Hey everyone, I need some advice concerning a new online BSN and FNP program. This program is allowing RN's and chiropractors direct entry into their BSN program. After one year the student will sit for their boards and if they pass, they continue with the NP Program for one year. The program is through Mid America and Hardin-Simmons University in Texas.
I have been a chiropractor for 11 years and I am looking to leave the profession. I am planning to go back to school to become a NP or PA. I am a little concerned about the online BSN and NP Program. Is a student adequately trained by an online course compared to learning in a classroom? You have some hands on training and you have to go through your rotations, but I am not convinced the student is ready to care for patients without more on the job training.
My goal as an NP or PA is to work in orthopedics or emergency medicine. How many NP's work as first assistants in the OR or the the ER? While I am taking some prerequisites classes, I am planning to get my paramedic certification and get some experience outside of the chiropractic field.
LOL...Sounds like your back peddling. Did they decide to give you a kickback?
i got a cashiers check this morning.:) No. i still think mid america raped me, but i like the instructors i have at wayland. I would tell everyone though to get their generals done at a community college or somewhere else. BYU offers gen ed english, history and goverment courses for four hundred dollars for three credits instead of the 800 dollars that wayland charges. THey screw us with all the extra general ed courses.
Glad I found this thread. I am a recent chiropractor, only been practicing for a year, who is considering the NP route. My husband is also a chiropractor and completed the Mid-America program this past May and is currently enrolled in the NP program at Samford. As others, he had mixed experiences with MAL and Hardin-Simmons. For the most part, the clinicians were pretty good but there were some not so great experiences with the administration.
Clinicals were in TX and we were living in OR at the time. He had to do five 10-day rotations and there were times when, with little notice, the dates/locations of these trips were changed giving him little time (and costing him extra money) to make changes. The admin really didn't seem to care how this impacted the students who were out of state.
There were also issues with MAL and Hardin-Simmons... obviously because they are now working with Wayland. My husband heard rumours that MAL was charging them $30k, pocketing most of the money, and only passing on a much smaller portion of that to HS. This then impacted the students because money was not available to secure the appropriate faculty to lead them during their clinicals. Again, this was what he heard through the grapevine.
The program was rigorous and when he finished he passed the NCLEX no problem. He did put a tremendous about of time into studying and it paid off.
A word of caution: it is EXTREMELY hard to get a job as an RN right now. Most hospitals have hiring freezes or are only taking new grads from colleges they have contracts with. Most other jobs (travel nursing, home care, etc.) require a minimum of 2 yrs experience. So don't think you will walk right into your first RN job. It took my husband several months before he was lucky enough to get a job as a home health nurse. He spends 3 hrs a day in the car making not great pay per visit, not mileage reimbursement and TONs of paperwork. If you don't believe me just look at some of the other threads on this board... I just read one about someone who was still looking for a job a year post-grad.
So far his experience with Samford has been much better than MAL and HS. There is a system in place and it seems to be working. Some issues have arisen over changing dates with travel commitments to AL, but nothing like before. His biggest problem has been with the preceptorships. You are responsible for securing your own "internship" each semester with a different focus each time. He has had a hell of a time with this. He called/emailed/visited over 50 MD/DO/NPs before finding someone who was interested. One NP even asked him what was in it for her if she agreed to host him for the 240 required hours for the quarter. Even UofA is sending their NP students to Phoenix for lack of options here in town. Most of his friends in the program had little trouble due to having a professional relationship in place with someone in their town who agreed ahead of time. This first one was Family Practice, the next is OBGYN. He has already been told that as a male he is going to have a really hard time finding this placement and he has already begun looking for June.
So yes, despite all this I am considering my options. I am not super keen on dealing with MAL/WB at this point, especially since the length of the program increased. Additionally, since it is a Christian school there is required religious coursework that I'm not dying to take. My husband took his online through BYU and it was a TON of work... sometimes more work than his RN classes.
