Are CNA's considered "Nurses"?

Nurses General Nursing

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I am a new nurse but was a CNA for 15 years before going to school. I was never referred to as a nurse when I was a CNA. I recently went to work in a Doc office where the CNA refers to herself as a Nurse and all of the office personelle refer to her as a nurse. She does everything that I do. I was suprised at this. I have since found that many Doc offices utilize CNA's as nurses. Is this a new thing? I don't want to sound caddy but it just kind of seems like my blood, sweat and tears I put into Nursing school was for nothing if a CNA can do my job. Please don't think this is a smack to CNA's because I have much respect for them as I was one myself for so many years. I would just like to hear some opinions.

students practice under their INSTRUCTORS' licenses all the time. And RN's supervise these people, so by this virtue, some are "acting under the umbrella" of THEIR licensure, as well. But this does not make students or CNA's NURSES!!!! The State BON's have plenty to say on this.

A nursing license is not required to take VS. It is not needed to draw blood. It is not needed to ask a pt what their complaint is. It is not needed to hand info booklets to the pt. It is not needed to communicate instructions from the MD to the pt.

Many Drs offices utilize MAs and CNAs to perform much the same duties as the nurses on staff.

Again, the only possible illegal thing going on is IF she presented herself as a licensed nurse when she was hired.

Look at it this way. If the office staff included an MD and RN and an LPN and both the RN and LPN took their assignment from the MD, the RN is in no way responsible for the actions of the LPN. Simply being in the same place at the same time does not make the RN the responsible staff member. Agreed? That's right, so you should agree.

Now, if the CNA and the LPN each take their assignment from the MD, then the LPN is in no way responsible for the CNA.

Ya'll have to get over the scope of practice thing. There are a lot of ways it can be read and a lot of ways it can be followed and still be within the law.

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No, CNAs are not nurses. But I like them anyway.

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Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.
You are right...just like the N in CNA....and the N in NA....and like the N in NT....a CNA and a LPN just doesn't cut it anymore; get over it....feel slighted? that's on you...get used to it :stone

There a difference between certified nursING assistant and a licensed practical NURSE.

And no i DON'T feel slighted, just if you have that kind of attitude, don't be surprised at the reactions you get from the people that you act like aren't worth your time just because they're not an RN. If you want respected, you have to act like you're worthy of it. But treating (and talking to) people like they're dirt beneath your feet isn't the way to go.

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You can' t be serious! So, basically anyone who is not an RN is beneath you?

Wow, your attitude seems as though you've never worked in a busy hospital or nursing home. Or maybe you have.

I would love to see how well you handle 7 pts that need total care, assessments and meds all by your lonesome........

Your arguement DOESN'T FLY with me............... but thats MY OPINION.. Just like you have your own......

(tryin' to understand your theory :uhoh21: )

TO THE OP:

Maybe you should ask the doc for a clarification of her role.

this has nothing to do with the post but, you are a cutie!

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This kind of drove me nuts at my doctor's office. There was an MA who passed herself off an an RN. She was always referred to as Dr. Soandso's nurse. She wasn't even a CNA and she didn't make one attempt to correct them. I mean, she was really great and all, my doc could function w/o her (my doc said that herself :)), but I don't think it was right for an MA to be passing herself off as a nurse.

No, I'm not saying that MA's are a lesser form of anything. This gal was so good, that everyone just assumed that she was a nurse.

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OK maybe i am way off here, but what about MA's they work in the same capacity as a nurse....in an office! before becoming a nurse thats what i did as well as working for a lab.....my role in the dr's office didnt change. just wanted to throw that out there. and as for the CNA saying she is a nurse well ok dont do that....but, some state like the one i live in an work next too, they have CNA's passing meds and doing charts and yes even the narcotics! they take a class so that can be kinda confusing for pt's espically the older population. i'm not making excuses for her just saying that sometimes the little old ladies just dont get it......

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i guess what i don't understand is why don't you just say what you are? if you're an ma, then state you're an ma. it doesn't take away from one's abilities but it's just totally wrong to say you're a nurse when you are not licensed to be one.

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Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

"Licensed" is the key, be it a practical nurse, or a registered nurse.

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I don't think the BON recognizes practicing under someone else's license :) Good heavens, if they did, we might all be doing it! I know I would have preferred not to have to pay for nursing school!

She is not a nurse and should not be doing nursing duties... to me, that is like me getting a surgeon to show me how to remove a gall bladder, then I can do it under his license, and tell the patients to call me Doctor....

I encourage you to explore your options on this...I also would be wondering what the legal ramifications were for me working in this office, knowing this CNA is practicing outside the scope of her certification. You're the nurse... are you liable for her mistakes since you know she is practicing outside her certification? Are you considered in any way her "supervisor"? I think you are in dangerous legal waters...

Actually no, the CNA is really superior to me in the eyes of the management there. They consult her on all nursing questions without giving me a second thought.

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Specializes in CICu, ICU, med-surg.
students practice under their INSTRUCTORS' licenses all the time. And RN's supervise these people, so by this virtue, some are "acting under the umbrella" of THEIR licensure, as well. But this does not make students or CNA's NURSES!!!! The State BON's have plenty to say on this.

We talked about this issue pretty extensively in a class I took. The belief that nursing students practice under their instructors license is a big misconception. Only the person who is awarded the license may practice on it. Nursing students work under an exception to the nursing practice act, meaning they are allowed to practice without a license, at least while they are in school. Students are held accountable for everything they do, that's why so many schools require their students to purchase .

There are several cases where students have been sued for malpractice and lost, because they didn't do what they should have. It wasn't the instructor's fault or the floor nurse's, it was the student and they were held accountable!

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Hate to burst your one-dimensional bubble, but an LPN is a nurse, that's kinda what the N stands for. :) And being an LPN does not make me some sort of "poorly prepared wanna be". I took the course i took because it offered way more classroom time, and almost 3 times the clinical time, plus a lot of my classes will transfer to whereever i choose to go to school next.

And unless you want to pay for all the Licensed Practical Nurses to go back to school for further education, then you're going to have to get used to it. Licensed Practical Nurses are needed and they are valuable. They may not be able to work everywhere, but if they are happy with where they are, more power to them.

As for "respect" (ironic that you used that word after being so insulting), it makes it way more difficult to earn the respect when someone already has the mentality that you're the dirt beneath their feet all because you're not an RN. But then again, if someone is that insulting to those who do not have the same nursing education, does it REALLY matter whether i'd get their respect, since they hold me in such little regard for being a CNA and then an LPN. Is it worth it fighting for the respect as a "poorly prepared wanna be"? No it's not. Life's too short to waste on supposedly 'fellow' nurses who are so disrespectful to others in healthcare.

i have to agree there. there is plenty of room for all the "wannabes". i can't believe someone said that. i worked my but off for my lvn license and it gave me the basis for what i know as an rn. i believe every one should start as low man on the totem pole from a pca tech then lvn then rn then everyone would be equal at some point.

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Specializes in 5 yrs OR, ASU Pre-Op 2 yr. ER.

I think what amazes me the most is how some people have this mentality that "this should be the educational requirement for this" or whatever, and how IRONIC that it ALSO happens to be the SAME education that THEY have!!! lol

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