Bad management

AutumnApple · Sep 15, 2016

OP clarified that later. Still, yelling is not appropriate. There are other ways to communicate an emergency. And in fact, remaining calm and NOT yelling is essential in handling an emergency.
Two wrongs don't make a right. The aide was wrong, but the OP's response did nothing but escalate the situation.

This.

I've said it before, nursing is challenging on a professional and personal level. Two wrongs don't make a right was one of my personal challenges to learn.

At some point I realized "fight fire with fire" isn't going to work in professional settings. I at times got involved in bickering, and although I wasn't a yeller, my behavior crossed the line.

I had to come to the realization that I was escalating things and that made me the bad guy. It mattered not what the argument was about or who was right.

I needed to learn to deal with difficult people better or...... settle for the consequences.

It took time, but I became much better at de-stressing people instead of winding them up.

A co-worker at the time actually said something to me that helped motivate me and convinced me I could do better: "I see you dealing with difficult patients like a champ all the time, so don't tell me you can't do the same with co-workers."

It makes sense lol

Jen4nursing · Sep 15, 2016

Autumn apple that is a great saying and you are correct we do deal with difficult patients all the time. Thank you for sharing that.

SmilingBluEyes · Sep 15, 2016

I remember when a nurse manager yelled at me in front of colleagues, technicians, secretary and several patients. OH BOY was I cheesed off. But I decided I would take a deep breath and deal with it later when a cool head would prevail.

A few days later, I went to the manager's office and shut the door. Just the two of us----and asked she NEVER berate or humiliate me in public again. She was concerned about a patient's safety but understood there would have been a better place and time. No fur flying, just two adults talking about a situation that could have gone better.

I realized it would be better to discuss in a place where that manager would not lose face and when I was calm. And I was right. I got an apology and it has never happened again

Let cool heads prevail and remember, it's nice to be important, but much more important to be NICE.

Jen4nursing · Sep 15, 2016

Thank you Smiling Blue Eyes that is so true but my problem is that I tend to not say anything until it builds up and eventually I can't take it anymore.

Your right staying calm is the right way but I tend to react in the moment and I need to work on that.

I also need to understand that we all don't have the same compassion or work ethic. I know I have my own faults and will work on them but I just wish those that worked in LTC were more compassionate I mean these are people's family. These patients are important to someone.

I burnt out and I have only been in LTC for 2 years before that I worked pediatric trach and vent home care settings. The atmosphere is so different. I have been a nurse for almost 5 years and this is the first place I have worked that I have seen people that blatantly just don't care.

djh123 · Sep 15, 2016

My management & the company are awesome. No complaints. All the staffing and supplies we need. Generous pay and vacation. Beautiful facilities.

Had you there for a second, didn't i? Ha ha ha. (Can't find supplies sometimes, broken/missing vitals equipment, crappy raises, often short on either nurses or CNA's or both. Some stupid/repetitious procedures. More...).

Kooky Korky, BSN, RN · Sep 15, 2016

Well i thank you all for your input and will definitley work on my communication skills as suggested. Just so everyone is aware I am an American born and bred and yes I am bilingual but my first language is English I am a straight A student and English and writing happen to be where I excel. I have been on the Deans List every year. So for me it is hard to type on my cell phone and when I am so full if emotion I do miss the grammar errors. So please don't question my intelligence. I am simply asking how do you handle problematic CNAs when you have no management of any kind standing behind you. I assure you I am a very kind person and all those that know me understand. You all don't know me. I respect your input and will definitely use the advice but when you have gone by the book and other nurses opinions and you still can't get through to your staff and your patient gets injured or falls because the CNAs simply won't do their job because there are no repercussions where I work then wouldn't you get fed up as well????? I am simply asking for advice on how to handle insubordinate staff when no one backs you up.
Thank you all for your input.

I do not question your intelligence. It was just hard to read your posts without punctuation. And you did spend a lot of effort saying you didn't have time to tell details - seemed easier to just tell the story in the first place.

You handle these people by writing them up when they don't respond rightly to verbal communication. When you see Management not backing you, you talk to Management about that. When you realize that isn't changing, you get out, just like you did.

