Ever been physically attacked by MD? What have or Would you Do?

Nurses Relations

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Specializes in Utilization Review.
What kind of question of that? Let's rephrase it hmm?

"Ever been assaulted by a neighbour. What would you do?"

"Ever been assaulted by a teacher. What would you do?"

"Ever been assualted by a housekeeper? What would you do?"

"Ever been assualted by a thug? What would you do?"

Aren't those questions silly?

LOL!.........FAIL

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"it isn't so much about the assault itself as it is who is doing the assaulting - in this case a person who, fairly or not, is often perceived to be 'above' nursing staff - how do you handle that situation in the workplace? how do you handle the inevitable politics and ramifications of speaking up, whether or not they should exist? it's a little less silly when you look at it from that viewpoint."

it's still silly.

if they don't know it already, physicians do not educate, hire, evaluate, discipline, or fire nurses (unless directly, as in an office setting). time they figured out the ds in their degrees don't stand for "deity."

if the nursing department needs a refresher, print out a copy of the nurse practice act and the ana scope of practice for them. post copies in the break room too-- you'd be surprised about what they say. pleasantly. knowledge is power, folks. you don't get given power, you seize power.

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it's still silly.

if they don't know it already, physicians do not educate, hire, evaluate, discipline, or fire nurses (unless directly, as in an office setting). time they figured out the ds in their degrees don't stand for "deity."

if the nursing department needs a refresher, print out a copy of the nurse practice act and the ana scope of practice for them. post copies in the break room too-- you'd be surprised about what they say. pleasantly. knowledge is power, folks. you don't get given power, you seize power.

i'm not implying that anyone should roll over and take the abuse, but -

"the hospital attempted to settle with her but she took his butt to court and won 25,000.00."

"actually, the hospital absolutely did notsupport her... it was an extremely pro-doctor place. "

"i called the police and filed charges but then cops always tried to let physical abuse slide. they tried to get me to let it go. i refused and demanded that they file charges,so they did but they would not arrest him in the hospital. i threw a fit with administration and threaten to sue if they did not reprimand him. "

"what is so sad is, that if these situations were turned around, and it was the nurse assaulting the doc, they would have his/her license for lunch!"

"when i spoke to other nurses about it, i was told to keep my mouth shut, because he'd done the same and gotten other nurses fired when they complained. i was too stupid and scared to do anything."

all these anecdotes support that reporting an md for assault/abuse is a little different than reporting your neighbor - you've got police reluctant to arrest a doctor, other nurses possibly trying to keep you from rocking the boat, etc.

it's useful to know the various things one might come up against in this situation - it's easier to be strong when you know what you're dealing with.

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Specializes in Utilization Review.

Again...the continuation of a cycle. If it's silly to discuss and get advice on a valid problem that has plagued many a nurse, is there anything that's really logical to discuss? In that case everything on this board is silly. It's obviously a valid question due to the response and the amount of varied personal experiences being reported. Good thing there are at least some words of encouragement to newer nurses who don't yet feel they have tenure to stand up for themselves.

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Specializes in New PACU RN.

^Don't take it personal. I just find the stories of docs getting away with this BS mind boggling. I can understand if it was the third world...but sue happy North America? It's crazy to think that nurses are afraid of people who happened to complete 6 more years of school and sport a white coat.

At the end of the day - it's just a job.

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Specializes in Utilization Review.

It should be mind boggling....and yet it still happens. Now we have a better idea of how much it actually does happen. Thanks for sharing eveyone. You're not alone.

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Specializes in Critical Care; Cardiac; Professional Development.

I have worked in a medical office since the age of 19 and have encountered both wonderful docs and those who do not understand how to treat people. Over the years I have learned that these types frequently respond very well to simply being stood up to. The first time I did it and the doctor apologized to me, you could have knocked me over with a feather. He had a reputation for being a jerk to the office staff and everyone was afraid of him. That was 15 years ago and I don't work there anymore, but he and I remain friends.

I am sure it is not foolproof, but many bullies seem to seek the boundary of what will be tolerated and respond accordingly.

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Specializes in M/S, Travel Nursing, Pulmonary.

There is a theory about sexual predators:

They walk into a room and without even talking to anyone, just by observing people in a crowd, can tell who is vulnerable and who is not. It's as if they can smell it or something. Then, they move in and talk to the girls they are hoping to manipulate/rape and get a sense of whether they are right or not. After just a few sentences, they know.

I think bullies are the same way on a lot of levels. They know who to start trouble with and who not to. It's not even about who would win the fight if one occurs either. It's about, who is worth the trouble and who isn't. The ones who will back down emotionally post fight are the ones they target (blame themselves for the incident even if not at fault, will be afraid of another occurrence etc....).

