For those a BSN or MSN acquired online, did you face discrimination when job hunting

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If you got your BSN or MSN from a school that's mostly known for online teaching, like Western Governor's University for example, did the fact that your school was online come up or looked at in a negative light?

Any other input? Anybody here in a position to hire people, what do you think about online BSN or MSN degrees?

Why is it so difficult, when stating something as fact - simply provide a citation from a peer reviewed journal?

Peer-reviewed journals are for research. Facts can be found in other venues besides peer-reviewed journals. If what you are actually looking for is primary source material rather than secondary source material, in this case you'd want court filing records, not peer-reviewed journals. Secondary sources, like news articles, are useful to those of us who don't have a subscription to LexisNexis.

You seem to think bringing up patient care is your big trump card here, but patient care requires a whole different burden of proof than the yes/no question of whether these for-profit universities have had legal issues. Nice strawman, though.

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Specializes in School Nursing.
One poster says lot's of proof out there, you just have to look it up. You find many sources, but if it was really important, you would not make any decision based on the information from those sources. (like patient care) Eventually, you may see a link or citation to what appears to be a reputable (in the academic sense of the word, not as a synonym for popular) source. Upon reading that source you find either that the source is not so reputable or that the fact attributed to that source is grossly misstated by the original poster.

Why is it so difficult, when stating something as fact - simply provide a citation from a peer reviewed journal?

Otherwise, it's opinion. That is valuable and interesting on a discussion board, I dislike opinions pretending to be facts. (That's my opinion)

Would you accept an original lawsuit document? Here ya go

When you Google UoP or Kaplan (and a slew of others) you will find hundreds of thousands webpages with complaints from former students, faculty and recruiters. I suppose those are all part of some huge conspiracy? At some point, one has to wonder if ALL those people can be wrong.

I have to find the article I read recently and post it here.. it was about studies that have been done that indicate that when someone has a strong opinion on something, that even when they are presented with facts, it actually works opposite from what you would expect. It causes them to strengthen their opinions rather than help them realize they may be wrong. The studies concluded that it is how we are wired, a human brain thing. I'm thinking this isn't any different.

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Specializes in MPCU.
Peer-reviewed journals are for research. Facts can be found in other venues besides peer-reviewed journals. If what you are actually looking for is primary source material rather than secondary source material, in this case you'd want court filing records, not peer-reviewed journals. Secondary sources, like news articles, are useful to those of us who don't have a subscription to LexisNexis.

You seem to think bringing up patient care is your big trump card here, but patient care requires a whole different burden of proof than the yes/no question of whether these for-profit universities have had legal issues. Nice strawman, though.

Not my trump card. Just something, I thought, all could relate. How about your commute. Do you, honestly, believe the traffic reports? What about the weather? Movie or restaurant reviews? Those facts that you can check for yourself are unreliable from the news media. Why would you consider other "facts" reported by popular (albeit "respected") sources to be anymore trustworthy?

You have free access to NCIB, well not free, your tax dollars pay for it. I did not say it was not useful, I said it was only opinion. Nothing bad about opinion, I like opinions, except when they pretend to be facts.

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Specializes in MPCU.
Peer-reviewed journals are for research. Facts can be found in other venues besides peer-reviewed journals. If what you are actually looking for is primary source material rather than secondary source material, in this case you'd want court filing records, not peer-reviewed journals. Secondary sources, like news articles, are useful to those of us who don't have a subscription to LexisNexis.

You seem to think bringing up patient care is your big trump card here, but patient care requires a whole different burden of proof than the yes/no question of whether these for-profit universities have had legal issues. Nice strawman, though.

Yes, they can be factual. Just you have no way of knowing that. I used the patient care analogy to show that if you thought it was important, you would not use those sources.

Sorry for the hijack.

Back to the story...I dislike the 'trade' schools like uop and K as well as others. (btw, some of them are "brick and mortor" only.) That is my opinion. I really have no facts. You see, I agree with your conclusion, just not the premise.

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woodenpug,

I cannot follow your logic, it does not make sense to debate that court hearing details are opinions not facts by discussing the reliability of weather reports.

dishes

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Specializes in School Nursing.
Not my trump card. Just something, I thought, all could relate. How about your commute. Do you, honestly, believe the traffic reports? Movie or restaurant reviews? Those facts that you can check for yourself are unreliable from the news media. Why would you consider other "facts" reported by popular (albeit "respected") sources to be anymore trustworthy?

