What's REALLY with the hospitals using Magnet as a cover for wanting BSN only nurses?

[foreverLaur]

I'm in an associate degree RN program. I have a previous BA in Psychology and just finished up my last two classes online to also get my BS in Business Administration. I have worked for over a year as a PCA at a local hospital and also work as a supplemental instruction leader to help incoming nursing students do better in their first and second quarters. Yet all the nursing recruiters at the hospitals I'm looking at say that without a BSN, none of that will matter and my odds of getting hired are slim to none since I am competing with 4 well respected BSN programs.When asked why, all the hospitals said it is a requirement for Magnet status. From what I can tell, the requirements in terms of degrees for Magnet status are:

1. The CNO must have at a minimum, a master's degree at the time of application. If the master's degree is not in nursing then either a baccalaureate degree or doctoral degree must be in nursing.

2. Effective 1/1/2011 - 75% Nurse Managers must have a degree in nursing (baccalaureate or graduate degree)

3. Effective 1/1/2013 - 100% Nurse Managers must have a degree in nursing (baccalaureate or graduate degree)

4. Effective 1/1/2013 - 100% of nurse leaders must have a degree in nursing (baccalaureate or graduate degree)

By the AANC's definition, most nurses don't fall under any of these cateogories. A nurse leader is a nurse with line authority over multiple units that have RNs working clinically and those nurse leaders who are positioned on the organizational chart between the nurse manager and the CNO. A nurse manager is Registered Nurse with 24 hour/7day accountability for the overall supervision of all Registered Nurses and other healthcare providers in an inpatient or outpatient area. The Nurse Manager is typically responsible for recruitment and retention, performance review, and professional development; involved in the budget formulation and quality outcomes; and helps to plan for, organize and lead the delivery of nursing care for a designated patient care area.

There are NO requirements or recommendations stated for the vast majority of nurses - the ones doing the bedside care on a daily basis. So why are all the local hospitals hiding behind Magnet as their reason for only wanting to hire BSN nurses when that's not true at all?? I do plan to get my BSN and my MSN, but I need experience first and nobody will apparently hire me when I graduate! I also cannot afford a RN-BSN program without a job that will help me pay for it (all these hospitals offer tuition reimbursement for RN-BSN programs) because I am fresh out of undergraduate loans.

So what's the deal and what do us associate degree nurses do!?

[Lennonninja, MSN, APRN, NP]

Why would a nurse with a BSN want to be a floor nurse?? Too many chiefs not enough Indians

I have my BSN and wouldn't want to be nursing management for all of the tea in China. I'll be at the bedside until I finish grad school. Currently, I still have to start grad school, so I'll be here a while.

[avengingspirit1]

You keep saying you FEEL. The fact that every nurse I had spoken to said that magnet status did not do anything to improve working conditions for nurses is all the evidence I need. I don't need a million dollar funded research to tell me the sky is blue on a clear day. However, I'm starting to believe that many of those working in academia do.

Once again: Fact: Hospitals pay a large fee to the ANCC for magnet recognition.

Fact: They get more than that back in government stipends which is why they

don't mind paying the fee for their seal of approval.

[subee, MSN, CRNA]

Casual conversation is not evidence. A study won't take a million dollars. It would cost the price of software - the data is already in place.

[OCNRN63, RN]

Why do they make nurses do posters and other arts and crafts projects for Magnet? I was on one of the committees for recertification, and I couldn't believe the crazy projects they wanted. We are adult professionals, not kindergarteners. I can't imagine physicians being asked to do something similar.

[Kinepeli]

I work for a Magnet facility - we just received our fourth re-designation. Magnet designation gives an institution bragging rights in that most RNs are retained for longer periods of time. Magnet facilities promote direct input from their nursing staff, provide clinical ladder programs (with monetary incentive) and certification incentive. That said, our hospital was union many years before it was Magnet and all of those things existed. I am an ADN with 10 years experience, a national certification (CAPA) and do clinical ladder at level 3. If I choose to pursue a BSN, I will have the debt of additional education (my facility only reimburses $2000/year for education while I am still paying off school loans for my ADN) and get no hourly increase upon the completion of my BSN. I can continue to work where I do and continue to make very good money - I have no desire to be in management. If I choose to leave, there are plenty of non-Magnet designated facilities out there. Remember, this is also a pendulum - that will swing back at some point. Don't panic.