My community college is backed up til 2015 for the Associate degree, so that will not be an option for me. UA has an accelerated 15-month program, but I have been reading some pretty horrible things about it on this site so I am not sure about that either.
Has anyone had a more recent experience with Excelsior? They seem to be the only entirely on-line based program I have found. I can't get a handle on how long it will take or how much it will cost as of yet. Any other options to get the BSN portion that people know about? Does anyone have anything good to say about Wayland?
Sorry this was such a long post and I hope I added valuable information. If anyone has questions for my husband I would be happy to get them answered.
Excelsior doesn't work with chiropractors anymore. you have to at least have an LVN degree and it is actually more of a hassle. My buddy did, Hardins simmons and he said it was a pain with clinicals. WBU has all our clinicals scheduled out for the entire two years so that is nice. If you have questions shoot me a message
most of the people in my class all still have busy practices. Some people do this program because they are new grads or don't have busy practices and are struggling, but all the ones i have worked with in the program, we all have busy practices. There is one guy who is doing it because he is sick of paying an NP to work in his office. None of us are looking for RN jobs. In some ways i am glad i waited until the switch to Wayland, because the clinicals are organized, but i am upset about the increase then the decrease in price. AS always our warning is get everything in writing from MAL. If they say they are going to have clinicals in a certain place, get it in writing. Otherwise it is he said she said. The religion courses and extra gen eds are Waylands requirements not MAL. SO gen eds you can do at BYU online, but the religion courses have to be done from a Baptist school so it is easier to just do those ones through Wayland.
Sorry this was such a long post and I hope I added valuable information. If anyone has questions for my husband I would be happy to get them answered.
How long had your husband been in practice before starting MAL's program? Also I assume he doesn't practice anymore, but he is working, so how does Samford fit with his work schedule? My cohort will start at samford next year so we are curious. What is the course load like and so on. How does it compare to the BSN while working in terms of time comittment? Are the classes more read and test, or are there a lot of papers? I assume with the preceptorship there is a lot of focus on the clinical hours, but is it more of a clinical focus with checklist of things to do and see, or does your husband just sit back follow and take notes... just wondering?
How long had your husband been in practice before starting MAL's program? Also I assume he doesn't practice anymore, but he is working, so how does Samford fit with his work schedule? My cohort will start at samford next year so we are curious. What is the course load like and so on. How does it compare to the BSN while working in terms of time commitment? Are the classes more read and test, or are there a lot of papers? I assume with the preceptorship there is a lot of focus on the clinical hours, but is it more of a clinical focus with checklist of things to do and see, or does your husband just sit back follow and take notes... just wondering?
He actually started the program during the last two quarters of chiropractic school. He knew even then that NP what the right route for him. Once he graduated he continued MAL while starting up his own chiro practice and working as a personal trainer. After graduating and passing the NCLEX he was able to get a job working as a home health RN. Between patient visits, driving and paperwork he is probably putting in 30-35 hrs a week. He doesn't feel he could work any more than this and still have time for schoolwork. He puts in 2-4 hrs of studying everyday as well. The first quarter was in the summer he had 3 courses which was a nightmare since the summer quarter is shorter than the others. Samford has said they won't do that again so likely you won't have the same situation. Overall he feels the Samford program requires more time commitment than the MAL BSN. Additionally the courses are harder and require more studying.
He has only had one paper so far and is under the impression there will only be 3 total during the entire program. The biggest time committment is preparing for the physical exam validation during the second quarter. You have to prepare a full body/system PE from memory including not only the required tests, but also explain all the positives and negatives of each. You have 60 mins to do this. He was allowed to do this at home by DVD and submit it, but Samford has said that from here on out it will be conducted on campus in person. Which he said will actually be better. To prepare for this he studied an extra 1-2 hrs per day for 4 weeks on top of the studying required by the coursework.
