Clarkson College ED.D. program

khanna123 · Dec 26, 2021

Did you ever find out anything else about Clarkson? I do not know about them, but I have read through some old posts and saw you were looking at PhD/DNP/EdD--just as I have been doing. I wanted to see your thoughts on Clarkson? I need to look into it. I am very interested in the EdD route for teaching! Thanks!!

lyndsay1985 · Dec 27, 2021

Hello Khanna123,

I am really intrigued with the EdD route for education as I feel it speaks for true teaching and what I am looking to accomplish.

However, I will say when I am looking at nursing instructor position postings - I am literally seeing "remote nurse teaching jobs" -seriously look through indeed.com. that will actually take a Masters degree but it's specific to FNP's only and I cant help but think what a slap to those of us who have taken the masters of nursing education degree program. I also think what a slap too that universities who pump out these degrees will not hire remote master degree nurse educators - do they not stand behind or believe in the education they promote?

But off my tangent, the other postings that I see requiring a doctorate degree really speak loud to DNP's. So, I am on the fence if I should just take a DNP route versus a ED.D.

But Clarkson College looks to be a really good program. They claim that you can do your research completely online. They also require a service requirement in their leadership course which is basically like doing community service so an example would be like getting a team of people together to run a bake sale at the local church, or get a team of people together to do a blood pressure check booth in your community. It seems like its completely doable. I havent met anyone to give me any insight or indepth review of this program though. I don't know many people who actually have thier doctorate....Im navigating myself alone on this one! LOL

but Im happy to help if you have any specific questions!

khanna123 · Dec 28, 2021

Thank you for your response. I too, have been doing a lot of research and at this point I think this is what I am going to do: I am hoping to attend Liberty University's online MSN to DNP program. I have my MSN in Nursing Admin--so I know I still need the 3 P's and possibly a few of the Core classes prior to starting the DNP work. From everything I can tell, I am going to need a DNP or PhD to teach in nursing. I do want my FNP so getting a DNP makes sense. I plan to add on the Education courses to be able to take the CNE. Have you taken the CNE since your MSN is in Nursing ED? If not, why not? A lot of job postings say they would prefer to see the CNE.

Also, I really like the flexibility of Liberty's online program. They have accelerated 8 week courses and 12 week courses. I am paying out of pocket for this degree and want no debt. They are willing to work with me on this in terms of timing for classes. Full Time for a graduate program is $595 per credit hour. There are 2 onsite week long intensives for this degree. They are spread out. I think I can work that around my family and work responsibilities. I work from home 25ish hours per week in nursing and can move some work to a different week if needed.

I am still waiting to hear if I am accepted into this program. I am hoping to start Jan 10th. If not, March 14th is the next start date. Good luck to you and I would like to hear your thoughts on the CNE certification and if you think it is worth it if we want to teach?

lyndsay1985 · Dec 29, 2021

Khanna,

That sounds Great! I am sure you will be accepted into Liberty's online program!

Another tidbit for your own personal thoughts as I have heard this but I am not sure as to "how true it is" but that if you are wanting to teach in a university setting that "tenure" is not offered to DNP teachers. Again, I am not sure and I don't want to spread false misleading information but I did hear of this and so I am not sure how to navigate that?

As for myself, I graduated MSN nurse educator program at the time becasue the CNE is also brand new certification you needed two full years of teaching experience in a academic setting in order to apply to take the test. Therefore it's been something that yes! I definitely wanted to take but didn't think I was eligible quite yet. My other smalltown girl problems that I have is that I happened to live in a very remote village! I had more than full expectations to move from this area in which I could work in a brick and mortar building however Covid struck and other life responsibilities have plagued me. In the meantime I have been looking for maybe something teaching online as a side hustle until I can locate elsewhere but that has not boded me very well. I was also thinking that If I am in a rut here that I could always go back for the doctorate degree and that is what I have been debating as to what is the best move for myself until my circumstances change.

However, after I seen your post asking me about the CNE certification I decided to look back and it has been revised as of July 1, 2021. The eligibility requirements have changed and therefore I am eligible now to receive this and this gives me hope and Yes I am definitely looking into taking this. I will post the link here:

This handbook contains information about the Certified Nurse Educator Examination developed by the National League for Nursing (nln.org)

http://www.nln.org/docs/default-source/default-document-library/cne-handbook-2021_revised_07-01-2021.pdf?sfvrsn=2

Eligibility Requirements Pursuing certification as an Academic Nurse Educator – designated as CNE -- should be a goal for those who have carefully reviewed the test blueprint and the eligibility requirements and determine that their educational and experiential qualifications have provided sufficient opportunity to participate meaningfully in the full scope of the faculty role.

All eligibility criteria for initial certification must be met at the time of application.

Option A: Must meet criteria 1 & 2

1. Licensure: Documentation of valid licensure/ certificate or other documentation of unencumbered practice in the country of residence.

2. Education: A master’s or doctoral degree in nursing with:

• a major emphasis in nursing education or

• post-master’s certificate in nursing education or

• nine or more credit hours of graduate-level education courses

* Examples of acceptable graduate-level education courses include: Curriculum Development and Evaluation; Instructional Design; Principles of Adult Learning; Assessment/Measurement & Evaluation; Principles of Teaching and Learning; Instructional Technology.

NOTE: Graduate-level research or statistics courses do not count toward this requirement.

Option B: Must meet criteria 1, 2 & 3

1. Licensure: Documentation of valid licensure/ certificate or other documentation of unencumbered practice in the country of residence.