Why wouldn't you believe a traffic report? If the news reports an accident that has backed up the freeway, why would you doubt it? What reason would they have to fabricate traffic reports? Weather? Weather is not based on opinion, but a prediction that is based on scientific models and charts. Are weather men often wrong? Sure. But they aren't reporting the weather based on slants with the intention to convince someone of their 'opinion'. A respected newspaper uses fact checking, especially when reporting things such as lawsuits where the information is open to the public and easily verifiable. When it comes to politics, I do believe different news sources slant in different ways. But general news, like reporting a huge class action lawsuit. No respected newspaper is going to run that story without reviewing the actual law document.

Movies and restaurant reviews, those are definitely simple opinions and can be taken for what they are worth. You can choose to believe nothing you read and hear on the news, that doesn't mean that a great amount of it isn't based on facts.

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Specializes in School Nursing.

Nevermind.. upon further investigation, we're talking about a different Kaplan.

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Wasn't dismissing anybody, just pointing out having less than a high school education puts you at a huge disadvantage academically. Sorry about that. I am not saying they are inferior or stupid. They are just not the population set that most online programs target.

Having a GED does not necessarily mean one has less than a high school education. Many homeschoolers get GEDs and statistically they are *far* better educated than average high school graduates.

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Specializes in School Nursing.
Having a GED does not necessarily mean one has less than a high school education. Many homeschoolers get GEDs and statistically they are *far* better educated than average high school graduates.

Further, 40% of graduating seniors administered the GED test fail it. This is the fact sheet available at the Texas Education Agency- I highly reliable state government website. You can click here if you want to read it. When they say equivalency, they mean it.

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Specializes in Peds/outpatient FP,derm,allergy/private duty.
`111q3ASCVB `

Sorry, my 2-year-old son sat on the keyboard. I don't know how to delete posts!

Too cute! You can't delete your own posts here! With a Premium Membership I got the right to edit my posts at any time instead of just the first 5 or 10 minutes. It's a great comfort. :)

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Specializes in MPCU.
Why wouldn't you believe a traffic report? If the news reports an accident that has backed up the freeway, why would you doubt it? What reason would they have to fabricate traffic reports? Weather? Weather is not based on opinion, but a prediction that is based on scientific models and charts. Are weather men often wrong? Sure. But they aren't reporting the weather based on slants with the intention to convince someone of their 'opinion'. A respected newspaper uses fact checking, especially when reporting things such as lawsuits where the information is open to the public and easily verifiable. When it comes to politics, I do believe different news sources slant in different ways. But general news, like reporting a huge class action lawsuit. No respected newspaper is going to run that story without reviewing the actual law document.

Movies and restaurant reviews, those are definitely simple opinions and can be taken for what they are worth. You can choose to believe nothing you read and hear on the news, that doesn't mean that a great amount of it isn't based on facts.

Because traffic reports are never accurate or timely. Again, those were just examples. You should not trust reputable news media for information upon which you had to rely. I only mentioned this as an aside, because all too often the argumentum ad nauseum is supported by a plethora of news articles. The quoted court document showed that uop settled in a case where they were charged with unethical recruiting practices. Ethics are important, but recruiting practices do not necessarily relate to the quality of the program. It is all too easy to quote news media in support of a weak position. The first document included several "institutions" of the "brick and mortar" type.

Anyway, I like online education. I see that many online only schools have some issues which may be of concern. I think the real issue is the one of "paying dues." Those who do not trust the online method seem to feel that because it was more convenient, the student did not learn. We have had similar debates about Regents (later called Excelsior).

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Didnt mean to insult you, and it was just my guess, and personal experience. Everyone I have known who has dropped out are like that. I was not demeaning them at all. If you actually look up statistics on college drop outs, and I am just guessing here, but I would be willing to bet that most would be poor. And the ones who drop out for illness would be a minority. I did not mean to imply that "all" were like that, sorry for that.

Out of my graduating class, we had over thirty drop outs. All were "partiers" who placed no importance to education. I was actually thinking more of the adults who dropped out, not the teenagers who dropped out and then immediately finished their ged.

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