I used to volunteer at a youth detention center. I've talked about it before. This center had boys all the way up to 18, and some had kids, most (kinda scary) had GF's. They had been involved in assault on their children (yes, babies) and GF's. Part of the "rehabilitation" was anger management meetings (they were called "sections").

In these meetings, one thing that was brought up a lot was............a lot of people claim they can't control themselves due to having a "temper". But having a "bad temper" implies a lack of control. Someone who has this lack of control will have issues with everyone, all the time. They'll get into it with bosses when they can't lose their job, into with friends they don't want to lose, into it with guys who can toss them around without breaking a sweat.

Most people who are abusive are not like this though. They are very picky about who they "loose their temper" with. Won't punch the boss, they need the job, won't punch the guy bigger than them........it hurts to. They'll only lose it when they know they have the advantage. This is not "having a bad temper". That's just being an old version of the school yard bully.

So, you have to ward off the losers who pray on weaker people. Assertiveness, its the only way. If you walk and talk like someone who hits back and doesn't look back...........you'll never have to hit back. A lot of rape prevention courses include assertiveness classes as a portion of the whole education. Yes, they show you how to hit back, how to identify dangerous situations/people and all that, but the assertiveness class teaches you how to walk and talk so that the predator doesn't target you in the first place. Same thing would work with old school yard bullies.

If you find doctors getting verbally abusive or fear being attacked, take an assertiveness course and you'll be surprised how many of them back down from the new you.

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Specializes in neuro med, telemetry, icu, pacu.

ericsoln--- i love reading your posts.... :)

cant say i have ever been in danger of physical assault.. unless we are talking about patients who are out of their mind or simply cant reason ( either because they have never been able to, or we have removed their powers of reason because of what we have given them med wise)....

but many times i have been able to turn around a situation of verbal abuse from all walks of the profession...RT's MD's, fellow RN's.....and when others witness this happening, they decide not to mess with you...

had an anesthesia md refuse to give more pain medication to a patient who really should have been on the floor by this time ( yah-- nursing short staffed and refused to take the patient til more staffing arrived--i applaud the nurse manager for doing so).the anesthesiologist screaming at me that he was no longer responsible for the patient as he had been signed out!! raving like a lunatic at me in front of the entire staff.... i clamly stated that i understood his position, but i was not sure how administration was going to think about this abandonment of the patient-- could i call administration for him? ( as i dialed the phone in hand).....he huffed away and said " dont call me about this again! find someone else!! ...... so this placed the patient in no mans land. i opted to call the surgeon and say " i am using your orders for pain medication, and clearly the parameters needs enlarging, may i have a verbal order to give more?"... now usually this nice mannered surgeon slammed the phone down and showed up 15 minutes later, screaming at me once again in front of all the staff...

i took the verbal abuse, let it sail right over the top of me and said to the surgeon " look at your patient. have pity and compassion on him. do with me what you will, say what you will. BUT OUR FOCUS IS THE PATIENT. may i increase the dosage of __________?"......he screamed at me " write for whatever you want! ".......

i remained and kept my composure. sought out another doc who would write more pain orders so my liscense was covered....

been doing this long enough to know since all the other nurses felt and saw all of this, i would need to do nothing.........

needless to say, i never had an issue with either of these 2 doc's ever again.

anesthesia doc came to me and said " they are sending me to anger management--what do you think about that?" i never said a word to him but redirected the conversation about how grateful his family would be to have a peace filled daddy and husband....

the surgeon never apologized.....but i beleive in leaving a " space for grace"....we all have bad days...and he regularly seeks me out to just chat.. knowing i will just listen and be there....and i know he requests me to care for his post op patients....( the OR and chanrge nurses come and tell me)

at the end of the day it is easier to sleep with a clean conscience... you have done no harm.....caused no pain....

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Specializes in LTC.
Yes I was slapped by a Dr. with a metal chart. This was a very long time ago. I called the police and filed charges but then cops always tried to let physical abuse slide. They tried to get me to let it go. I refused and demanded that they file charges,so they did but they would not arrest him in the hospital. I threw a fit with administration and threaten to sue if they did not reprimand him.

They investigated him and found he had Alziemers and forced him to retire. I was horrified when I found out he was treating patients because he was not a gentle fellow with his disease but very combative and mean.

wow. thats scary!

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Specializes in LTC.
My mom was a hospital volunteer in the early 1970s, and once saw a "respected" OB backhand a nurse in the nurse's station.

This doctor was well known for (among other things) doing unnecessary episiotomies and then sewing the women up so tight, they couldn't have sex with their husbands.

Personally, I think this doctor should get something of his chopped off.:twocents:

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