Here's what AAs really think of CRNAs - page 11
And this comes from the PRESIDENT of the American Society of Anesthesiologist Assistants Again, assertions that AAs and CRNAs function at the same level -absolutely misleading. And, what's... Read More
May 6, '04Occupation: ADN student Joined: Oct '02; Posts: 84; Likes: 1Yes Alansmith, I agree with you. It is getting overrun by the "global allnurses.com network." Some posters are making remarks that make no sense. While I am a nursing student just finishing my ADN, I went into nursing for the sole purpose of pursuing a career as a CRNA. This forum and its continuous availability has been of great value to me. I appreciate Georgia bringing "the other side" to the table. It's been very enlightening. Thank you Georgia. To be honest though, I do view your job as a threat to my future career. As many have stated, I am sure you are quite competent in what you do. I harbor no ill will towards you as a person. I do believe I would be naive in saying that we can all work side by side down the road- no troubles. However, I will be hard pressed to work in a hospital that employs AA's because I do want to protect my job. Once I'm in the door and they bring them on later, well we'll cross that bridge when I come to it. But for me personally, it's job security - nothing more, nothing less. And I hope nobody in their right mind misconstrues that statement. Of course, patient safety is always number one. But we as professional nurses (or soon-to-be thereof) know that's a given. It really shouldn't even have to be brought up.
One last thing - there are so many of you in this forum that are personal mentors to me and you don't even know it - alansmith, loisane, athomas91, that's just to mention a few on this particular thread. I enjoy reading and learning from your comments here. No need to thank me - just keep posting.
May 6, '04Joined: Oct '03; Posts: 79Quote from deepzthey know that we crnas see through their bs. we all know who does the real work. it's our shared 'secret' -- something akin to the way pedophiles have 'secrets' with their victims. don't tell, or else. they have the power to fire us on a whim. and they do. they also pocket the major share of the cash. yes, it's fraudulent. all of which drives them to resent us at the same time that they exploit us. it's truly sick.
did you really just compare mdas to pedophiles? i can see you read the book how to win friends and influence people.
[font='times new roman']have to applied for a position on the aana lobbing team?
May 6, '04Specialty: Anesthesia ; Joined: Oct '03; Posts: 630; Likes: 61Quote from user69Oh please, 69, have you never heard of metaphor and simile? If not, you can look them up in the dictionary. It's a comparison of modes of ABUSE. Many group practices controlled by MDAs are like (sorry) Pimps 'n' Ho's, a stable of workhorses exploited and ABUSED by MDAs in big hats, jewels and Cadillacs.....Did you really just compare MDAs to pedophiles? ....
I hope that you, if you become a CRNA in the future, are never mistreated and abused as I, and as many of my peers, have been in the past. Not to mention those pitiful AAs.
I said, "They know that we CRNAs see through their BS. We all know who does the real work. It's our shared 'secret' -- something akin to the way pedophiles have 'secrets' with their victims. Don't tell, or else. They have the power to fire us on a whim."
Perhaps you could read it again? There'll be a test at the end.....
May 6, '04Occupation: SAHM, pre-med student, potential world leader Joined: Feb '04; Posts: 1,172; Likes: 12Quote from iliket3what?Yes Alansmith, I agree with you. It is getting overrun by the "global allnurses.com network." Some posters are making remarks that make no sense. While I am a nursing student just finishing my ADN, I went into nursing for the sole purpose of pursuing a career as a CRNA.
granted there were a few post injected IMHO to add some levity to a hostile conversation. For the most part this has been a highly informative albiet contraversial thread....
i too am focused on getting my CRNA and am gaining insight into what the future holds. I now understand the differences between an AA and a CRNA and am hoping that any threat that AA's pose to the postition of CRNA are cancelled out in light of the differences in scope of practice.
What can I as a nurse/student/activist do to assist in maintaining the future of CRNAs? This comes from a student, mom of 3 and part time nurse...
