Excelsior FL nursing grad endorsement dillema

Tweety, BSN, RN · Feb 19, 2008

Good luck. I'll move this to the FL Nurses forum where hopefully someone can help.

It's never a good time to make a change, someone no matter when they do it is going to be left out of the loop.

cpnegrad07 · Feb 19, 2008

I'm an EC grad, also, (and graduated in June 07, licensed in Sept.

Interesting that they will accept either 2 years experience OR you can work with veterans. What about at the animal hospital? Did they consider that? Why do they think it is OK for you to take care of veterans but not other pts.? (Not you, i know, because you aren't a citizen yet--i'm just venting about the 2nd class citizenship of the vets.) (and i'm not one).:angryfire

elkpark · Feb 20, 2008

I'm an EC grad, also, (and graduated in June 07, licensed in Sept.
Interesting that they will accept either 2 years experience OR you can work with veterans. What about at the animal hospital? Did they consider that? Why do they think it is OK for you to take care of veterans but not other pts.? (Not you, i know, because you aren't a citizen yet--i'm just venting about the 2nd class citizenship of the vets.) (and i'm not one).:angryfire

It's not a matter of veterans being "second class citizens" -- the issue is that the VA, because it is a Federal agency, does not require employees to be licensed in the state where the hospital is located; as long as you have a valid license in any state, that is acceptable to them. The FL Board of Nursing doesn't have any control over that, or over VA facilities. The point they were making is that you could work in FL in a VA hospital, without a FL license (but with a valid license from another state, one that licenses EC grads without any restrictions), to get the two years of experience and then apply for FL licensure.

woody62, RN · Feb 20, 2008

i'm an excelsior nurse grad, non-lpn, rn licensed in another state, still no nursing experience, who live in florida. i came upon a memo dated july 2007 in the fl board of nursing website regarding endorsement of excelsior nursing graduates. i gathered they will accept experienced lpns for endorsement but for all other excelsior nursing graduates they will require 2 years experience out of state or work from a local veterans hospital. i have contacted the endorsement unit at the board and they said it would be best to give an application for endorsement with a 'variance'. (variance as i understand is like a petition to the fl boards to accept your endorsement-- for which i was advised to seek legal assistance or lawyer to draft it). i think it would not matter at this time if i graduated prior to their released memo in july 2007. that would not be enough to exempt me from the 'variance' rule because i am still an excelsior graduate.
it's just so disappointing that fl boards did not give enough time for students like us or for excelsior to prepare for this kind of situation--that they suddenly changed the rules on online graduates. and the options they're suggesting is very limiting: 2 years experience out of state, or 2 years experience at a local veterans hospital. in my case, i cannot just move and practice elsewhere because i have kids and i cannot practice in a va hospital because i'm not yet an american citizen. besides, what are the chances of a newly graduate/no experience rn getting accepted??..
so my option right now, after spending so much time and money to become an rn, is to take my chance (and spend more money!) to apply for endorsement with the variance. my question is: anybody with a similar situation?? knowing a lawyer who handled same case will be very much helpful:typing
i just want to know that i'm not alone in this mess and i want to warn the current fl excelsior nursing students of what they may have to face in the future should they apply for endorsement in fl.

unfortunately, you are not alone. the florida bon has a nasty habit of making changes and then notifying the rest of the world. i was licensed here, in 1980, by endorsement. i held a license until 2000. i moved out of the state, thinking i would never return, and in august of 2000, i allowed my license to laspe. i chose not to renew it. i had to move back here in 2003. when i went to their website, i was surprised to learn that my license was listed as revoked. after several telephone calls, i learned this is how they had decided recently, to list any license not renewed. now if i want my license back, i must pay more then $200, submit my state board scores, from 1971, get finger printed and have a criminal background check done. i don't have a problem with the finger prints and criminal background check but i do have a problem with paying more then $200 and resubmitting scores they already have on file. i live on a fixed income and paying more then $200 takes a big bite out of my monthly income.

the recent (by recent i mean the past several years) head of the board decided that excelsior graduates had to meet extra requirements. in the 1980's, no such problem. in the early 1990's there was a ban on any graduate from this program being licensed but nys and graduates raised a rucus and the requirement was dropped. apparently there was not that much of a problem this time. i am sorry but there is little you can do about their current rule. if you live near the state border, look into getting a license in a border state and working there for two years.

woody

APBT mom, LPN, RN · Feb 22, 2008

I don't think the problem that you went to Excelsior it's that you don't have any clinical experience (from what I know about the program clinicals are very short, correct me if I'm wrong) and they want to see that you have the skills as a RN. I think your other problem is that they passed a rule stating that they weren't going to let non LPN students have get their RN license here by going through this program.

