I am in an LVN program that has 5 groups of students - total class size 150 students. In my group, we took our first exam last week in one of the classes a day or two after another group.
A few classmates were discussing the fact that one of them has a friend in one of the other groups that allegedly shared specific information from the test - as the friend had already taken it.
I have no proof... and I don't know for certain that the tests are identical... and the classmate with the info did not ace the exam... but it is bothering me just the same.
This feels like cheating.
Do I approach the instructor with this information or do I let it go and worry about myself?
It is possible that it is bothering me because I put in the study effort and this particular classmate is frequently bragging about weekend plans and such. Yes, I know that is a maturity issue on my end that needs to be resolved... trying to work on it.
However, the fact that ethics is so important to this career field... and the fact that we are required to sign a confidentiality clause for EACH exam... just bugs me that this information was allegedly shared.
Doesn't tell them which definitions or anything, just says to make sure they know them.
Is this cheating?
Uhhhh....:uhoh21: I want to say no, but that gives an advantage to those particular students that happen to be standing there listening to Student A's advice...an advantage that their classmates may not get. So, in that sense, I suppose it is cheating. Yikes. I am, therefore, guilty of cheating. Wow, I feel terrible.
Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.
Uhhhh....:uhoh21: I want to say no, but that gives an advantage to those particular students that happen to be standing there listening to Student A's advice...an advantage that their classmates may not get. So, in that sense, I suppose it is cheating. Yikes. I am, therefore, guilty of cheating. Wow, I feel terrible.
That's ok, apparently so am I.lol I was student A. I remember my first semester, not knowing the exact definitions got a lot of us. We weren't expecting them to be on the tests, just problems. I didn't see the harm in just saying to know them. I mean there were a lot to know and only a few would be tested on. But I remember what it was like my first semester and wanted to help without giving to much. Like tips and stuff.
So I was curious if people would consider this cheating as well.
Or like when I was in 1st semester and we were doing our skills check off's I remember a student telling us to try and get XXXX teacher for our check off's if we could. That she was a lot friendlier and laid back and not as strict as another teacher. Again, this would give us some sort of advantage, but I wouldn't look at it as cheating. So I dunno.
In the example I gave, I would consider cheating saying something like "Know the definitions for......." and listing like 5 words that I know you needed to know the definitions for on the test.
In regards to those two scenarios, I would say neither one is cheating. In my program, we are set up with senior year mentors that are supposed to help us out and answer any questions we have. Some of them have even given us old study guides and notes.
The college/department should always assume this is going on. The OP complained that students taking the test in a later group had an unfair advantage, and that is true they do. However, I think it is more up to the professor and department to fix this problem.
In my previous degree program, the professors always used the same exams year after year and the students would just pass them down. It was a huge advantage and the profs new we had them and would even encourage it. Even though I was one of the students that had all the old exams, I felt like it was ridiculous and lazy of the professors.
It's a lot of work to write an exam, especially five new copies of one. Instructors have a lot on their plate and aren't always keen on doing that.
New instructors can be shockingly naive about cheating.
I could never understand why ... they have been students before, you would think it's common sense to anticipate this issue.
That's ok, apparently so am I.lol I was student A. I remember my first semester, not knowing the exact definitions got a lot of us. We weren't expecting them to be on the tests, just problems. I didn't see the harm in just saying to know them. I mean there were a lot to know and only a few would be tested on. But I remember what it was like my first semester and wanted to help without giving to much. Like tips and stuff.
So I was curious if people would consider this cheating as well.
Or like when I was in 1st semester and we were doing our skills check off's I remember a student telling us to try and get XXXX teacher for our check off's if we could. That she was a lot friendlier and laid back and not as strict as another teacher. Again, this would give us some sort of advantage, but I wouldn't look at it as cheating. So I dunno.
In the example I gave, I would consider cheating saying something like "Know the definitions for......." and listing like 5 words that I know you needed to know the definitions for on the test.
Here we go again, Mi Vida ... I won't suggest you be burned at the stake for this LMAO!!
I would have to agree with you ... I would not consider it cheating if you gave guidance to students about knowing their definitions, but as soon as you get specific about things (e.g., Don't bother studying the parts of the brain, that's not on the test, know the definitions for X, Y, Z ...) then it is as close to cheating as you can get without actually giving someone a copy of the actual test. As an aside, I have never been in a situation where someone had a copy of a stolen test beforehand, but I know I would not want to even be remotely involved with anything like that.
NOW, when I was in law school, most professors had copies of their old exams on reserve at the library and students were free to go see them and even copy them to use for studying or perhaps mock testing. I rarely did this, and if I did I only did it to pretty much gauge what to expect for my test. Apparently this was not considered cheating and other law schools do the same I understand. The tests were usually 2 or 3 fact patterns that we had to dissect to identify legal issues and argue them with case law and statutes learned in the class, and NEVER did I encounter a reused question. I guess that was something that was closely monitored. At my school, we usually had ONE test - the final - and that was your entire grade yup (but we were allowed to bring in an outline that we supposedly compiled all through the semester to use as reference. I know students who would just get some old student's outline and use that. Is that cheating? Perhaps?) The test could be as long as 4 hours, 7 hours, or even a 24-hour take home. But believe me, it was no cake walk. Don't expect to get a high grade if you used less than 2 bluebooks!!
Specializes in Emergency Dept. Trauma. Pediatrics.
I could never understand why ... they have been students before, you would think it's common sense to anticipate this issue.
Here we go again, Mi Vida ... I won't suggest you be burned at the stake for this LMAO!!
