Specializes in ED.
I can understand there being alot of controvery surrounding certain medical procedures, but blood transfusions...I can't imagine, regardless of religious beliefs, letting a child die over someone so easily fixed.

It is the parents belief (correct me folks if I'm wrong) that if the child recieves blood products they will not enter heaven after the resurrection. The parents in this case are more worried about their childs eternal life with God than the short life they have on earth. I imagine thats a very hard stance to have but if I were in that belief system I would certainly fight hard for what I believe in. I would also fight hard for a pt's rights for their religious freedom in this matter.

Jerry1234

9 Posts

No, that is not correct. First, JWs do not believe they go to heaven, hell, or anywhere else when they die. See my earlier post. They simply believe that a person ceases to exist when they die. Later, at the biblical "resurrection", JWs believe they will be "replicated" (the new person is given the old "thought patterns" in a new body).

JWs consider receiving a transfusion to be a "sin" only if the recipient willingly consents to such. Thus, if a court orders such, there is no "sin" on the part of the JW -- whether the JW is a baby, minor, or even in the few cases where adults were transfused against their will.

A Moderator has told me to stop posting the link to the website which contains the ACTUAL UNITED STATES COURT DECISIONS, so I cannot do that. However, since JW Members are allowed to both post the names and links of their own JW websites, I will assume that I am allowed to at least post the name of the website which contains the ACTUAL COURT DECISIONS, and anyone interested can google for the link:

DIVORCE, BLOOD TRANSFUSIONS, AND OTHER LEGAL ISSUES AFFECTING

CHILDREN OF JEHOVAH'S WITNESSES

These ACTUAL UNITED STATES COURT DECISIONS show that while JW Adults are allowed to die rather than accept a blood transfusion, JW Parents are NOT allowed to make that same decision for their children barring unusual circumstances -- which again can be learned by reading the ACTUAL UNITED STATES COURT DECISIONS.

TXstudentRN

53 Posts

I find all of this really interesting. I JUST read a very intriguing article in Nursing2007 (March issue) called "Can a bloodless surgery program work in the trauma setting?" It explained how one hospital (can't remember where) has implemented a highly successful bloodless surgery center, but that there are still issues regarding trauma. It used an example of a case of a gunshot wound a matter of years ago and how the patient died due to lack of knowledge of conserving blood - they drew ALL labs, didn't give as many fluids, and a bunch of other things like that. Then they had a case of someone today in the trauma setting that lived and explained all the bloodless interventions they use (they have a whole bloodless medicine team with a nurse (or was it NP?) running it), like increasing fluid volume, only drawing crucial labs and using peds blood tubes when doing so, and others of the same nature. It was a really good article - I highly suggest it- I learned a lot!

It also addressed the issue as to what would happen if a minor was in need of a transfusion but the JW parents refused. In there at least it said that law would override the parents' beliefs and the child would get the transfusion. Can't remember the exact rationale but I remember thinking to myself how sticky of a situation that would be.

Anyway, funny that I had just read that. Great thread!

catzy5

1,112 Posts

Like the others said I dont beleive there are burial issues to deal with, its more about the blood transfusions, organ donation ect. If you do a search on google you should be able to find tonnes of info. When I was in school a JW came and talked to our class, and it was quite informative. Blood transfusions are an absolute no, and it has to do with what the bible says, try and find out that info if you can. As far as organ donation, as long as it is bloodless it is up to the individual. Another topic that would be interesting to do for an ethical debate is transfusing in an emergent situation for the child of a JW family, and the family's right to say no. There have been cases where the court has said the child has to have the transfusion and other cases where what the parents say goes. Im sure you will come up with some intersting material.

Cher

I wouldn't advise you to google search as there is alot of misinformation about Jw's out there. if your doing a school project I highly recomend you contact the local kingdom hall, or look up ww.Watchtower.org for official correct information. Google will have mostly misinformation available.

catzy5

1,112 Posts

It is the parents belief (correct me folks if I'm wrong) that if the child recieves blood products they will not enter heaven after the resurrection. The parents in this case are more worried about their childs eternal life with God than the short life they have on earth. I imagine thats a very hard stance to have but if I were in that belief system I would certainly fight hard for what I believe in. I would also fight hard for a pt's rights for their religious freedom in this matter.

Its scary to see anwswers to these questions from people who have no idea or any basis for their reasoning. No offense to people posting trying to add to the conversation but this is the problem that we encounter all the time. Why post answer to someone spreading more misinformation if you don't have the facts?

SharonH, RN

2,144 Posts

Specializes in Med/Surg, Geriatrics.

Actually, in recent years, more and more older JWs, who do their own funeral/burial planning, are choosing to be cremated. Such is often due to economic reasons. Many older JWs spent their lives in the door-to-door service of the group, preaching that "Armageddon" would occur at any time. Because they never had a career, and never expected to die, they now come to the end of their lives with few economic resources. In years past, for the same reasons, JWs were discouraged from having children, so many older JWs have no children who can help with such expenses.

This is very interesting. I was raised a Jehovah's Witness and my mother is still a practicing Witness although I am not. I have never, ever heard of JWs being discouraged from having children. In fact, it has been my experience that the "pioneers" which are the people you are speaking of above often make the decision to become full-time missionaries after making sure that they are financially secure. And the bit about never expecting to die, nuh-uh.

reesern63, RN

267 Posts

It seems like he has an axe to grind, based on previous posts.

+ Add a Comment