forced vaccines

  1. Hi all, wanted to get advice about this situation. My hospital has said it will begin mandating the flu vaccine for all direct care staff next year. I get the vaccine every year, but I know that some people don't and I respect that it is their body, their desicion. Can they really force people to do this?
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    About crissrn27

    Joined: Feb '07; Posts: 1,020; Likes: 341
    newborn nursery
    Specialty: 8 year(s) of experience in nursery, L and D


  3. by   KellNY
    I'm not 100% sure of the legalities, but I can tell you this: If there were not a simple waiver to sign, I would be faxing my resume to more hospitals than I care to list.
  4. by   GooeyRN
    What if you say you have an allergy? I would assume you could claim a religious exemption if you had to. But then you would have to avoid all other vaccines, too.
  5. by   Sabby_NC
    hmmmmm not sure legally they can insist you do this but others would know if this is so.
    my work place offer and encourage employees to take the flu vac. i don't after having one and getting very sick.
    i am 50yrs old and have had x3 three true flu's in my life time. not bad odds i feel. even so after having the flu vac once i believed dying was a good option. lol (i would have been better getting the flu) i was in bed for over a week. i would never have it again.. ewwwwww
    no one would be forcing me to have something i did not want let me say! there are plenty of nursing jobs out there eh?umpiron:
    Last edit by Sabby_NC on Mar 22, '07
  6. by   bopps
    They can't make you , period. Many people refuse them due to health and/or religious reasons. A religious reason doesn't have to be about God per sea, it can be a decision you feel very strongly about for whatever reason.
  7. by   crissrn27
    These were my thoughts, too. But they seem very sure that they will be able to do this, even said it in an offhanded kinda way, during a staff meeting. I know alot of people feel very strongly about vaccines, and I can't imagine "making" someone put something in their bodies they don't want to.
  8. by   KellNY
    Just wanted to throw it out there that a religious exemption is not the easiest thing to obtain, especially if you've been vaxed in the past or are not against getting other types of vaxes.

    It's not just a "Well, sorry, I'm religiously exempt". There are forms that have to be filled out, explanations of *specific* religious backing, and this has to be approved and sometimes lawyers must be involved. It can get quite messy.

    ...which is why it bothered me so much on the Gardisil vax thread. There were so many people saying "Well, for those who are so against it, they can just get an exemption, so really it's not mandatory".

    Not to take out my frustrations on you, bopps.
  9. by   Batman24
    I'm allergic to eggs so I would never be able to get one. My mother is a nurse and she nor my brothers and I ever had one.

    I don't think this is something they can legally enforce. I would think they would know this, but perhaps are trying to strong arm employees into being afraid to reject it. I would refuse and offer to sign a waiver.
  10. by   TiffyRN
    So being the stubborn person I am I have to ask; what's the penalty? I read in your other thread about this that employees faced penalties if they called in sick with the flu when they hadn't had a vaccination that season. How do you enforce that? Do they do viral cultures on every non-compliant person with sniffles? (doubt that knowing how everywhere I've worked is too cheap to spring for that). How else would they know if you had the flu vs. a bad cold, pharyngitis, or a great variety of diseases that are always preceded by "flu-like symptoms". Or are they having a mass firing at the hospital on Nov. 1st if not vaccinated?

    Having said that; I support the idea that nurses should be vaccinated for flu; but I HATE to be forced to do anything.
  11. by   zacarias
    That happened at a hospital where I used to live. The union came to the rescue of nurses and this was overturned and they didn't HAVE to get the vaccine. I love WA state.
  12. by   CRNI-ICU20
    Under Federal Code 46, you cannot be forced to participate in any kind of medical procedure, test, research study, or mass vaccination. This law supercedes any hospital policy. They cannot force you to take a vaccine.
    The wording of the federal code in a nutshell speaks directly to any entity private or public that would attempt to force any medical procedure or any other medically related thing on any individual. This code was put in place as an out come of the Nuremberg Trials, which was a crimes against humanity trial against the Nazi's who did unspeakable medical experiments on humans in Europe. The federal code doesn't just apply to research applies to any and all attempts to force a group of people or person to accept medical treatment against their will...IT IS ILLEGAL.
    Unless your hospital would like their federal funds and medicare payments to be snatched right out from under them, I would suggest they re-think this idiot decision.
    You also might request that they provide you with FULL disclosure of the vaccine they expect you to take...because that is federal law as well...complete informed consent...
    You might ask them to deliver to you IN WRITING , the actual efficacy rating of the drug they plan on administering; the complete side effects; the long term effects; the other ingredients in the vaccine, ie thimerisol (mercury) and what are the side effects of that....
    You might want to hold them accountable: ie, if you should develope a bad reaction to the flu vaccine, ie Guillian Barre' will they be taking responsibility for your house payment and other bills until you are healed, if and when you do heal???
    Believe me....they will back off once they know that you know!
    Forcing people to have medical treatment against their will is morally wrong...ethically wrong....and should make us all shudder.....
    What if you are immunocompromised, and should not have a vaccine?
    Are you then on someone's list somewhere?
    I am surprised they are willing to take the risk of lawsuit over this!
    What's next? Forced birth control?
    There is no evidenced based study to prove that the vaccine even provides immunity....the companys' own case study proves that at best a 28% immunity for only the strains vaccinated nearly every population where mass vaccination occurs, people will still get the flu....and will still have three to five days of misery...
    You may want to demand full disclosure before rolling up your sleeve...
    FYI, the aluminum catalyst in flu vaccines have been linked to increased incidence of Alzheimer's.....if you want the case study....done by an independent research group, I would be glad to get that for you...
  13. by   crissrn27
    Thanks, CRNI, its great to have something I can print and take to my NM, maybe they will think twice about this after reading the code. We do have lots of federal funding, so this will scare them As for more serious matters, I will be researching this much more thoughly in the future before just getting the vax next year.