If anyone can post some links I would greatly appreciate it...
one busy as h#ll mama,
May 6, '04Occupation: RN Joined: Nov '03; Posts: 4,389; Likes: 153Quote from athomas91I'm not a kid, and I'm not naive. I'm a 42 year old nursing student working on a second career. I've been around the block a few times. And I've known plenty of legislators, congressmen and senators in three states, as well as Washington, D.C. where I lived for eight years. I know the realities of how politics and government works. And I still think CRNA's need better arguments than what's been presented here, at least in the context of what the states are going to do on this issue.i will say one thing to you lizz...i remember when i was younger..i too believed that "there was always a better way"...but then real life slapped me in the face and i realized that you cannot fight deceptive maneuvering with good hearted hopes.
GeorigaAA and Gregsto: Thank you for posting. Some of us do appreciate the information, even if others were overtly hostile.
I realize that CRNA's have dealt with a lot crap from MDA's over the years, and that there's probably a lot of justified resentment there. But, at the same time, I think it's unfortunate that people from the other side have been chased away from the discussion. I would have liked to learn more.
Last edit by Sheri257 on May 6, '04
May 6, '04Specialty: Anesthesia ; Joined: Oct '03; Posts: 630; Likes: 61Quote from lizz....I realize that CRNA's have dealt with a lot crap from MDA's over the years, and that there's probably a lot of justified resentment there. But, at the same time, I think it's unfortunate that people from the other side have been chased away from the discussion......
Oh now, hold your horses, Lizz. Don't pout just yet. Georgia will be back, I'm sure, soon as he get the OK on what to say from his boss Doc supervisor.
May 6, '04Occupation: RN Joined: Nov '03; Posts: 4,389; Likes: 153Quote from deepzC'mon Deepz. Can't you lighten up just a little? Why should they post? It's only an opportunity for you insult them some more.Oh now, hold your horses, Lizz. Don't pout just yet. Georgia will be back, I'm sure, soon as he get the OK on what to say from his boss Doc supervisor.
I realize that most of us haven't had the same experiences as you. And that your opinions are probably justified, at least to some extent. But are we here to learn more about this issue, or just insult AA's?
Last edit by Sheri257 on May 6, '04
May 6, '04Specialty: Anesthesia ; Joined: Oct '03; Posts: 630; Likes: 61Quote from lizz....are we here to learn more about this issue, or just insult AA's?
Perhaps you missed the beginning of this thread, Lizz, which was in regard to a letter filled with insults for CRNAs by the perennial president of the AA group, a letter which has been recycled through many of the newspapers in Florida, perpetuating the same insults to the practice, the integrity and the safety of CRNAs. Remember? Anesthesia nurse, anesthesia nurse, anesthesia nurse?
This ain't beanbag. Sorry.
And this is a CRNA forum. I'm positive that, if you wish to learn what the other side has to say in more depth, there are other forums where you can learn about AAs.
Personally, I'll be there with the crowd at the State line to meet them with a hayfork. Yeah, just like the villagers in 'Frankenstein.'
May 6, '04Occupation: RN Joined: Nov '03; Posts: 4,389; Likes: 153Yeah, and this AANA ad isn't insulting?
Seems to be plenty of mudslinging from both sides.
Oh well, rant on. For some reason, I didn't realize this was the "AA Bashing" forum which required AA bashing posts, only.
May 6, '04Occupation: CRNA Joined: Aug '03; Posts: 1,188; Likes: 26Woah.....
i don't remember "slinging mud" at any AA's - as a matter of fact - i do believe i stated that i am sure most are very competent....that is not the point of the arguement...and if you don't want to hear both sides - then don't read...if you have been around the block - especially in washington - then you should know that the ASA is one of the major powerhouses both financially and influencially...
the facts are:
1. AA's must be supervised by MDA's - CNRA'S DO NOT REQUIRE this supervision
2. if you do the math (for financial purposes) it is more fiscally responsible to employ CRNA's for the mere fact that you do not have to have a mandated 4:1 (MDA to AA) ratio for CRNA's
3. CRNA's bring years of critical patient care experience to the table which by any amount of logical reasoning makes them a better practitioner from the starting line.
