Frustrated and still angry!

fergus51 · Feb 13, 2006

You could just say the first job wasn't a good fit because both you and your manager felt you needed a longer orientation than they could provide. For #2 you could say your position was eliminated if that is really what happened and you know your manager would back you up on that, but it doesn't sound like it from your description.

This though:

4) She said I had a full month of orientation. I actually had 12days!!

12 shifts is considered a full month if you work 12 hour shifts. 3 a week for four weeks = one month. I realize that's really only 28 days, but I can't imagine anyone being that picky.

kwagner_51 · Feb 13, 2006

QUOTE: 12 shifts is considered a full month if you work 12 hour shifts. 3 a week for four weeks = one month. I realize that's really only 28 days, but I can't imagine anyone being that picky

QUOTE

In light of the previous experience, I did not think that 12 hr shifts, with up to 28 patients, for 12 days was enough! They didn't tell me that I was on my own. I noticed it when I saw that no one was scheduled to work with me!!

My major concern now is: What do I put in my resume to impress?

I have a total of 18 days experience as an RN.

This is what my resume says in part:[right now]

Objective: To obtain a Registered Nursin position

Employment: ***Hospital 07/11/05 to 10/10/05

Title: Nurse extern/Grad Nurse

Duties: Answering call lights, accuchecks, helping to transfer patients from bed to bathroom

Reason for leaving: No RN training provided

Employment: ***LTC 10/18/05-12/06/05

Title: Charge Nurse

Duties: Hang IV's, give IV antibiotics, supervise 4 CNA's, med pass, assessment, charting

Reason for leaving: Too many patients not enough experience

Employment: Independent Paper Carrier

Title: Paper Route driver

Duties: Billing, maintaining vehicles

Reason for leaving: Vehicle repairs became too expensive and I started Nursing school

From 1986-present stay at home Mom.

Of course education is in there too.

After reading my resume, would you hire me?

Thanks!!

____________________

In His grace,

Karen

Failure is NOT an option!!

BeenThereDoneThat74, MSN, RN · Feb 13, 2006

you know, i'm not the best when it comes to being diplomatic, so having said that: in response to the firsrt job...well, they fired me b/c i couldn't live up to their standards (their standards obviously being that a new nurse does not need to be oriented). unbelievable. they really felt a job as a nursing assistant (which is basically what your description of duties sounds like) for 3 months was sufficient orientation for a nurse. and how did you 'fail' in 'service excellence'? b/c you refused an unreasonable assignment?

this prob. goes without saying (and maybe won't make you feel better right now), but that termination was a blessing in disguise).

as for the second job, do you know for sure your position was eliminated? you sy you think the reasons were as listed above, were you told this. we fired you b/c..... btw, after a month of orientation as a new grad, i wouldn't expect perfection. i would expect a reevaluation after a month to see if you are ready to be on your own. the glucose thing: you didn't give insulin because (fill in the blank)... i teach my students that you need to be acountable for your actions, and that you have to use your judgement (which apparently you did). did you notify anyone? did you recheck in an hour? the reason i ask these is not to tell you what you should have done, but to tell you what your educator or nm should have explored with you (so you know how to handle these situations). imo you weren't wrong in your actions.

if you are sure that the 2nd termination was as you said, i wouldn't worry too much. i always believe that honesty is the best policy. however you don't want to raise a red flag on your next interview. it's a small world in nursing, esp. if you try another ltc or nh (which i would not advise, you are not going to get the orientation you need). i would try a hospital, with a good reptation, that has a structured orientation. even in ny, everyone knows everyone within specialties. so you have to be careful and diplomatic when you speak of a former job. i would honestly say that i did not get the orientation i felt i needed.

how did you do in nursing school? are there any profs you can get in touch with, maybe to give you an updated reference letter? something that showed your abilities as a student?

try not to let this get you down. you will find your niche, it may not be in ltc.

fergus51 · Feb 13, 2006

QUOTE: 12 shifts is considered a full month if you work 12 hour shifts. 3 a week for four weeks = one month. I realize that's really only 28 days, but I can't imagine anyone being that picky
QUOTE
In light of the previous experience, I did not think that 12 hr shifts, with up to 28 patients, for 12 days was enough! They didn't tell me that I was on my own. I noticed it when I saw that no one was scheduled to work with me!!
My major concern now is: What do I put in my resume to impress?
I have a total of 18 days experience as an RN.
This is what my resume says in part:[right now]
Objective: To obtain a Registered Nursin position
Employment: ***Hospital 07/11/05 to 10/10/05
Title: Nurse extern/Grad Nurse
Duties: Answering call lights, accuchecks, helping to transfer patients from bed to bathroom
Reason for leaving: No RN training provided
Employment: ***LTC 10/18/05-12/06/05
Title: Charge Nurse
Duties: Hang IV's, give IV antibiotics, supervise 4 CNA's, med pass, assessment, charting
Reason for leaving: Too many patients not enough experience
Employment: Independent Paper Carrier
Title: Paper Route driver
Duties: Billing, maintaining vehicles
Reason for leaving: Vehicle repairs became too expensive and I started Nursing school
From 1986-present stay at home Mom.
Of course education is in there too.
After reading my resume, would you hire me?
Thanks!!
____________________
In His grace,
Karen
Failure is NOT an option!!

