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Specializes in BNAT instructor, ICU, Hospice,triage.

I got myself in a predicament. I visit a facility and the nurse was venting to me that she disagrees with the way the family is treating the patient. Says that the patient is "loaded" and the family is trying to hurry things along in her Hospice care. So the nurse tells me that she is NOT giving her scheduled risperdal and charting that she is indeed giving it. So she is lying. It irks me but not enough to throw her under the bus. Eeeks. And so I was telling my social worker, and now it has to be reported.

So what is gonna happen now? Will I have to be questioned a zillion times? This nurse said this in front of the care plan coordinator and 2 other people, we were all in a room.

How do I get myself in these messes? What is going to happen? My director is to meet with the facility today. I haven't slept all night.

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Specializes in Geriatrics.

I may be understanding your post wrong- but I just dont believe a nurse is going to tell someone visiting all that stuff. Something isnt right....

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I understand it that you were there as your job with the surgeon...and the nurse spilled her guts (since you're a familiar care provider) . You did the right thing. If this is acceptable behavior by that nurse, I'd just be glad I didn't work there as their employee.

You may get questions but it shouldn't be too dreadful. The nurse is gonna have some 'splainin to do re: purposely holding meds that are not prn meds. Falsification of records won't impress the BON. The HIPAA violation (if this isn't a patient YOU have direct care of) isn't good. And in a room with the CPC, and 2 others....what a piece of work. :uhoh3:

This isn't about throwing someone under the bus. This is about a nurse who is a walking disaster. I see this as a patient advocacy deal, as well as the requirements to report suspected mistreatment of the elderly (withholding meds that are part of EOL care).

I'm not big into reporting things- unless there are specific violations. You didn't see anything, but the nurses' 'confession' has to be taken seriously.

But I understand feeling awkward and a bit twitchy about it. :o

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
I got myself in a predicament. I visit a facility and the nurse was venting to me that she disagrees with the way the family is treating the patient. Says that the patient is "loaded" and the family is trying to hurry things along in her Hospice care. So the nurse tells me that she is NOT giving her scheduled risperdal and charting that she is indeed giving it. So she is lying. It irks me but not enough to throw her under the bus. Weeks. And so I was telling my social worker, and now it has to be reported.

So what is gonna happen now? Will I have to be questioned a zillion times? This nurse said this in front of the care plan coordinator and 2 other people, we were all in a room.

How do I get myself in these messes? What is going to happen? My director is to meet with the facility today. I haven't slept all night.

It isn't your fault...:hug:.....that nurse should have kept her pie hole shut if she didn't get into trouble. What she is doing is wrong. I mean I don't think not giving risperdal will hasten someone's death, but it's the families behavior and her compliance that concerns me. For you not to do anything make you an accomplice. She documenting she is giving a med and she isn't, which is falsification of the medical record, improper documentation, negligence, as well as malpractice and an intent to harm.

That nurse deserves what she gets......:mad:

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Specializes in BNAT instructor, ICU, Hospice,triage.

Well she sure did. I think she was venting and got carried away. Will she loose her license or get suspended or something? Oh man, why am I a magnet for this type of thing??? Its making me so worried. ughh.

You wouldn't believe how many times I asked this same nurse if she felt we needed to adjust the risperdal dose and she said "no". Instead of being honest and stating her feelings that she felt unethical to "gork" the patient who had absolutely had intractable uncontrollable anxiety, instead of voicing her feelings she lied. I'm sure she thought she was doing the right thing in her eyes, she was "saving" the patient and making her more alert by holding the risperdal.

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Well she sure did. I think she was venting and got carried away. Will she loose her license or get suspended or something? Oh man, why am I a magnet for this type of thing??? Its making me so worried. ughh.

You wouldn't believe how many times I asked this same nurse if she felt we needed to adjust the risperdal dose and she said "no". Instead of being honest and stating her feelings that she felt unethical to "gork" the patient who had absolutely had intractable uncontrollable anxiety, instead of voicing her feelings she lied. I'm sure she thought she was doing the right thing in her eyes, she was "saving" the patient and making her more alert by holding the risperdal.

You didn't do anything wrong. You were obligated to report- legally. She put YOU in a bad spot.

Risperdal is a crappy drug for anxiety. It's an antipsychotic, but more than likely prescribed because Medicare won't cover benzos for anxiety. Haldol is another pet peeve of mine with non-psychotic diagnosis...and dementia, or "terminal" isn't psychotic last I heard :)You probably know that....just gets my knickers in a twist :D

If she loses her license, all LTC and terminal patients have a better shot at improved care imo. :madface:

Those folks deserve solid, honest care with dignity and respect. Not lying, blabbing, arrogance. Let her sink.

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Specializes in MCH,NICU,NNsy,Educ,Village Nursing.

OP--you haven't done anything wrong. Would you want this nurse taking care of you or a loved one? If she's dishonest here, she's probably dishonest in a lot of things.....and some could lead to another's untimely death. Just something to think about.....

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Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
Well she sure did. I think she was venting and got carried away. Will she loose her license or get suspended or something? Oh man, why am I a magnet for this type of thing??? Its making me so worried. ughh.

You wouldn't believe how many times I asked this same nurse if she felt we needed to adjust the risperdal dose and she said "no". Instead of being honest and stating her feelings that she felt unethical to "gork" the patient who had absolutely had intractable uncontrollable anxiety, instead of voicing her feelings she lied. I'm sure she thought she was doing the right thing in her eyes, she was "saving" the patient and making her more alert by holding the risperdal.

Yes, she sure can.....but that is not your burden.

She should have thought of that before she decided to lie.

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Specializes in ICU/ER.

If this is her using her personal judgement versus nursing judgement to decide to quietly not administer a medication that's wrong.

Look at it this way... It's like she's quietly practicing medicine and unless she's an MD is kind of a bad idea. If she feels so strongly she should be documenting that she has not given this medication and call up the MD to discuss alternatives, options, etc. If this isn't addressed it compromises the integrity of our documentation as nurses.

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Specializes in Leadership, Psych, HomeCare, Amb. Care.

You did the right thing.

While I value the care & expertise that the professional nurse provides, I do not want my care (or care of my family) altered by the random whim of asigned staff I did not select as my caregiver.

If she felt the Riperdal was inappropriate, and held it: that's fine. She should have charted it as held, and notified the MD or APN responsible for the patients care.

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Specializes in BNAT instructor, ICU, Hospice,triage.

The reason that she didn't chart that she held the medication was that the patient's daughter and MPOA began asking to see the MAR so that she could see when the nurses held the risperdal and then if the nurse held it, all heck would break loose. Daugther was adamant that the risperdal be given. It is a BAD deal! I think that our director is canceling the contract with this facility, they are just so against the Hospice philosophy and now we can't trust them.

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the nurse should have known better, if she didn't feel comfortable giving it then she should have talked to the dr. not held it herself, thats not her decision to make. You should try not to worry cause obviously you are more concerned with this than she is. we cannot make the decision to give or hold anyones meds and not report there is a problem, she needs to learn this lesson even if its the hard way.

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