I'm a new grad from a practical nursing program but the amount of information that I don't know far surpasses what I do.
Sadly, my little sister (23) is currently detoxing at a local correctional facility. (IV heroin and anything else she can get) I've refused to bail her out in fear that she will end up dying if she doesn't get help.
To make a long story short, I'm wondering what the chances are that she'll get any help while in there? Even just symptom management..... I just read some horror stories of people dying from withdrawals while incarcerated.....
It's been about 48 hours since she was arrested and shes telling my parents shes getting no treatment. Unfortunately, there is never any way of knowing if she is being truthful.
I am suddenly sick thinking that she could be suffering without so much as Imodium to help get her through. Mind you, I know some suffering is to be expected and even necessary, but...... I remember the day she was born, I can't handle thinking the worst....
Any info would be greatly appreciated. I think I am going to try to have her involuntarily committed to a rehab facility, but it will be weeks before she's transferred if it even works.
Sorry to be all over the place, I've been a member of AN for a long time, but I rarely make my own threads. Just really need some information for my own sanity.....
Thank you. I'm finding it difficult to put my nurse hat on. She's 48 hours in, so I'm hoping the worst is over, but who knows.
As someone who knows this from up close and personal, the worst is not over. It's only getting started. "She won't die from detox" is a heartless thing to say, as heroin withdrawal can come with all kinds of complications including severe dehydration, and is one of the most miserable medical conditions. And it is a medical condition, despite what some people want to believe. She can insist on medical treatment, but I don't know how far she will get as every jail is different. She needs an attorney to try to get her into a treatment facility, so that's what I would focus on. I'm praying for her.
I worked corrections, albeit prison and not jail. In my prison, opiate users don't get any special treatment for detox except for perhaps an infirmary stay for a couple days through the worst of it. The first 2-3 days (in my experience) are the hardest, but the withdrawal symptoms do last for 7-14 days.
If she was one of the very very very very few that seizes or has other issues from opiate withdrawal (usually caused by them also being benzo addicted and not bothering to tell us, not actually from opiates), she would be transferred to a hospital.
People die from benzo withdrawal and alcohol withdrawal. An opiate user will feel like they got hit with a six ton bag of bricks, food poisoning, and swine flu all at the same time, but they won't die from it. That's why most states/most hospitals do not consider opiate withdrawal an appropriate admitting diagnosis unless there are obvious complications.
Withdrawal symptoms can last months or years after acute withdrawal. That's what makes addiction so hard to treat. Acute withdrawal symptoms will sneak up on the addict even years later, and the irrational thoughts are almost impossible to push away. The laws are decades behind the research, and need to be changed.
Specializes in Corrections and Occupational Health.
I have worked in a detox unit in a local jail and we had standing orders for detox inmates. We started an IV's and then gave different medication per the drug/alcohol abuse. Monitored every 1-2 hours when they first come in. But the jail I worked out I could everyone on the detox program from my desk. I know it is a hard road but sometimes "tough love" helps but that person has to be willing too.
As someone who knows this from up close and personal, the worst is not over. It's only getting started. "She won't die from detox" is a heartless thing to say, as heroin withdrawal can come with all kinds of complications including severe dehydration, and is one of the most miserable medical conditions. And it is a medical condition, despite what some people want to believe. She can insist on medical treatment, but I don't know how far she will get as every jail is different. She needs an attorney to try to get her into a treatment facility, so that's what I would focus on. I'm praying for her.
Why is it heartless? I work with people in heroin withdrawal daily. I've never seen had a death from it. No doubt there is suffering and I have sympathy for them but we treat any GI symptoms and monitor for dehydration with labs and we have never even needed IV therapy.
Why is it heartless? I work with people in heroin withdrawal daily. I've never seen had a death from it. No doubt there is suffering and I have sympathy for them but we treat any GI symptoms and monitor for dehydration with labs and we have never even needed IV therapy.
Withdrawal from a substance is a medical problem, no different from any other medical problem. Would you say "she won't die from it" when talking about c diff? Or severe gastroenteritis? To toss it off with "she won't die from it" is heartless because the insinuation is that she deserves it, or brought it on herself. Deciding that is outside our scope. Don't judge -- addiction doesn't discriminate, and you never know who it will hit.
Withdrawal from a substance is a medical problem, no different from any other medical problem. Would you say "she won't die from it" when talking about c diff? Or severe gastroenteritis? To toss it off with "she won't die from it" is heartless because the insinuation is that she deserves it, or brought it on herself. Deciding that is outside our scope. Don't judge -- addiction doesn't discriminate, and you never know who it will hit.
It's nothing of the sort. It has nothing to do with blame. Yes, I would tell people with gastroenteritis and c diff that they most likely won't die from it. Seems to me that might be of comfort to them. When I have been ill with norovirus or a nasty rhinovirus I am glad to hear that although I am suffering, I am not dying. I'm just weird that way.
I agree with everyone else who've already said this: opiates (though painful) won't kill her - ETOH, and benzodiazepines if left untreated would cause untold havoc (at the very least seizure activity would occur with those last two).
I'm so sorry you are suffering so much with your decision, but you may have possibly saved her life. You're a loving, caring sister, and hopefully one day she will come out on the other end of this stronger, wiser, and clean to tell you so. It may not be for a while though.
