the shootings at the johns hopkins hospital made national news. maybe i'm cynical, but i think it was because a doctor was shot. news reports say that dr. david cohen was updating the patient's son about her condition, and the man was increasingly unhappy with what he was hearing. after threatening to jump out of a window, he pulled out a gun and shot the surgeon in the abdomen. he was taken to the er -- and whoever went and removed him from the scene is certainly heroic! -- and then to surgery. latest reports are that he is doing well and expected to make a full recovery.
the visitor shot his mother and then himself.
this may seem like an isolated incident, but really it's just a progression of what we nurses put up with on a regular basis. shooting a doctor makes the news. threatening to shoot the nurse, even if you're armed and dangerous, does not. decking a doctor makes the news. beating up on mother's nurse does not. threatening a doctor gets attention; threatening a nurse is business as usual.
i've been kicked, bitten, slapped, punched and threatened with knives, guns and an "attack dog" while in the course of taking care of patients. once i was in the center of an armed confrontation between law enforcement personnel who carried guns and were unhappy with their relative's care and hospital security personnel. the situation was resolved without formal charges, and the visitors were back the next day. another time, when taking care of a prison inmate who was dying i was nearly knifed by his son (also an inmate) with a homemade machete he'd smuggled out of prison and into the hospital. withdrawing care on the patient was illegal -- it would be shortening the convict's life sentence. the son was intent on shortening the life sentence, although it's unclear whether he was doing it to ensure dad was indeed on his way to hell or if it would have been a mercy killing. (i wasn't particularly brave. i had my back to the visitor and was tackled by a prison guard to get me out of danger while two other guards wrestled the son to the ground and disarmed him.) it's made me reluctant to turn my back on visitors.
in some states, threatening or attacking a health care worker performing her job is a crime on the same level as assaulting a police officer. not in our state. the visitors are free to insult, assault and batter nurses and then come back to visit. in one incident, a patient's husband threatened me and another nurse with a handgun at 6 pm. it was 9pm before the police were notified, and midnight before the visitor -- who was in plain sight the entire time -- was in custody. he was back visiting by 6 am. our manager, bless her heart, wasn't concerned about the gun-toting husband because "he's from texas. everyone carries a gun there."
we need stiffer penalties for attacks on nursing staff, managers who will stand up for us and a visitor's code of conduct prominently posted in hospital entrances and waiting rooms and strictly enforced. (metal detectors and locked units would be nice, too, but i'm not holding my breath.) and we need it sooner, rather than later.
SWS, I just don't know. Like I said in this thread before, I've been practicing for almost 11 years, in healthcare for 15, in urban and rural areas, and in several states (including FL, apparently where you live.) I just don't see and haven't seen what OP is describing. I'm not denying it exists, but I do really have a hard time believing it is all THAT common.
I don't know that I work in Oz....but I think maybe you (and OP) work in He11.
if you look at the poll, approximately 11% of our responding members have not experienced abuse. or they don't recognize it when they do.
i would think, though with so many reporting abuse, our membership could at least acknowledge it exists.
i've never said it doesn't exist. obviously it does. it happened to you, it happened to the doctor that made the news, apparently it has happened to sws. i'm just not convinced that nurse abuse is running rampant the way you claim that it is.
being pinched by a demented lol on that poll could count as abuse, depending on whether the responder considers that abuse or not. the polls on here are not scientific and i don't really consider them representative of anything. as well, some of the responders in that poll may have experienced one event in a career that spans years. i wouldn't say something of that nature is common -- i would say it's rare.
Specializes in ICU, PICU, School Nursing, Case Mgt.
I've never said it doesn't exist. Obviously it does. It happened to you, it happened to the doctor that made the news, apparently it has happened to SWS. I'm just not convinced that nurse abuse is running rampant the way you claim that it is.
Being pinched by a demented LOL on that poll could count as abuse, depending on whether the responder considers that abuse or not. The polls on here are not scientific and I don't really consider them representative of anything. As well, some of the responders in that poll may have experienced ONE event in a career that spans years. I wouldn't say something of that nature is common -- I would say it's rare.