Jen4nursing · Sep 15, 2016

Kooky Korky

I just want you to know that the "Don't question my intelligence" was not directed towards you. It was the other post that insulted me.

Anyway I like the advice you gave and your right getting out was my only option. I just should have seen the red flags there with all the good nurses and CNAs leaving I should have left with them.

Lesson learned for sure. I am halfway through my Bachelors degree so maybe that will open more opportunities for me away from LTC.

djh123

That post is hilarious I was thinking that sounds like a place for me hahaha. I am beginning to think that all LTC facilities are bad.

Thankyou all for the repsonses.

NursesRmofun, ASN, RN · Sep 15, 2016

Tried to quote a part of AutumnApple, BSN's post but failed...

This!! There are many problems in LTC that are a huge challenge. Dealing with these issues is not for the kind of person that takes it personally or can't stay calm. Even if you are calm, it can be too big of a burden. You have to be very tough. Some CNAs will challenge you because they want to be in charge and may think they "know more" than you. They may feel that even if it isn't true. I am thinking of a couple of different positions I had. I was the Supervisor in one position,...there was a CNA that was very bad,...I had reported her and thought she needed to be fired. I discussed it with the DON and she seemed to agree and told me to document the issues. But the truth was, she felt sorry for the CNA because she thought the CNA was disadvantaged and meant well. She would not fire her even though she was insubordinate and seemed terrible for the residents (as reported). I finally had to resign. She did get fired...but it was some time later. Maybe a year later.

Jen4nursing · Sep 15, 2016

NursesRmoFun,

I honestly feel that LTC facilities are just difficult period. I worked in their sub acute, Alzheimer/dementia and both LTC units and they were all horrible. The gossip and laziness were beyond control.

Cnas ran every unit. They would give showeres and not tell the nurse so we could do skin checks then when they came out of the shower room I would ask do they have any skin issues, and they respond no.

Had three days off came back in and same resident has a DTI. They are vindictive and when you ask why they told you the resident had no skin issues they tell you I did tell you basically putting all the blame on you.

The other day shift nurse would have potlucks at the nurses station, gossip and was very loud laughing and joking with the CNAs. This was acceptable by management as she was there too. All while call lights are going off and residents foley bags need emptying.

Just all around evil people. I sometimes feel I should just get out of nursing because no one cares anyway. at that facility so I am glad I left.

Skippingtowork · Sep 20, 2016

OP clarified that later. Still, yelling is not appropriate. There are other ways to communicate an emergency. And in fact, remaining calm and NOT yelling is essential in handling an emergency.
Two wrongs don't make a right. The aide was wrong, but the OP's response did nothing but escalate the situation.

To play the devil's advocte: people always, always raise their voice in an emergency (or perceived emergency). Just look at the racket in emergency rooms. I'd have two strokes if I was patient listening to all of that.

SmilingBluEyes · Sep 26, 2016

I will make a long story short but our administrator has been asked to step down and he hates me so for the last couple months the manager on my unit takes me directly to him for anything (all had nothing to do with nursing it was only gossip from coworkers) so I am under the assumption that they are trying to get rid of me. There are several nurses and CNAs that are also quitting and I am too after all they are trying to fire me so I believe. The administrator is a narcissist (said by many a nurse). The management run to him for everything. I have never seen such poor management ever. They are bullies and i know hes stepping down soon but i couldnt take the bullying anymore so i quit l. Should i have stayed? What would you have done?

It's moot. You quit, for better or worse. Move on.

SeasonedTech · Aug 9, 2018

Thank you for responding Ruby Vee
I tried to get right to the point without dragging on anyway it statrtes when i had trouble with a cna being insubordinate i had a patient pass away and protocol is for the nurse to call the manager anyway the cna called and notified manager when i confronted her she yelled at me at the nursing station and said she is my friend i can call her and tell her i tried to explain but she kept screaming at me so i yelled back enough we are giing outside now. She was friens with management and staff so i got a write up immediately for being mean. Anyway almost a year later and i needed help with a resident and asked nicely for a cna to help me real quick and they responded ill be there in a minute so i raised my voice a little in a sense of urgency no now.
This is where you lost me. How unprofessional of you to talk to another co-worker like that. Ppl can only move so fast. You're not the only busy one working. IDK, this really rubbed me the wrong way.