I would have to agree with you ... I would not consider it cheating if you gave guidance to students about knowing their definitions, but as soon as you get specific about things (e.g., Don't bother studying the parts of the brain, that's not on the test, know the definitions for X, Y, Z ...) then it is as close to cheating as you can get without actually giving someone a copy of the actual test. As an aside, I have never been in a situation where someone had a copy of a stolen test beforehand, but I know I would not want to even be remotely involved with anything like that.
NOW, when I was in law school, most professors had copies of their old exams on reserve at the library and students were free to go see them and even copy them to use for studying or perhaps mock testing. I rarely did this, and if I did I only did it to pretty much gauge what to expect for my test. Apparently this was not considered cheating and other law schools do the same I understand. The tests were usually 2 or 3 fact patterns that we had to dissect to identify legal issues and argue them with case law and statutes learned in the class, and NEVER did I encounter a reused question. I guess that was something that was closely monitored. At my school, we usually had ONE test - the final - and that was your entire grade yup (but we were allowed to bring in an outline that we supposedly compiled all through the semester to use as reference. I know students who would just get some old student's outline and use that. Is that cheating? Perhaps?) The test could be as long as 4 hours, 7 hours, or even a 24-hour take home. But believe me, it was no cake walk. Don't expect to get a high grade if you used less than 2 bluebooks!!
Whew, thanks for this. Fire is my biggest fear. Just the thought of burning at the stake provokes an anxiety attack!
Check your school's honesty policy. My school has a very strict policy that says students are not allowed to discuss assignments, lab activities, exams, homework, etc. with students from another section and that we are not allowed to collaborate with ANY students on any assigned work unless specifically given permission to. I think we are also obligated to tell an instructor if we see anything that could be construed as cheating...if we don't and they do find out about it, we can be held accountable for it as well for "letting it happen." It is ridiculously strict, but I think for good reason. They want an even playing field for everyone, and honestly...if students are cheating in school, I'd definitely question their integrity as a nurse.
We had to sign a form saying we would abide by these standards at orientation. What is your school's policy? If it seems lax, I probably wouldn't do anything about it. But if it's pretty strict and you are in a position to potentially be at fault, I might speak up. Or if it is just weighing on your conscience, you can always send them an anonymous email from a nondescript email account.
Giving specific answers/questions from the test = cheating
Upperclassmen giving guidance in regards to studying = networking It's no different than a student taking advantage of clinical and getting in good with the managers to secure a job.
As for giving other people in my class a heads up about tests, I don't go any further than "that test was a lot harder/different than I thought it would be!"but that's it. People know not to ask me for specifics cuz they'll be disappointed. I've heard people telling other classes what areas to focus on for tests but meh. I guess it would be nice of me to share but I don't. I'm with That Guy - why should they get an advantage over me?
We had a similar issue in nursing school. One of the students stole a copy of the test from the teacher's desk. She and three other students took it to the library to make copies, but the copy machine was broke. When the librarian came over and offered to make copies on HER copy machine, the girls freaked out and were afraid they had been caught. (They had not.)
The girl who took the test put the copy back when the teacher was at lunch. The other three reported her that evening. While I do not condone the first student stealing the test, she was under a lot of stress. She had been struggling with severe post-partum depression and her family (5 kids) was relying on her to pass this last semester so she could get a job as a nurse and start providing income. She worked as an EMT and was often up all night on "runs" before coming to class. She was exhausted. It doesn't make it right, but I see it as an act of desperation.
What angered me is that the other 3 students who went with her to the library and turned her in began talking about her to the class. They ran her into the ground as a dishonest person. "Is that the kind of nurse you would want taking care of your mom?"
I couldn't take it. I have never been quiet, but I would like to say that I always try to be fair. I finally blew up at the three girls and told them that I wouldn't want a cheater for a nurse, but I wouldn't want a back-stabber either. I told them in front of the whole class "The three of you admit you went with her to the library. You had every INTENTION to cheat. You are NOT better than her. You have no integrity. You're spineless. On top of cheating, you are afraid of getting caught. So afraid that you would belittle a fellow student to make yourself look better. No. You are not the type of nurse I would want to take care of my mother. You aren't the kind of nurses I would want for my dog. I think you need to take a long look at yourself before you open your mouth about Janedoe again."
That was the last of their conversation about her out loud to the class. I'm sure they whispered, but the constant sneers towards Janedoe stopped. Some students thought I agree with her for cheating. I didn't. I just didn't feel the other three deserved pats on the back for turning in their friend when they were just as guilty.
If you aren't comfortable turning this student in, do it anonymously. Type it up. Print it out. Drop it under the teacher's desk or create a new gmail, yahoo email and send it to her. She may be unaware.
Personally, I have found that those who cheat are only cheating themselves. There is no cheating for the NCLEX and they still have to pass that to become a nurse.
~Sherri
"The new nurse thinks like a mom. The experienced nurse thinks like a lawyer."
Some of them have even given us old study guides and notes.
I am well known in my school for having great lecture notes. Now, 1 year after graduation, I still get requests for my med surg II notes, which I am happy to pass along. I don't believe this to be cheating, because the recipient still has to LEARN WHAT IS IN THE NOTES in order to pass the exams.
Since when is helping fellow students along considered cheating, anyway?
FWIW, regardless of grades, the cheater needs to pass the NCLEX. They will have a much more difficult time.
But, like the RN's post above mine....I received NOTES from a previous AH II student. These helped me study, but it didn't give me a heads up on the tests. I don't see getting notes as cheating, but a heads up on exam Qs is - IMHO.
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Wow, I feel terrible.
... I won't suggest you be burned at the stake for this LMAO!! 
gumby1411
288 Posts
Uhhhh....:uhoh21: I want to say no, but that gives an advantage to those particular students that happen to be standing there listening to Student A's advice...an advantage that their classmates may not get. So, in that sense, I suppose it is cheating. Yikes. I am, therefore, guilty of cheating.
Wow, I feel terrible.