did the Dr. have a right to scold this nurse?

Published

first let me say that i have no nursing experience..i do computer work for the huge local teaching hospital. 2 days ago i was told that i could become a "code" recorder. a "code" was announced yesturday for the Cardiac ICU and i had to be there to record the events. when the whole team showed up,the patient was awake,alert and breathing fine. it ended up being a false alarm. what happened was the new nurse just started her shift and she noticed on the monitor that this pt. had a severe bradycardic heart rate of 20 BPM. nurse said that she shaked the pts. shoulder and got no response,so she panicked and pushed the code button. as it turned out,this pt. is a very heavy sleeper and her baseline HR is very very low during sleep. after this false alarm was over,i noticed the team leader dr. talking with the nurse face to face and the nurse was wiping a tear from her eye. i'm guessing that the dr. was scolding her. i am a sensitive person and i felt very sorry for the nurse..i would have hated being scolded. would any of you call a "code" for a pt. with a HR of 20? and was the Dr. right in scolding this nurse??

I, too, am AMAZED that a non medical person would EVER be designated as a code recorder!!!:eek:

Someone needs to start thread on this one.:uhoh3:

The system is cutting corners in everyway possible.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med/Surg.
Yet another ask-a-nurse-line question from this non-nurse poster.

I will not comment on what he *thinks* *might* have transpired between an RN and an MD.

This thought occurred to me also, Altra. I debated on posting at all, but in the end I did (obviously). Next time I will probably follow this lead, though!

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Med/Surg.
altra,don't get so defensive..i may not be a nurse,but i do work at a hospital and at times i am interested in nurses imput on some cases.

I can understand this, and do indulge it, BUT....the intention of the site is "nurses talking about nursing" (at least that's what it says on the top of my screen), and if/when too many people come along that have your same train of thought, it distracts from that; that's not really fair to the nurses that post here (IMO at least).

Up Vote Up Vote ×
first let me say that i have no nursing experience..i do computer work for the huge local teaching hospital. 2 days ago i was told that i could become a "code" recorder. a "code" was announced yesturday for the Cardiac ICU and i had to be there to record the events. when the whole team showed up,the patient was awake,alert and breathing fine. it ended up being a false alarm. what happened was the new nurse just started her shift and she noticed on the monitor that this pt. had a severe bradycardic heart rate of 20 BPM. nurse said that she shaked the pts. shoulder and got no response,so she panicked and pushed the code button. as it turned out,this pt. is a very heavy sleeper and her baseline HR is very very low during sleep. after this false alarm was over,i noticed the team leader dr. talking with the nurse face to face and the nurse was wiping a tear from her eye. i'm guessing that the dr. was scolding her. i am a sensitive person and i felt very sorry for the nurse..i would have hated being scolded. would any of you call a "code" for a pt. with a HR of 20? and was the Dr. right in scolding this nurse??

Could he have been consoling her ? Guessing he was scolding her isn't the same as overhearing the conversation :) A new nurse's first code is traumatic.....

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Pediatrics.

I can't tell you how many conversations I have had with students that have brought a tear to their eye. And there was no scolding involved.

It is quite possible that the nurse was apologizing to the doctor (not that she needed to) and felt embarrassed about her judgment call (again, not that she should be).

Up Vote Up Vote ×
I can understand this, and do indulge it, BUT....the intention of the site is "nurses talking about nursing" (at least that's what it says on the top of my screen), and if/when too many people come along that have your same train of thought, it distracts from that; that's not really fair to the nurses that post here (IMO at least).

This is also a very public open forum. The OP expressed a concern for a nurse over something he/she thought he/she withnessed. The OP is also a member of the hospital team even if he does not have RN behind his/her name. The OP's question also seemed to be out of respect for nursing.

Since this is a very public forum, how we treat each other and anyone who happens to post BECAUSE it is a nursing forum, forms an opinion by those who might stumble upon this website. This website does appear on several search engines since it covers many different topics.

Also, a situation simiar to this is not that uncommon and how we respond is important. In the hospital it is not uncommon for a visitor, family member or patient to ask about something they may have witnessed or overheard. You could have patients, nurses, CNAs, various techs, doctors and visitors who could be shouting, crying or making some type of fuss in a patient care area. Being able to explain a situation without be a real turd is an art as much as it is a valued skill.