Like someone else said above if you live near the border and are close to a hospital/facility in another state transfer your license there and get your two years and transfer back to Fl.

rizagirlRN · Feb 22, 2008

I understand the FL board of nursing requiring clinical experience from those who want to be endorsed and this is a very valid reason for changing their rules. A respiratory therapist or emt would not have comparable clinical skills as compared to lpns. I'm a foreign medical graduate and still they don't see much comparison with regards to nursing experience. It is as if they are questioning the validity of licensure of those coming from Excelsior when the fact is that there is a test on the clinical level skills before you can graduate. The clinical exam Excelsior offers involves a 3-day gruelling test on real hospitals with real patients. A student is evaluated in taking care of patients and documentation as real nurses do for a period of supervised time by a clinical examiner who is a licensed nurse in FL. If this is not enough for FL then they should at least offer online graduates other options like facilities where training can be provided before endorsement can be approved than just saying work out of state or in a VA hospital for 2 years which is very limiting. I don't live near the border of FL, I live way south in Palm Beach county so it is very unlikely that I can do this specially with kids around...

The fact that graduates of Excelsior who passed the nclex already proved themselves somehow should have a bearing to endorsement in any state. I don't see why other states approve online graduates while FL BON gives us a hard time. Or at least give sufficient time before certain laws can be passed so the students can be warned beforehand and be prepared. Rather than making/changing laws and just announcing to the world this is what we want now if you want to work here.

At any rate, I don't have much choice now, do I?

traumahawk99 · Feb 22, 2008

i'd be sure of what my dates were exactly. does it mean graduation or enrollment? call the state board and ask them directly.

APBT mom, LPN, RN · Feb 23, 2008

The thing is that states are starting to stop accepting graduates from Excelsior whether or not they passed the NCLEX. In California you can't get a license just because you went their. They grandfathered people who currently had a license and were working prior than 2000. Everyone else is stuck either going to a different state or going back to school and getting the credits they need that way.

It's because they don't know how well you would do in the real world as a RN. 3 days of clinicals isn't enough time to determine if you will be a safe RN even if you currently have your LPN because you're not thinking like a RN when your doing your LPN job. RN's go to clinicals for months, pass the NCLEX and in some cases still don't know what they're doing. How can anyone say that 3 days of clinicals prepares you for the resposibilities of being a RN?

I'm not attacking you it's just that these schools aren't worried about what happens once you graduate. The only thing that they're worried about is the money they get from you. This is another reason why people should really investigate the schools that they're interested in before they start because the schools only tell you how easy it is to work around your schedule but fail to mention how many hoops you have to jump through to actually work in that field.

chip193 · Feb 23, 2008

I'm an EC grad, also, (and graduated in June 07, licensed in Sept.
Interesting that they will accept either 2 years experience OR you can work with veterans. What about at the animal hospital? Did they consider that? Why do they think it is OK for you to take care of veterans but not other pts.? (Not you, i know, because you aren't a citizen yet--i'm just venting about the 2nd class citizenship of the vets.) (and i'm not one).:angryfire

The reason for this is that the VA will employ you if you are licensed in any state, not necessarily the state where the particular hospital is located.

The OP has an RN license somewhere - just not FL. So a VA hospital (or any federal hospital for that matter - so look at the military hospitals - some do use civies) in Miami can hire her, but a hospital licensed by FL cannot.

chip193 · Feb 23, 2008

I don't think the problem that you went to Excelsior it's that you don't have any clinical experience (from what I know about the program clinicals are very short, correct me if I'm wrong) and they want to see that you have the skills as a RN. I think your other problem is that they passed a rule stating that they weren't going to let non LPN students have get their RN license here by going through this program.
Like someone else said above if you live near the border and are close to a hospital/facility in another state transfer your license there and get your two years and transfer back to Fl.

The clinicals are actually life-long. The competancy exam is three days.

APBT mom, LPN, RN · Feb 24, 2008

The clinicals are actually life-long. The competancy exam is three days.

I know that you're constantly learning but three days (36 hrs) compared to the almost 1000 hrs that a student that goes to a traditional program that requires clinicals is a big difference. A exam is the student going to a facility once and performing each skill only once in front of a nurse (who may cut corners him/herself, not do procedures the way they should be done or the way she was taught in this program, not pay attention and tell you that you're doing something wrong, not want to deal with a check off list and start marking things without seeing them done, etc.) check you off. Clinicals have a lot of repeatative procedures that you will do to help you to understand how to do this properly.

I can bet this is why the state wants at least two years of experience before they'll give you a license in this state and from what I saw on the BON website about this situation (in regards to non LPN's getting a RN this way) the school knew about this for awhile and weren't relaying this to their students but in this case it looks like she was living in another state that's why she was unaware of the ruling until now. This is why these online schools are shady. I wonder how many other students are going to have problems when other states start refusing those licensed from graduating at that school.

There's a girl in my class that wants to move to New York and whether or not she gets her license there or here they want 200 ceu in exchange for the clinical hours she lacking because NY requires more clinical hours than Fl.