Allnurses Debates!

[Davey Do]

This website, all nurses, has TOS which have guidelines to which members need to adhere. Under Posting information, it states "We promote the idea of lively debate. This means you are free to disagree with anyone as long as your criticism is constructive and polite..."

In a nutshell, that's a very good guideline, basically stating, "feel free to disagree, but be polite about it".

There have been instances where debates went outside of these guidelines and those in control reacted appropriately, giving guidance, deleting inappropriate posts, etc.

In addition to the guidelines of the TOS, debating premises in a polite society have other certain specific guidelines.  Guidelines, if not to which are adhered, become as Daisy4RN stated, "a blood bath".

I would enjoy reviewing- and applying- the guidelines of debating in a polite society in this thread. There is a specific systematic approach to the art of debate as there is to any professional procedure we have, as nurses, utilized.

The first step on any debate is to present a premise, which is a statement based on a belief or opinion. Any premise needs to have facts to support it. Documented and/or empirical facts are the strongest. Facts based on feelings or emotions are the weakest, since they are usually not based in logic.

The counter premise requires the same guidelines with opposing facts in which it is to be supported.

Each needs to be presented directly as a statement. Many premises on this website are inferred or presented as questions. The questions are often passive-aggressive in nature and merely infer the premise.

We now need to come up with premise so a counter premise can be formulated.

[Davey Do]

28 minutes ago, Hoosier_RN said:

We gig at each other on jest though

Thank you for that support, however, I'm going to argue the above premise.

"Gig", in this case, meaning to symbolically use a sharp instrument to poke at, cause discomfort, and catch a frog. Get another's attention.

"Jest", as in amusement; for fun.

Basically, we are merely positively playfully poking at another, and no one receives any negative ramifications.

Counter premise: We gig at each other as a putdown in order for them to experience discomfort, subsequently experiencing an illumination so their consciousness will be elevated and, in the process, we elevate our own low self-esteem.

A really wise person said, "Humor is serious business". In order for humor to exist, it must be founded in serious reality, so the point of reference for humor is reality.

To make fun of someone" is negatively connoted because there is a victim. If we "have fun with someone", it is a win/win situation because both parties benefit.

We often hear someone put down another and immediately say, "Just kidding", but what they said was not funny, it was mean. This is an attempt at absurd humor. In order for absurd humor to truly be funny, the point of reference needs to be off the charts. Too often hurtful attempts at absurd humor hit to close to home. Too close to reality.

The very best humor, the safest humor, anyone can use is self-deprecating humor, where we are both the gig and the frog, both the perpetrator and the victim. No one can say, "Hey! I resent that remark because you just put you down!"

The concrete person will see self-deprecating humor as a self-putdown and come to the rescue: "Oh don't say that about yourself! You're really a good person!"

Gawd, I can ramble!

I am dirt.

No- I'm less than dirt.

[Hoosier_RN, MSN]

29 minutes ago, Davey Do said:

Thank you for that support, however, I'm going to argue the above premise.

"Gig", in this case, meaning to symbolically use a sharp instrument to poke at, cause discomfort, and catch a frog. Get another's attention.

"Jest", as in amusement; for fun.

Basically, we are merely positively playfully poking at another, and no one receives any negative ramifications.

Counter premise: We gig at each other as a putdown in order for them to experience discomfort, subsequently experiencing an illumination so their consciousness will be elevated and, in the process, we elevate our own low self-esteem.

A really wise person said, "Humor is serious business". In order for humor to exist, it must be founded in serious reality, so the point of reference for humor is reality.

To make fun of someone" is negatively connoted because there is a victim. If we "have fun with someone", it is a win/win situation because both parties benefit.

We often hear someone put down another and immediately say, "Just kidding", but what they said was not funny, it was mean. This is an attempt at absurd humor. In order for absurd humor to truly be funny, the point of reference needs to be off the charts. Too often hurtful attempts at absurd humor hit to close to home. Too close to reality.

The very best humor, the safest humor, anyone can use is self-deprecating humor, where we are both the gig and the frog, both the perpetrator and the victim. No one can say, "Hey! I resent that remark because you just put you down!"

The concrete person will see self-deprecating humor as a self-putdown and come to the rescue: "Oh don't say that about yourself! You're really a good person!"

Gawd, I can ramble!

I am dirt.

No- I'm less than dirt.

What if you're Joe Dirt? 

I've been gigged so many times in life, I feel like I have a permanent skewer through my midsection. I just try not to take stuff too personally. Life's too short, and I'm too old to waste time to worry. Hugs sent

[Davey Do]

6 minutes ago, Hoosier_RN said:

What if you're Joe Dirt? 

Hugs sent

 

36 minutes ago, Davey Do said:

The concrete person will see self-deprecating humor as a self-putdown

I'll be Joe Dirt.

You be Cathy Concrete.

[Hoosier_RN, MSN]

38 minutes ago, Davey Do said:

 

I'll be Joe Dirt.

You be Cathy Concrete.

You've made my day! I won't put myself down, too many others have, and I refuse to be there 

[Davey Do]

6 minutes ago, Hoosier_RN said:

I won't put myself down, too many others have, and I refuse to be there 

I prefer to think of it as beating them to the punch when I use self-deprecating humor. Takes all the wind out of their sails.

Not only does it take the wind out of their sails, it leaves a void to be filled and timing is an imperative part to humor.

Make hay while the sun shines and rain as the clouds condense.

[Davey Do]

I was involved in my first public debate in 1971, at the age of 14, in 8th grade. The topic was on nuclear energy, and I was assigned to argue the pro side, which was against my own beliefs and pretty much the consensus of the times.

I believed that I needed to learn about nuclear energy in order to argue for its use, so I checked out some books from the library. I got the gist on how radioactive material was used to create heat, thereby steam, and turn turbines. I drew a basic model of a nuclear power plant on poster board for its visual effect.

Part of the premise of my argument was that nuclear energy, fusion, was a steppingstone to the safer mode of fission, and I won the debate.

This 50-year-old situation set me to thinking that maybe I need to change my approach to those with whom I disagree. Perhaps I need to create arguments in favor of those topics to which I am opposed.

Maybe more members will like me more and feed my need for external gratification!

Heh heh heh heh heh heh heh heh!