I grew up with parents who abused just about everything: it cut their lives much shorter. Addiction doesn't discriminate - it's happy to welcome anyone of any color, creed, nationality, age, and financial status. It's an equal opportunity destroyer, happy to accept anyone at it's table.
Good luck to you and your family. I'll say a little prayer for you all.
I work in a male prison...we get a LOT of Parole Violators who are high when they get to us and then we Detox them for a few days...most of them are opiate addicts and a few ETOH addicts. I tell them they're gonna feel like death warmed over for a few days...there are drugs we can give for nausea (zofran) or if it's really bad a shot of IM Phenergan. But that's about it. We have standing orders for clonidine if their score on the COWS(clinical opiate withdrawl scale) is over 10.
For the most part though, they just gotta suck it up...some of them get taken back to the CC Center(community corrections) once they're stable..and some don't.
I worked as a jail house nurse for 5 years. Yes, I have seen Heroin addicts die. Every person is different and every person does withdraw differently. Bottom line either way is does she want to be clean? Because it will not matter whether she is in or out people find a way to get high, if she does not want to be free of the devil of addiction. Best wishes to you.
Finally a nurse who realizes that people do indeed die sometimes from opiates and withdrawal from them. I was beginning to wonder if I was the only nurse ever to have heard of such.
OP - how is your sis? How are you? You really can call or go to the Nurse Director, Chief Nurse, Chief Physician, Head Custody official and learn what they do about detoxing addicts in your area's jail/prison. If it's a county, state, or city official, go to the officials of that jurisdiction if you get no satisfaction from going directly to the facility. You are a citizen, you are entitled to know. They use public funds and you are a member of the public. Get your elected representatives involved if need be. I don't think it will be too hard to get the info you seek.
Inmates who are ill, for whatever reason, can be housed in the infirmary or sent to an outside hospital. Being humane was the rule where I worked, even if only to prevent lawsuits from inmates dying. Not to be cold about it, sorry. But truly most people I worked with cared and did their best to treat inmates, including detoxers, properly, the way we would want to be treated if we were detoxing.
I don't know the legalities where you live but you seem to. Go for it. Try to help your sister. And God bless. I know it's hard.
Oh, Glycerine, I'm not a corrections or psych nurse but you have my heart & prayers! I'm not even close to my sister at this stage in life but if I thought she were going through something like that I would be emotionally distraught for her as well. There's just something about your sister...
i I pray she is both able to get help and also ready to accept that help before it's too late! ::hugs:;
Finally a nurse who realizes that people do indeed die sometimes from opiates and withdrawal from them. I was beginning to wonder if I was the only nurse ever to have heard of such.
OP - how is your sis? How are you? You really can call or go to the Nurse Director, Chief Nurse, Chief Physician, Head Custody official and learn what they do about detoxing addicts in your area's jail/prison. If it's a county, state, or city official, go to the officials of that jurisdiction if you get no satisfaction from going directly to the facility. You are a citizen, you are entitled to know. They use public funds and you are a member of the public. Get your elected representatives involved if need be. I don't think it will be too hard to get the info you seek.
Inmates who are ill, for whatever reason, can be housed in the infirmary or sent to an outside hospital. Being humane was the rule where I worked, even if only to prevent lawsuits from inmates dying. Not to be cold about it, sorry. But truly most people I worked with cared and did their best to treat inmates, including detoxers, properly, the way we would want to be treated if we were detoxing.
I don't know the legalities where you live but you seem to. Go for it. Try to help your sister. And God bless. I know it's hard.
Let me re-phrase. Not "most" people where I worked, but all the people did their best to help inmates. Both Custody staff and Medical/Nursing personnel. being only human, we might have felt anger toward inmates sometimes, but we never intentionally denied them proper care. We might have resented the expenditure of taxpayer dollars, especially for repeat offenders, sex offenders, and for inmates who had done wrong to children, but expend dollars we did.
Hi there, sorry to hear about your sis. I worked in an acute 24 bed detox unit for several years and have managed more withdrawals than I can remember. As for actual danger associated with opiate withdrawal, it has a very low risk, much lower than alcohol or benzos. Typically, the withdrawal from heroin is awful on the patient as they are depleted of their bodies natural pain-killers, so every minor ache that we shrug off feel terrible, that, and they are often nutrient depleted, so they have a tendency to have cramped legs and feel horrible. The good news is, with rest, vitamins, and decent food, this period will only last for a few days and extremely rarely needs any serious medical intervention. Probably the most valuable resource for your sister is to seek counselling to find and deal with the original pain (psychological/physical) that heroin allowed her an escape from, I find this is the key to coming back from an addiction...all the best for you and your sister.
Kristiernbsn
69 Posts
As someone who knows this from up close and personal, the worst is not over. It's only getting started. "She won't die from detox" is a heartless thing to say, as heroin withdrawal can come with all kinds of complications including severe dehydration, and is one of the most miserable medical conditions. And it is a medical condition, despite what some people want to believe. She can insist on medical treatment, but I don't know how far she will get as every jail is different. She needs an attorney to try to get her into a treatment facility, so that's what I would focus on. I'm praying for her.