4. for the ASA it IS about money, and it IS about maintaining "control" they feel is theirs in this field.
when you do become a nurse - you will realize that fighting for what you believe in FOR YOUR PATIENTS is the priority and that is all I and others are doing here. There were several very misleading and near false statements that equated AA's to CRNA's - and that IS offensive to those of us who have put in our time caring for patients and learning by experience to make us better and more prepared to show grace under pressure in a demanding field. I am sorry if the truth hurts feelings...but the truth is - i have coded hundreds of patients, done thousands of IV's, given hundreds of thousands of meds, and seen just about everything out there - and i bring that to the table PRIOR to any anesthesia training...but some try to tell you that their english major plus their anesthesia training makes them my equal...WRONG ANSWER. it is not about ego and it is not about money - it is about common sense and telling the truth. When you become a nurse...and someone confuses your tech's with you - you let me know if your hair bristles a bit...because you put in the time, training, dedication, and money to become a nurse...if it doesn't - you are not being honest. i think the arguments have been more than sufficiently made - so i have nothing further to say on the matter other than it is important for the 's to be educated on these things so that they can be effective in the promotion of our profession.
May 6, '04Occupation: ICU RN, BSN Joined: Feb '04; Posts: 506; Likes: 6Quote from lizzYou fooled me too. It's that punk-rock avatar and SoCal location, lizz! :wink2:I'm not a kid, and I'm not naive. I'm a 42 year old nursing student working on a second career.
May 6, '04Occupation: CRNA Specialty: 45 year(s) of experience ; From: MI, US ; Joined: Nov '03; Posts: 1,681; Likes: 2,187Quote from Jailhouse RNJailhouse RN - you are showing your ignorance about your own profession. I have to laugh when I think of the one patient I've had in twenty years who insisted on an MDA instead of a CRNA. That patient, and all others who insist on an MDA, are assigned to a very junior MDA since they're requests are considered an insult to the chief of department - as if he or she would want to associated themselves with an incompetent practitioner.The times that I have surgery, I said "I do not want a CRNA or other anesthesia assistant. You will provide an MD or you will have a problem."
May 6, '04Occupation: Utilization Review, prior Intake Mgr Home Care Specialty: 40 year(s) of experience in Home Care, Vents, Telemetry, Home infusion ; From: PA, US ; Joined: Oct '00; Posts: 27,546; Likes: 13,752i want a crna to provide my anesthesia care: at my side before , during and after surgery for i know from experience that in the majority of american hospitals, it's the nurses that keep the patient's safe and facilities functioning.
why choose a crna--a look at history reveals the depth of this profession:
a brief look at nurse anesthesia history-- a timeline of nurse anesthesia history
start of nurse anesthesia
catherine s. lawrence and other nurses provided anesthesia for surgeons operating on the wounded during the civil war
sister mary bernard, a catholic nursing sister at st. vincent's hospital in erie, pennsylvania, was the first nurse known to have specialized in anesthesia
nurse anesthetists were historically recognized in the publication of history of anesthesia with emphasis on the nurse specialist by virginia s. thatcher (able to read online karen)
through the years in nurse anesthesia history
1890s | 1900s | 1910s | 1920s | 1930s | 1940s | 1950s
1960s | 1970s | 1980s | 1990s | 2000
code of ethics for the certified registered nurse anesthetist
studies and reports:
the study, "surgical mortality and type of anesthesia provider," shows that surgical death rate is not linked to type of provider.
how to get involved?check out the state websites, read their history and governement links section , write/ email/visit your legislators office regarding legislation that impacts our professionLast edit by NRSKarenRN on May 7, '04