The preceptorship is a big commitment as well--3 quarters of 240 hrs each. You will have to find your own host which has been a huge struggle. He will start his first one in Jan. His understanding is you are expected to see patients, take histories, consult with the clinician, make his recommendations and the clinician will then handle the actual treatment and follow-up with the patient. It is NOT expected to be observation and note taking. I think this is why he had such trouble finding one because not many MD/NPs wanted to take on the time commitment required to mentor him and in their own words "not get anything out of it" for themselves. He will continue to work 2.5 days a week at his current job and then spend 2.5 days a week at his preceptorship.
I am SERIOUSLY considering the WB program myself and would love any information you can give to me on it. Especially regarding course-load, traveling and hidden costs. Now that you are in the program, is there anything you wish you had done differently or known ahead of time? It seems this is the only online/distance program I can find... unless anyone else has come across anything?
If you have any other questions my husband said feel free to contact him and he would be happy to answer them via phone. Shoot us a pm and he will send you his phone info. His best advice is to try to steer clear of the numerous negative and disgruntled DCs you will come across in the program--it will help your morale and keep you from getting stressed out unnecessarily. He has no regrets so far about the path he has chosen.
I disagree with Drs preferring PA's in the OR...we have plenty of NP's in the OR where I work!
Interesting. I have not seen that. In my experience, NPs play a significant role in the medical clearance and the post op care, but not during the operation itself.
I work in New York where even the RNFAs do not play a significant role. I also worked in a teaching hospital, so first assisting was usually done by a resident.
Im currently in the BSN program at Wayland baptist. So far so good.. There has been some screw ups with clinical and they didnt get the message out fast enough before some of us went to San Antonio and no where to go. They said there going to pay us 500 discount for next quarter tuition. I hear the Mid america is going to California and is partnering up with a school there. I hope it really does b/c I live in CA and I wont have to travel to San Antonio every month for clinicals. I'm planning on going to get my FNP at St Josephs in Maine when I finish my BSN. I'm open to respond to any comments related to things that are going on at Wayland now. I also might apply to the CRNA programs if my grades are good enough to get in. The PA route will be faster for some of you but the BSN route is a forsure thing for most. The only draw back is all the additional Gen ed courses that I have to take. The good thing about it is that you can finish them up at a correspondance school while your getting your BSN. NO lost time. I'll let everyone know the minute the BNS opens up in CA, associated with Mid America.
I believe what you are describing is that the Direct-entry BSN part of the program allows you to finish the BSN portion in 1 year and take the NCLEX, thereby becoming a licensed RN. Then you continue on to finish up your MSN/FNP. I would assume that if this program is also open to already-licensed RNs, that they would be exempt from taking the licensure exam at the 1 year mark.
As far as online-based education, many have done it and have had no trouble practicing. It all depends on the amount and quality of clinical time/education this particular program offers. I personally chose a classroom-based program for my NNP degree, because I lack the personal discipline to do classwork from home. Many have chosen the online route in order to maintain their current job, as well as have flexibility with family issues, childcare, etc...
ER's and ORs do hire NPs. You may need additional certifications to work as a first assistant in the OR. (I'm not sure, since it's not my field) NPs and PAs in the ER tend to work primarily in fast-track, pediatric and urgent-care areas....(at least in my experience)
You need to do what's best for you. If you find that this program offers solid clinical time, and you feel you can be accountable for learning and retaining info online, then go for it!
Best of luck!
Stevern21
Do you need to get additional training to work in the ER or Orthopedics as a FNP... I am still confused if PA dont need additional training or schooling and can jump right into the ER or Ortho. I might get accepted into PA this coming year and was wondering if I should not do the NP program and just the PA route?? I would love any info on this.
backtalkdoc
27 Posts
i got a cashiers check this morning.:) No. i still think mid america raped me, but i like the instructors i have at wayland. I would tell everyone though to get their generals done at a community college or somewhere else. BYU offers gen ed english, history and goverment courses for four hundred dollars for three credits instead of the 800 dollars that wayland charges. THey screw us with all the extra general ed courses.