2. Education: A master’s or doctoral degree in nursing (with a major emphasis in a role other than nursing education).

3. Experience: Two years or more employment in a nursing program in an academic institution within the last five years.

Disclaimer The Certified Nurse Educator exam was developed to measure competence in the full scope of the academic nurse educator practice role. Even though the CNE® eligibility criteria have been expanded to include new graduates of master’s and doctoral programs focused in nursing education, the test itself was not developed as a measure of graduate program outcomes. Any individual who wishes to appeal the determination of compliance with CNE® eligibility requirements must submit a written request with supporting documentation. For more information please email [email protected] or call (618) 534-0294

I will also let you know too that I went back to school and received my post masters graduate certificate in nursing administration.

So I know you stated your masters was in nursing administration is Liberty University's DNP program in Nursing Education? I know there are DNP nurse educator programs out there like Regis University and whatnot - I think would qualify you for option A pathway.

But too if you are in a regular DNP program than I would make sure to take those graduate teaching courses. I think having a CNE would make you a more attractive candidate to an employer.

Plus in a realistic logical perspective I read the average age of the nursing instructor is 63 years - so these people are looking to retire and rightfully so. I don't believe they are going to go through and take the certification when one they are getting ready to retire and two to prove to do a job they have been doing for x amount of years. So I think for us coming into the profession it's probably a good move to have in order to stay competitive.

Thanks for drawing my attention back to this as like I said I looked at it a couple of years ago and thought I couldnt do it yet and now I can so I have hope for this I am going to be looking into this a lot harder too!

I wish you all the best luck!!

professorcait, BSN, MSN, RN · Feb 26, 2022

I will be graduating in May with my EdD with an emphasis in Nursing Education from Bryan College of Health Sciences. I wanted an option that would still allow me to qualify for tenure at most institutions while also having an education focus. This has been one of the best educational experiences, and I highly recommend! The EdD was actually the first doctoral degree offered to nurses, and it is making a comeback. It definitely focuses on education, so if you are interested in academia, I certainly recommend considering this degree.

lyndsay1985 · Feb 26, 2022

Hello Professor Cait,

Congratulations, that is so wonderful! Yes, If I do return to school for a doctorate, I will plan on the educational doctorate route. However, I do have a random question for you when researching for your dissertation-Are you able to apply secondary research into your study? The main reason I am asking is that I live so remotely, and I am worried that if I am to go further in my education from a practical sense will I be able to complete or perform it... The nearest community college is on the other side of the state and whatnot. So that is what is holding me back and makes me a little nervous to continue.

I hope that you could provide me with some insight.

Thank you for your reply,

Lyndsay

professorcait, BSN, MSN, RN · Mar 9, 2022

Hi Lyndsay,

Thanks! As of last Friday, I was officially done after a successful defense (yay!). So my study methods involved an emailed survey with a few questionnaires. I did not have personal contact with my participants. I definitely think you can do that in a remote location. Many of my peers did qualitative, but even then most were done virtually.

Good luck with your educational journey - and please let me know if you have any other questions!

lyndsay1985 · Mar 18, 2022

Thank you for this insight!! so helpful!!

HOPEforRNs, ADN, BSN, MSN · Mar 20, 2022

Hi! I am currently an EdD student at Clarkson College. It's a WONDERFUL program, and I couldn't be happier. They are a well-respected nonprofit school that is affiliated with Nebraska Medicine. The program is 100% online, and you are not required to go to campus. All courses are asynchronous. The cohorts are small, and I have really gotten to know my classmates and professors. They are personable and take the time to provide high-quality and personalized feedback on your assignments. They work hard to ensure all coursework is valuable and not just busywork. You certainly do not always feel like an online student because of the intimate nature of the program. I frequently meet with professors via Zoom as well.

The service-learning project is any volunteer activity in your community where you take a leadership role. For mine, I led a planning committee at my church for a particular event. It is not a big or involved thing and could simply be a one-time or single-day activity.

The dissertation is very structured and well-supported. You often hear of students being "all but dissertation" but never finishing. It's a unique approach, but Clarkson provides a lot more guidance and support through your dissertation than most programs, leading to a much higher graduation rate.

I'm happy to chat more or answer any other questions you have!

londonflo · Mar 21, 2022

On 12/28/2021 at 6:42 PM, lyndsay1985 said:

The Certified Nurse Educator exam was developed to measure competence in the full scope of the academic nurse educator practice role.

I have never understood this rationale for having a specific test to measure (again) what you learned and practiced in your MSN program.(my 2 year MSN program concluded with a 4 hour comprehensive essay(s) test that required me to provide the theories (quoting and applying), research based strategies, evaluation methods, various methods of test construction etc. into my teaching role. Are MSN programs not teaching and evaluating the acquisition of knowledge anymore? Is the graduate of a MSN Education program not prepared upon graduation to actually teach? Yes they are novices but communicating with colleagues will provide new insights. I just think this test was just created to be a another money source. It preys on those looking for an academic job, wanting to enhance their CV.

HOPEforRNs, ADN, BSN, MSN · Mar 21, 2022

Just now, londonflo said:

I have never understood this rationale for having a specific test to measure (again) what you learned and practiced in your MSN program.(my 2 year MSN program concluded with a 4 hour comprehensive essay(s) test that required me to provide the theories (quoting and applying), research based strategies, evaluation methods, various methods of test construction etc. into my teaching role. Are MSN programs not teaching and evaluating the acquisition of knowledge anymore? Is the graduate of a MSN Education program not prepared upon graduation to actually teach? Yes they are novices but communicating with colleagues will provide new insights. I just think this test was just created to be a another money source. It preys on those looking for an academic job, wanting to enhance their CV.

I 100% agree. The certification makes sense for many because most educators do not have an MSN in nursing education or a post-masters certificate. It's a great way to show expertise. However, it seems unnecessary for those with formal educational preparation in nursing education. It's also an extremely difficult test with a high failure rate and it is a ton of work to renew every 5 years.