There are also closed forums where you enter by a professional membership and your real name, title and facility are posted. Those forums rarely if ever have fluff, laid back or snippy posts. They are all busines. This forum is sometimes a delightful change from the all busines attitude and to see newbies get advice from the more experienced.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Emergency Room.
Since this was a teaching hospital there might be several ways to "record a code". We record the actual code in action to be played back. There are also electronic markers on a computer screen that has all the monitored data sent to it and it takes is someone to press a button on cue. The OP might have been near the monitors where the ECG was printing. We've also had our Computer Technicians standby to limp our equipment along until a better solution is found or the equipment is replaced. They are more than capable of "recording" or ensuring the equipment continues to gather information and sometimes they are the Masters at doing this by knowing the equipment better.

quote]

Thank you! The OP might not be a nurse, but that doesn't mean he is not an expert programmer/operator of, say, patient simulators. In my little corner of the world, our medical sim-center with all of its fancy computers is run by paramedics. The OP didn't KNOW what the doc was saying just like some other posters don't KNOW that the OP is "just" a computer tech.

I believe that "scolding" (read: SHAMING) another adult is a form of lateral violence or bullying or whatever they are calling it now, regardless of whether it is a case of a doctor scolding a nurse or a bunch of nurses scolding someone for making assumptions...especially when those same nurses are assuming quite a lot themselves.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

OP, thanks for "looking out" for our/your nurses although could have really been a totally different conversation.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in OB, Med/Surg, Ortho, ICU.
Ok, so you have no idea what the doctor was saying, right? For all you know, the nurse was tearful and apologetic because she was feeling bad that she called a code and got so many people involved in a "false alarm" and the doctor was saying something along the lines of "hey it happens," "better safe than sorry," or something to that effect. You haven't described any behavior on the part of the doctor which would make it a certainty that he was scolding her.

I, too, am AMAZED that a non medical person would EVER be designated as a code recorder!!!:eek:

I agree completely! If I did that as a new nurse, I'd feel bad and maybe cry in embarrassment. I have to laugh, though, about your comment regarding a non-medical person recording. It reminds me of an occasion in the not-so-distant past where the janitor certified in CPR would give compressions. He was actually a first responder, but it looked funny when you document personnel in the code!

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Cardiac, PCU, Surg/Onc, LTC, Peds.
This is also a very public open forum. The OP expressed a concern for a nurse over something he/she thought he/she withnessed. The OP is also a member of the hospital team even if he does not have RN behind his/her name. The OP's question also seemed to be out of respect for nursing.

Since this is a very public forum, how we treat each other and anyone who happens to post BECAUSE it is a nursing forum, forms an opinion by those who might stumble upon this website. This website does appear on several search engines since it covers many different topics.

Also, a situation simiar to this is not that uncommon and how we respond is important. In the hospital it is not uncommon for a visitor, family member or patient to ask about something they may have witnessed or overheard. You could have patients, nurses, CNAs, various techs, doctors and visitors who could be shouting, crying or making some type of fuss in a patient care area. Being able to explain a situation without be a real turd is an art as much as it is a valued skill.

There are also closed forums where you enter by a professional membership and your real name, title and facility are posted. Those forums rarely if ever have fluff, laid back or snippy posts. They are all busines. This forum is sometimes a delightful change from the all busines attitude and to see newbies get advice from the more experienced.

Can you PM me the names and/ or links to the 'professional' sites b/c I like to talk business not hearsay, fluffy stuff, new grad woes and other BS. I've been a 'lurker' for many years and have to say that the quality of this site has declined significantly but I know of no other sites. So it's this or FML for ***** and giggles.

Up Vote Up Vote ×

Both nurses and physicians are independently licensed professionals. Unless a physician is the nurse's supervisor, a physician has no business reprimanding a fellow licensed professional.

The word "scolding" implies that one professional has dominion over the other. If the physician had a concern, a conversation in which the physician expresses their professional opinion on a particular circumstance would be appropriate, with the nurse also having an opportunity to express their professional opinion in return.

Up Vote Up Vote ×
Specializes in Trauma Surgery, Nursing Management.

GreyGull, thanks for posting positive words.

Guys, instead of flaming the OP for expressing concern for the nurse that was obviously emotional (granted, the OP did make the assumption that the nurse was being reprimanded by the doc) after this 'code', it would be far more constructive to ask for further clarification. I think at this point, we have made it clear to the OP that assumptions were made and the title of this thread is now a moot point.

I haven't heard of a non-medical person recording codes, but I am glad that the OP has the opportunity to witness what we do as nurses and can see first-hand all of the challenges that we face.

The OP clearly stated that s/he wasn't a nurse, but does computer work for a large hospital. Perhaps the OP is interested in a nurse's perspective? We should welcome that mindset, not reject it.

As far as the actual sequence of events, I think the nurse did exactly what she should have. I applaud those of you who wrote that it is always better to be safe than sorry. No truer words were ever spoken (uh...written)!

Up Vote Up Vote ×
+ Join the Discussion