Not counting the pinching by the LOLs--then it would be a daily basis...
I am talking about a very real threat-such as a weapon smuggled in, being told to "watch your a$$" and to "watch your car" , having to have security escort you out after a shift--and of course, the poor girl held hostage.
I am not saying it is rampant...I am saying it exsists and is more common than what is reported.
I have been an RN for 18 years. I have been threatened personally 3 times. NOthing happened, it was not pleasant. Had to call the police.
However, during the time I worked at this hospital, the hostage incident took place, that was pretty big. Again, we had a police station in the ER...didn't really slow them down too much.
So, not rampant but too common for comfort.
Where in Fl did you work? I am sure area can play a big part in this--again, we got all of the traumas (GSWs) drug ODs, stabbings, drownings etc.
We had one guy that walked in to Triage and took a seat....discovered in a few minutes that he had a 6 inchknife sticking out of his back--buried up to the hilt...oh well, at least he didn't complain about being in a hurry.
Also had an event were 4 guys were playing cards at a square card table...they disagreed on the outcome of the game, I guess, because they SIMULTANEOUSLY all stood up, drew guns and proceeded to SHOOT each other across the table.
Specializes in CCU, SICU, CVSICU, Precepting & Teaching.
where in fl did you work? i am sure area can play a big part in this--again, we got all of the traumas (gsws) drug ods, stabbings, drownings etc.
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i'm pretty sure that area plays a pretty big part in this. superior negotiating/communication/de-escalation skills may play a part, but probably not as much as the people who have them think it does. luck and area are the biggest parts.
I think you asked me this before, I forgot to reply. When I did live in FL, it was in N. Central. I wouldn't call it crime ridden, but there was a fair amount of drug trafficking.
Um, yeah, actually it was kinda like that. I took care of more people with no teeth and farmer tans than I ever had in my life. You know, the Bubba that came in with the NSTEMI that wants his bag so he can get out his dip. Wouldn't have been surprised if a gun had fallen out (never did, though....)
I cringe at the thought that our society lashes out when they can't get their way, hear what they don't want to hear, have to wait for what ever reason. Nurses have always been the forerunner getting caught in the middle, assaulted, or worse. It seems to be the acceptable when its the nurse but the unacceptable when its the doctor. The push now for open visitation in intensive care units offers even more possibilities of violence as well as other units. Granted family participation helps, but it also hinders. What happened to control, letting the patient get needed rest? We had issues with a patient's family just walking in when ever without first calling into the unit. They were rude, confrontational, etc. We had the facility police called several times to remove them. Yet each time the police dragged their feet, one even stated that the family was just upset because of the patient's status. The patient was very sick, but that doesn't give anyone the right or privilege to act like animals. When this family acted out toward the doctors, steps were taken to remove them asap. What are we.....chopped liver? I provide the best possible care to my patients, and respect to both the patient and family...even when they act out. Don't we, as nurses, deserve the same amount of respect as our fellow doctors? Just a thought
I haven't read everything yet, but if I recall correctly, Hopkins does have metal detectors. I know that they had better security than most hospitals. You had to sign in and state where your were going and be able to give a patient room number and name. Our son spent 3 months in the NICU there 8 years ago. I always hated that Hopkins was an amazing medical facility but located in the ghetto. I did not go to the hospital alone that is for sure and you were very careful at night walking out to your car. I have heard that the area has improved as the hospital bought surrounding properties, but have not been in a long time.
Now here where I work in KY, there is minimal security. Anyone can walk into a unit, even labor and delivery without showing an ID. I visited a coworker in L&D and was stunned that I could walk right back without saying anything other than I am here to visit.
grandmawrinkle
272 Posts
SWS, I just don't know. Like I said in this thread before, I've been practicing for almost 11 years, in healthcare for 15, in urban and rural areas, and in several states (including FL, apparently where you live.) I just don't see and haven't seen what OP is describing. I'm not denying it exists, but I do really have a hard time believing it is all THAT common.
I don't know that I work in Oz....but I think maybe you (and OP) work in He11.