I understand you don't feel that was enough orientation, but it was a month like your manager said.

Frankly, I wouldn't even put "reason for leaving" down. I've never included that in a resume before. "Too many patients, not enough experience" doesn't sound very good to me. If I had to put it down I would put something about seeking a more extensive new grad orientation. I think it's better to explain those in an interview than on a resume. If you have good references and express a real willingness to work hard for another employer, they could overlook your two previous jobs not working out.

kwagner_51 · Feb 14, 2006

Going back over the reason I was fired from the NH. This is the direct quote from the DON:

Checked POOR JOB PERFORMANCE

Under explaination:

Multiple medication errors involving several residents. Has had a full month of orientation and is still in 90 day facility orientation. It is in the best interest of the residents and facility to terminate this position effective Dec. 16, 2005 or may be immediate if employee so desires. DATED 12/09/05

For your consideration, was I fired or was my position terminated?

I chose to quit on the 6th because she wasn't going to allow me to function as a nurse! She didn't really have a position for me and told me that I had a heart for nursing and that she would give me a good reference.

So, what do you think? Fired or laid off?

Thanks!!

_______________________________

In His Grace,

Karen

Failure is NOT an option!!

elkpark · Feb 14, 2006

So, what do you think? Fired or laid off?

Given the "poor job performance" specification, and the explanation of "multiple medication errors" -- I'm sorry, but they didn't eliminate your position, you were fired. (It's a bad sign when they say that it's okay, you don't have to work a notice if you don't want to ...)

I agree with Fergus; I've never seen a resume' that included (volunteered) reasons why the person left previous jobs. If a potential employer wants to know that, s/he can ask you.

I don't think, at this point, that there really is anything you can say to "impress" a potential employer. You don't have an established work history in nursing that might counterbalance your two recent experiences and anything negative that your previous employers might say about you (although it's in your favor that employers are v. reluctant nowadays to say anything negative about anyone; they mostly just verify employment & separation dates and whether the person is eligible for rehire, without getting into specifics). I think your best bet is to be honest with potential employers about your investment in and commitment to nursing, your need for further orientation (can you get into a "new grad" program somewhere? Even if it's a longer commute, it would be worth it), and be prepared to talk about what you have done to work on decreasing your medication errors.

Realistically, you are certainly not the first person to ever have difficulty making the transition from nursing student to practicing nurse. A quick review of this site will turn up plenty of threads about people having a "bumpy" start. The trick is to look realistically at what you need to do to improve your situation & skills, without being too hard on yourself.

My suggestion would be to look for a larger hospital that is accustomed to working with new grads (even if you have to drive a distance), and do your best to convince them that it would be worth it to them to give you a chance for a fresh start. Take any position that they offer you, even if it's not one you particularly want (unfortunately, right now, you're not in a position to be choosy -- but that will change over time :)), even if that means making other arrangements for getting your kids to school, etc. If you really want a career in nursing, you're going to have to take serious steps to reverse the trend of your experience so far. Then, work v. hard to make a go of the next job! Best wishes! :balloons:

BeenThereDoneThat74, MSN, RN · Feb 14, 2006

Has had a full month of orientation and is still in 90 day facility orientation.

I'm not understanding this. Do you mean 90 day probation?

It is in the best interest of the residents and facility to terminate this position effective Dec. 16, 2005 or may be immediate if employee so desires.
For your consideration, was I fired or was my position terminated?

That sounds like you were fired. The question you need to know (which would give you the answer), is are you 'eligible for rehire'?

She didn't really have a position for me and told me that I had a heart for nursing and that she would give me a good reference.

If this is true, then this contradicts what you have in writing (what you stated above).

Also, based on what your resume reads, honestly, I wouldn't give you much consideration (but hell, who am I???). It kinda sounds like sour grapes. You need to eliminate 'reason for leaving', and mention it only if it comes up. If you get an interview, and they ask you to fill out an application, would leave it blank, until it comes up in the interview. Then you need to utilize some very creative responses. I think a good generic response is the 'not the right fit'. This may stimulate more q's on their part, then you need to be as diplomatic and objective as possible.

