California and Excelsior

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California should simply accept the fact that excelsior isn't going away. I'm sure the law suits are not over. The fact remains that there are THOUSANDS of RN's in California that are Excelsior grads. To proclaim that they are dangerous or inadequately educated is simple ignorance. If they truely believe this they should suspend all of those people already licensed. Then the law suits will certainly start. I will be licensed in California and I never plan to work there. My only mission will be to write them a letter a month asking them to tell me why my fellow grads can't get licensed. If all of the excelsior grads in California did similar things and defend the education the NLN says is exceptional, California would have to change their mind.

Dustin

Experience within that dept should be taken into consideration.

Maybe it should. But I'm not sure how you would administrate that from a practical standpoint. I'm also not sure that it would benefit LVN's that much.

If you take the two acute care LVN's in my class, for example, they were able to pass all of the challenge exams which allowed them to skip first and second semester. These LVN's work Med-Surg and haven't worked anywhere else.

If you counted their experience as clinical time ... they might theorectically be able to skip the advanced Med-Surg clinical rotations for the first six weeks in third semester. But that would be it. Since they haven't worked anywhere else ... they'd still have to go through all the other clinicals required by the board.

So ... maybe that first six weeks is somewhat of a waste of time for those LVN's ... but there's also advantages to it: namely, being in class and taking the tests.

As you advance to each new semester, the teachers make the tests a lot tougher. There's always a big adjustment period for each class. If you're not there taking the tests, going through the test reviews and learning how to study for these exams, it's going to be a lot tougher playing catch up if you start the semester six weeks later.

So that's why I'm not sure it would benefit LVN's that much. It might save them some time, but it could also really bite in the end.

:typing

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Hi All-

I think we could go back and forth on this forever, as a soon-to-be EC grad I wish there was a way to somehow be allowed to practice in CA.

I am good (so far) here in Ohio but if something were to take me out west it is a shame that EC and the CA BON can't come to some compromise regarding clinical or academic requirements after the fact without having to start from square one.

I know that the concurrent class/clinical would not allow that but it seems sad that an RN with loads of experience couldn't show that knowledge through an abbreviated clinical rotation (at that person's expense) that would give reciprocity.:o

I'm not asking for it to be handed to you, but the way it is now is such a closed door...

It also is a shame that someone who has their ADN through EC can receive their CRNA, for instance, from a very reputable institution and not be allowed to practice in CA because of the initial training they received.

Anyway, for what it's worth

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Hi All-

I asked this question on another thread and did not have a reply>

Acording to the EC site, if you are licensed in any state, you can work at any federal facility in the country, including Cali, am I reading that right?

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Specializes in ER.
Karen,

I clicked on all of those links and didn't see anything about low pass rates for EC grads.

Were you referring to the CPNE pass rates?

I thought that you were referring to the NCLEX and didn't see any mention of low pass rates for EC grads on any of the sites.

Did I miss it?

It appears that Karen was using EC as the sole out of state school - which, of course, is not true.

It is not hard to take those leaps of faith when you dislike something because it is different.

Chip

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Specializes in ER.
ec pass rates are not specifically mentioned as school is out of state..missplaced link i had to ny state program pass rates.

over the past five years, ec has stopped permiting emt's and in 2004:

please note: effective september 1, 2004, certified surgical technologists and certified medical assistants are no longer eligible for admission into the excelsior college school of nursing.

https://www.excelsior.edu/portal/page?_pageid=57,53286&_dad=portal&_schema=portal

why do you think they've changed their admission standards? it's because they want to have the most qualified candidates to be able to

a) take and pass nclex exam upon graduation

b) sucessfully practice as beginning registered nurse

on slightly different note, here is a story regarding academy of nursing, a utah " prep program" that was feeding thirty candidates per month to excelsior....read this newspaper story:

academy troubles upset many students

and followup: potential nurses end up in debt, disappointed

as nursing professionals, it is imperative that we safeguard our education standards with quality over quantity at all times. afterall, a human life is in our hands. i highly support career mobility and encouraging new avenues of education via distance learning/internet courses but graduates must have sufficient preparation to function as entry level rn's and not find themselves unemployable because they don't have the skills to be able to funtion in that role.

