Andrea Yates R.N.

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Did you know that Andrea Yates, the woman who is now being re-tried for drowning her 5 children in Texas was a nurse? I just thought it was interesting.

Specializes in Day Surgery/Infusion/ED.
Never mind........

I agree.

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Specializes in Med-Surg, Wound Care.
I've had my own bouts with depression and anxiety - but I was smart enought to get myself help and medicated.

She too was getting "help" and was medicated, albeit toxic levels and constantly changing drugs and dosages. The final plea for help was greeted with "think good thoughts". :rolleyes:

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Specializes in Orthopedics/Med-Surg, LDRP.
NJ--Calling a maximum security mental hospital for the criminally insane "Club Med" would be laughable if it weren't so rediculously WRONG.

3rd--That her rational thought should have returned after she killed one child nonsense?!? What?? That's like saying an epileptic should stop seizing after the 1st episode, or after a certain amount of time. Even after killing her 5 children she lacked the ability to distinguish between reality and fantasy. She thought that she was possessed. Have you ever witnessed a psychotic episode? They can take days to resolve, and as you may know, some never resolve--they are a life long struggle.

4th--You think you're gonna get away from these types of issues in maternity? Think again sweetie--try numerous drug addicts who test positive for crack right before they deliver, meanwhile they have 5 other kids who all live with different people (grandparents, uncles, foster care, adopted out, etc), oh yeah and she's 19.

Firstly, have you been to our Forensic Center for the Criminally Insane? My guess would be no. It's decorated beautifully, everyone has private rooms (yes, it's for safety, I know), there are recreational programs out the wazoo, they've got a library that is bigger than the one in my town, cable TV 12 hours a day, a large triple razor wired courtyard where they can can garden and keep up the landscaping, outside companies come in and supply jobs which they pay them NJ's minimum wage - $6.15 an hour. There's skylights in the hall, the've got movie/popcorn nights, can work on their college degrees, have laundry service on-site where you can get your shirts starched as much as you want. It's hardly a place where one will wallow in their pity and 'reflect' on what they did wrong.

Next, she may not have been completely lucid after drowinging the first or 2nd or 3rd child or perhaps any of them, but she *MAGICALLY* had the cognitive thought IMMEDIATELY afterwards to put them all in their beds and cover them with a sheet then the cognitive thought to call 9-1-1. If she were truly continuing to be psychotic, she probably would have just sat in a chair somewhere and when her husband came home, happen up on the scene. However, it didn't happen like that.

Lastly, what is it you know about the hospital I'm working at? It's outside Princeton, you know where that Ivy-league university is? We hardly get those crack addicted, psychotic-type, too young to have a baby, DYFS (our children's services) hold clientele. That's what the *other* hospital is for, where those types come in like a revolving door. There's at least 5 hospitals in a 15 mile radius. I'm not under the impression that once in a blue moon, something untawdry won't happen on our unit, but I've done clinicals on that floor and at the other hospita, talked to the nurses in length, so I'm pretty well versed in what types of people come in and which don't. Location, location, location.

Don't presume to judge me (as you already have). Before you turn around and say I'm judging Andrea, I'm not. I'm separating fact from fiction and basing my opinions on that.

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Specializes in Happily semi-retired; excited for the whole whammy.

A jury of her peers determined that Andrea Yates was insane at the time she committed this terrible act. That she may have had cognitive thoughts immediately thereafter means nothing. You said you thought she could have ''snapped out of it'' after the first or second child; why then can't you believe she could have snapped out of it immediately when the children were dead?

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Specializes in Orthopedics/Med-Surg, LDRP.

Because it's just too darned "convenient" and unrealistic.

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Specializes in Happily semi-retired; excited for the whole whammy.

No more unrealistic than your contention that she could have snapped out of it after drowning one or two children. You can't have it both ways.

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Specializes in Orthopedics/Med-Surg, LDRP.

Ok, forget I ever said that. It was completely misconstued since then and it's just too difficult to continue to try to elaborate when it's coming out all wrong.

I just find it highly suspicious that she was conveniently "psychotic" while she drowned 5 children, but was lucid enough to handle the details after the fact.

Overall, it's not going to bring those poor children back. Rusty is as much at fault as she is in this. The warning signs were there and he did nothing to get her real help. She doesn't not deserve the not-guilty by reason of insanity plea. Yeah, she may end up doing more time than if she went to jail (highly unlikely, though) and she is NOW finally getting the help she needs, but she's always going to be labeled a baby killer.

Like Susan Smith when she put her 2 boys in the back of a car and drove it into a lake - well minus her of course.

Or Marybeth Tinning who killed 9 of her children over time. Well she was psychotic because her psychosis at least lasted over years. It's not liek she was psychotic for an hour but then not afterwards.

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Specializes in Happily semi-retired; excited for the whole whammy.

It sounds as if we actually agree on more than we disagree about, just the big thing about whether Andrea Yates should be punished or treated.

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Specializes in Day Surgery/Infusion/ED.

I think you really need to have a working knowledge of mental illness before you can presume to discuss it. Being a new graduate of a nursing program doesn't qualify as "working knowledge." According to your signature line, you haven't even worked one day as a nurse yet. You are certainly entitled to an uninformed opinion, but then you should expect to be challenged for what you say. And just because the forensic facility in your area is posh does not mean all of them are.

Before someone calls me on "new nurse eating," this is not it. There are times when new nurses need to be reminded that they have a lot to learn about nursing and life, and this is one of those times, IMO.

I think I'll bow out, as this discussion no longer serves any useful purpose.

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Specializes in Orthopedics/Med-Surg, LDRP.

Well I think she should be both - punished and treated. She does need help. There's no denying that. She's needed help all along. But I don't think that in all cases (well other than schizophrenia) should someone get off by reason of insanity. I think what it all boils down to is that I think these kids should have gotten more out of the justice system than that.

However, the NGBRI ruling only counts for 4 out of 5 kids. They're going to try the 5th child separately in hopes of getting a guilty verdict, so there may be hope yet.

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Specializes in Happily semi-retired; excited for the whole whammy.

I don't know, I kind of doubt that. It will be much harder for the prosecution to get a conviction on the 1 or 2 other kids (I actually read this trial was only for 3 of the kids). The defense is probably going to be able to present the verdict from this trial as evidence- since the killings were all part of the same act. Even if she was to be found guilty, the state would have to wait until she was released from the psychiatric facility before they could imprison her.

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Specializes in Alzheimer's, Geriatrics, Chem. Dep..

I could see if she was having a psychotic moment and killed one child. But why did not rational thought kick in after that before the 2nd, or 3rd, 4th, or 5th. :

Well let's see why, in December, if I knew driving while manic was dangerous in the first place, and letting go of the wheel "letting God drive", and giggling as the car swerved off the road or as I saw headlights approaching - if I thought this was not something others might do but it was "a test" from God for me - if my counselor and my psychiatrist knew I was manic but never suggested hospitalization or that I turn over my keys - hmmmm....

But - since I called 911 after my car went off the road - well then I must not have been psychotic and delusional while I was driving.

Yes I can see you being enraged about what happened to the children. But to say "I don't get how she could..." is exactly the point.

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