MrsWampthang, BSN, RN · Feb 14, 2006

I agree, there's no need to put reason for leaving on resume, but be honest in your interview. And don't sound bitter toward your former employers, it doesn't make you sound good in the interview. It sounds like you have had some bad experiences in your new jobs. The next time you go for an interview and it gets to the part where you can ask questions, ask them what their orientation time is, and how does it work. You need a job where you can get your feet grounded before you're expected to take patients. I would suggest going to a hospital med/surg floor with a good orientation program. You will learn so much that will help you when you, later on, want to move to critical care. If the NM you interview with is good, he/she will recognize your potential and know that good nurses are grown, not popped out of a jeanie jar. Good luck!!!! And hang in there!!!!

Pam

kwagner_51 · Feb 14, 2006

Quote: That sounds like you were fired. The question you need to know (which would give you the answer), is are you 'eligible for rehire'? Quote

I asked her if I could come back after I got experience and she said yes!!

That's why I don't think I was fired from the NH.

I finally realize why I am so angry. I have no idea why I was fired from the hospital. I have the list of 'crimes' that I supposedly did, but 99.9% are lies! I don't know how to defend against that!

In the first meeting I was instructed to ask for help if I didn't understand something. At the termination meeting I was written up for asking how to do an assessment on a subdural hematoma patient. I was also written up for bragging about passing boards!

I think my biggest problem is, I saw life through rose colored glasses and got a reality check right between the eyes!!

So how do I remain calm and explain what happened?

Thanks!!

___________________________________

In His Grace,

Karen

Failure is NOT an option!!

elkpark · Feb 14, 2006

I asked her if I could come back after I got experience and she said yes!! That's why I don't think I was fired from the NH.
I finally realize why I am so angry. I have no idea why I was fired from the hospital. I have the list of 'crimes' that I supposedly did, but 99.9% are lies! I don't know how to defend against that!

1) I don't know how much clearer we can all be (without getting ugly/mean, which no one wants to be to you) -- you were fired. No "position" is "eliminated" because of poor performance on the part of the last person to hold the position -- the facility is just trying to be somewhat polite and "tasteful" in the official termination documentation (no point in rubbing it in).

2) Nobody enjoys firing people, and everybody tries to be as nice as possible about it, and say whatever they can to "soften the blow." Frankly, I would not give as much weight to what the NH NM said to you in person (which quits mattering as soon as the sound of her voice dies out in the room) as to the negative things noted in the documentation related to your firing, which is part of your permanent record at that facility.

3) From what I can gather from your posts, it sounds like you quit the NH position without working a notice (did you do that at the hospital, too?) -- at many facilities, that automatically makes you ineligible for rehire, regardless of whatever nice things the nurse manager may have said to you in person. (Termination often makes you automatically ineligible for rehire, also, per facility policy, regardless of how your previous NM may feel about you personally.)

4) The "list of crimes" from the previous job may well be "lies," but that doesn't really matter -- it will always be your word against theirs, and few potential employers will be willling to take your word for it that the entire problem with that job was that mean people treated you unfairly.

5) You will now be job-hunting with a few strikes against you. You need to be prepared to explain what happened with the previous jobs without sounding angry, bitter or paranoid ("they were just out to get me"). One of the worst things you can do in a job interview is to speak ill of a previous employer. Also, you need to be able to communicate that you recognize your part in the "poor fit" of the previous jobs, and be able to talk objectively and realistically about what strengths you would bring to another job, PLUS what weaknesses you have identified and what you are doing to improve those areas.

6) The best advice I can think of, again, is to find the biggest hospital nearest you that is accustomed to dealing with new grads and has a strong formal orientation program (even if that means driving quite a distance), and throw yourself on their mercy. Take whatever job they are willing to offer you, regardless of what floor or what shift it is (since you cannot really afford to be picky right now), and settle in and start working hard toward developing some solid skills and experience. A "basic" med-surg unit, as someone else suggested, would be ideal. You are not in a position, at this point, to hold out for a specialty area or any special requests about shifts, etc. After being fired promptly from your first two jobs, most employers will feel that they're doing you a big favor and taking a big chance by offering you a job.

7) I don't mean any of this to sound mean. You can still turn this around, but you will need to lose the "rose-colored glasses" and start thinking v. realistically and from the potential employer's point of view. For now, do what you need to do to get and keep a job. After that, you can start thinking about working toward your "dream" ICU or cardiac job. Best wishes! :)

Trauma Columnist · Feb 15, 2006

I am sorry you have had such a hard beginning to your nursing career. However, I agree that going to a larger hospital might be in your best interests. Chances are, they have extensive orientation for new grads (which you still are). Also, I would not list reasons for leaving an employer and whatever you do, it is best to stay very neutral in the interview and not say anything derogatory about your previous employer - it can make you look bad.

Good luck...let us know how it goes.