regarding the problems with the academy -

if you read any of the information that is disseminated by ec, you will discover that they specifically encourage students to avoid any of the publishing companies and rely on the guidance of the college alone. none of these programs - be it a publishing company or a test-prep company - are affiliated with the college and students are constantly warned about not utilizing the services of companies that are not affiliated with the college.

it is no different than, as an example, my wife's traditional college. they offer, through an unaffiliated outside vendor, a nclex prep program at the end of school. if this vendor suddenly went out of business, and no one was refunded money, would it be the fault of the college? i think not.

regarding the admission changes -

in speaking with the ec reps just before they eliminated the emt avenue of admission, they were doing so because of the simple number of students and it was felt that the elimination of the emt title would remove some of the least prepared students. ironically, it was dr. frye from ca, one of the petitioners of the ca bon, who was providing a 100 hour emt course and then test prep for thousands of dollars per student, who was pushing the unprepared students through. it is obvious, even to the most casual observer, that the additional hours and then the elimination of the emt admission caused a financial hardship to dr. frye, and resulted in his ire with the ec program.

chip

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Specializes in ER.
Hi All-

I asked this question on another thread and did not have a reply>

Acording to the EC site, if you are licensed in any state, you can work at any federal facility in the country, including Cali, am I reading that right?

That is correct. The VA, military, etc. do not have to follow state rules and regulations at facilities within a state. You can work at the Albany NY VA hospital with a FL RN license.

Chip

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I am good (so far) here in Ohio but if something were to take me out west it is a shame that EC and the CA BON can't come to some compromise regarding clinical or academic requirements after the fact without having to start from square one.

I think the problem from the start was that Excelsior didn't really want to change their program. Back when the board and EC were negotiating, all of Excelsior's proposed "clinicals" were voluntary only, and the board definitely didn't like that.

Now with the court decisions, and the fact that EC and the BRN are attacking each other publicly, the possibility of compromise is slim to none.

IMHO, I think the University of Phoenix has got a better shot at this than anyone else. They're now working on a distance learning BSN program that will probably meet the board's clinical requirements.

UoP has a good relationship with the board where their ADN to BSN programs are all over the state. And, because a lot of these ADN to BSN classes are operated out of hospitals, UoP already has their foot in the door to make the clinicals happen.

:typing

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I think the problem from the start was that Excelsior didn't really want to change their program. Back when the board and EC were negotiating, all of Excelsior's proposed "clinicals" were voluntary only, and the board definitely didn't like that.

Now with the court decisions, and the fact that EC and the BRN are attacking each other publicly, the possibility of compromise is slim to none.

IMHO, I think the University of Phoenix has got a better shot at this than anyone else. They're now working on a distance learning BSN program that will probably meet the board's clinical requirements.

UoP has a good relationship with the board where their ADN to BSN programs are all over the state. And, because a lot of these ADN to BSN classes are operated out of hospitals, UoP already has their foot in the door to make the clinicals happen.

:typing

How can I get some info on this program?

I contacted UofP today and their "recruiter" had no idea what I was talking about.

I think it sounds very interesting

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How can I get some info on this program?

I contacted UofP today and their "recruiter" had no idea what I was talking about.

I think it sounds very interesting

Sorry, I should have been more clear. When I called the BRN one of their clinical educators mentioned that UoP was working in a new BSN distance learning program with the board.

But, they also said that approval of the program by the board was at least three years away (which probably means five years in real time). That's why the recruiter didn't know anything about it.

And, keep in mind, this was for California .... I don't know if UoP is doing anything like this in Ohio or other states.

:typing

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I'm not a big fan of UofP for several reasons, but if they do in fact create an acceptable to CA distance BSN program to make it possible for people to move up in nursing who may not have other options, more power to them and I hope it works out.

Twice I got stuff in the mail from UofP advertising an LPN to BSN program.

I was already an RN at that point, but I called them to see what it was about because I had friends/colleagues that would be interested.

The woman taking my call was very rude to me, which I didn't understand as I should have been looked at as a potential tuition payer/student and you'd think she'd be trying a little harder to convince me to attend their school.

She told me that no such program existed at UofP and that they only sent out the ads in the mail to see how many people might call and be interested in such a program.

Now that was about two years ago, so this program may actually be in it's early stages of development by now.

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