For Trauma / ER nurses.. difficult topic..

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Hello all.. I am a nursing student, and I thought I could reach out to you experienced trauma / er nurses to help me. Recently, my mother took her life. We were estranged for many years and she had serious addiction problems. This as I am sure anyone who has been thru it knows - has been a horrible thing for me to deal with. No matter how many times someone tells you that its not your fault - you always think it is. No matter how many times someone tells you that you couldn't have done anything - you always think you could have done more.

I know this may be a strange question - but I am the type of person who has to know.

She shot herself in the temple with a .22. From what I have been told, she lived for 3 hours after she was taken to the hospital - but I wasn't notified until she had died and none of her family had the chance to be with her or say goodbye. What was that 3 hours like? What took place to try to save her, was she completely "gone", brain dead, or could she have been coherent or felt pain or talked even? There is still a small part of me that wants to believe she couldn't have taken her life in this way - and for many months her death was investigated by Homicide Detectives for possible foul play. I mean, if someone would have told me that my mother swalled a bottle of pills - ok I would have believed that. But to shoot herself in the head? I still can't say it out loud - its so hard to comprehend. I know that these questions aren't going to change anything - and my family tells me to leave it alone - I don't need to know. But I DO NEED TO KNOW. Its my right. As her only child and executor - I know I can go to the hospital to get her medical records ... I just haven't taken that step yet. I know you can't answer specifically of course - but generally, if you have had a patient with this type of gsw - can you talk to me about what the 3 hrs for her might have been like? It is so completely devestating that she was all alone during that time and none of us could have been there with her.

Thank you for listening and I am sorry to post such a sad topic - but I know the resources are here for me to talk to people who can empathise and understand.

Thanks.

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Specializes in Nephrology, Cardiology, ER, ICU.

You poor dear! I am so very sorry that you are going thru this. I don't have specific answers for you. Please obtain the medical records and discuss it with the MD involved in your Mother's care.

It might help you to better deal with this to get some counselling. I sincerely wish you the best. Take care of yourself.

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Specializes in Telemetry, Case Management.

You have my deepest and heartfelt sympathy.

My mother also died violently, although not by her own hand. It was hard to believe, and only now after nearly 11 years has it become believeable and digestable, and am I able to talk about it without bawling my eyes out.

If you are a strong person, by all means get the medical records. If there was an autopsy performed, get that as well (although it is very graphic, you must be prepared before you read it.).

I got the police reports and even called the one witness to my mother's death.

After I knew all the facts I could find, through all channels available to me, was I able to begin to comprehend what had happened and how.

I recognize your pain, and I feel deeply for your suffering.

Please, get some counselling whether in person, group therapy, online support groups, etc. It does help, just the act of telling your story over and over and working through it.

You may PM me if you need someone to listen. ((((Hugs))))))

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I am so sorry about your mother's death. I can only imagine the pain you're going through. I strongly urge you to take Trauma's suggestion and seek grief counseling. There are groups for survivors of suicide victims, and you will find incredible support there.

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Thank you all. I have had some counseling. And I know I should probably go to a suicide support group - I just haven't yet. I know I need to - I just put it off and tell myself I am too busy, etc.

I did get her autopsy report and I read it thoroughly - its very graphic and technical.

I think my nagging question is was she coherent, could she say anything, and things of that nature. I don't know if it would make it any different.

I know I can also listen to the 911 call that was made by the person who found her, but I haven't brought myself to do it yet either. One day I want to know EVERYTHING, and the next day I want to forget everything, you know? Its just hard any way I try to deal with it, and I know talking about it helps.

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Check your PM

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I am deeply sorry for you loss. Please take care of yourself... We are all here for you.....

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Specializes in Emergency.

I'm so sorry for your loss. I would suggest calling the ED director/manager, and see if you can ask these questions to the nursing staff or MD that was taking care of your mother. Perhaps they would have the answers that you need to bring you some closure. Part of our job includes taking care of the family, so I think your request is not unreasonable.

I once had a young patient who ended up having a massive brain bleed (and eventually died). I told the family on the phone that the patient had not spoken since coming in to the ED and was comfortable. Those are just a few of the things that any family needs to know.

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Specializes in Education, Acute, Med/Surg, Tele, etc.

I would take the advice from others and talk to the ED MD or supervisor of the ED for that kind of information.

It will all depend on condition at time of being found, emergency transport and their interventions (VERY important and often overlooked), implementations done at the ED that will answer your questions...because when it comes to traumatic brain injury...well...there is NO book on the subject, and no one is the same as far as response depending on injury involved...

They will be able to answer your questions...some of my own questions would be: What was her Glascow coma score at time of paramedics arrival and at the ED (look that up online for the meanings of the numbers)? What interventions were done on site and in ED (CPR/ACLS interventions including all cardiopulmonary rescusitation efforts like shock/meds/compressions/intubation...). Those questions are to the point and will get you information on what efforts were done, and her state at the time.

I am very sorry for your loss...

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I would take the advice from others and talk to the ED MD or supervisor of the ED for that kind of information.

It will all depend on condition at time of being found, emergency transport and their interventions (VERY important and often overlooked), implementations done at the ED that will answer your questions...because when it comes to traumatic brain injury...well...there is NO book on the subject, and no one is the same as far as response depending on injury involved...

They will be able to answer your questions...some of my own questions would be: What was her Glascow coma score at time of paramedics arrival and at the ED (look that up online for the meanings of the numbers)? What interventions were done on site and in ED (CPR/ACLS interventions including all cardiopulmonary rescusitation efforts like shock/meds/compressions/intubation...). Those questions are to the point and will get you information on what efforts were done, and her state at the time.

I am very sorry for your loss...

Thank you. I read about the Glascow Score and found it very informative. I am going to get her hosp records and that will be one of the first things I look at. Thank you:saint:

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oh icor...

i am so, so sorry to read about your mom.

suicide has to be the most emotionally painful of deaths for a family to deal with...

so many unanswered questions.

what i can tell you is the human body is amazing at compensating for major trauma.

whether it is through the release of hormones, neurotransmitters or other chemicals, it protects us from the cognitive impact of the insult.

trauma staff are uniquely trained in assessing for any/all complications, including pain.

with that said, it is much more likely than not, that your mother did not suffer at all.

when you are ready, make that appt with your/her doctor and go over the data from the er.

this should put some of your anxieties to rest.

also, when ready, please do consider grief counseling.

i've taken the liberty of providing a few online links.

http://www.suicide.org/suicide-support-groups.html

http://www.survivorsofsuicide.com/

http://www.road2healing.com/

with loving thoughts for a peaceful tomorrow...

leslie

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Specializes in Emergency Room; Acute Psychiatry.

I am also sorry for what you are going through. I also agree with everyone else who says that you should see if you can get records and see what the nurses documented.

I do not want to say anything to make you feel any worse, However, you did ask the question and having worked several trauma codes with similar brain injuries from GSW's and also MVA's my hunch is that she was unconsious and never regained consiousness and 3 hours is how long it took for her heart to stop so that she could officially be pronounced.

I took care of a lady one time who had severe brain trauma from an MVA. She had some brain matter outside her skull. We made her comfortable and just waited for her heart to stop...which took awhile. I can't remember for sure, but it was at least an hour after she arrived to the ER. She was unconsious the entire time. It was agonizing for the staff, but I'm certain that the lady felt nothing. She was pronounced before her son arrived from out of town. The doctor explained to him that she had presented with "non-survivable" injuries and there was nothing we could do except wait for her heart to stop. The young man thanked us for not doing anything that would cause her to live in a vegetative state and prolong the inevetable.

Again, I am so sorry for what you are going through.

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