[avengingspirit1]

You're right on point. I do have a question though. Magnet gives the institution bragging rights of longer nurse retention. I know each facility is different but from what you see at your facility, is there validity to the bragging. Also, where things better when the hospital was simply union or have working conditions been made better after becoming magnet.

I'd value your take on this. Thanks in advance.

[mee9mee9]

This is the bottom-line truth on Magnet Status:

Magnet status has become a private joke in the nursing profession. When the evaluators come, hospitals are well aware in advance and make sure that only nurses who fit a certain profile are scheduled during that time. More of these nurses are staffed and patient loads are reduced. The hospital pays the accrediting division of the ANA (ANCC) thousands of dollars and when the check clears, Magnet Recognition is granted. The hospital then qualifies for large government stipends for acquiring and maintaining Magnet Status. After the evaluations are complete, the hospital goes back to it's previous staffing levels and patient loads.

Many nurses have been quoted as saying this is nothing more than a money making scheme for the ANA. While some hospitals may truly aspire to provide superior patient care, there are many that should have their fake seal of approval taken away from them. I tell patients that hospitals need to be judged on their own individual merits and not on the magnet recognition flags they fly outside their doors.

As as far as the BSN goes, it's just another part of this phony degree inflation going on today which is merely scheme to suck more money from the pockets of students and professionals and line the pockets of people and organizations who are in any remote way affiliated with four year institutions. I've spoken to physical therapists here in Phila., PA who told me that changing the requirements from an entry-level master's degree to a D.PT program only served to put PTs into more debt upon graduation and did nothing to enhance the practice of physical therapy. Even professional degree programs have been so watered-down that they have much less value than they did some 40 years ago. And why? Because schools like to promote a large percentage of graduates as a marketing tool and a way to qualify for more funding.

Any nurse with an ounce of sense will tell you that the BSN is very long on the BS part and short on the N part. And to keep the dollars flowing, once they can convince nurses to run back for BSNs, they'll then say nurses need a master's to elevate the profession. The thing nurse employers love to hear is that you're thousands of dollars in debt. They know these nurses are less likely to speak up about unsafe patient loads and the other unethical things that go on in hospitals.

You're right. BSN is an easy way to thin the herd. It gives employers an indication of who are the most gullible and easy to manipulate. As for me; I'd rather spend the money investing in a business rather than helping to line the pockets of nurse academic elitists so they can keep their cushy, never-having-to-produce-results positions. Also, as a result of declining reimbursements to providers due to the Affordable Care Act, many hospitals will be downsizing and consolidating. A nurse can spend thousands of dollars getting that BSN and find they may no longer have a job. If a hospital claims they are laying nurses off due to economic reasons, they no longer have to honor tuition reimbursement contracts.

Anyone who will tell you that the BSN and Magnet Status push is not money-driven is either lying, stupid or both.

do you think for profit or non profit will suffer more under the ACT

[taj09]

"If you could do the same job for more money, wouldn't you?"

The pay scale for nurses in my facility is based on years of nursing service and not education level. They are asking for BSN prepared nurses without paying them more money. ADN's and Diploma nurses with more experience make more because they have longevity. How can they expect this higher level of education (wall paper) in my opinion and strive for Magnet when they don't pay for the professional levels correctly?

[Kinepeli]

I honestly can't say I see a difference as an employee. When I was in nursing school and knew that the institution was Magnet designated, it did make me want to work there more - because of what the Magnet statement includes (shared governance, clinical ladder, nurse retention). But we see the same issues every other facility does, Magnet or not. The union is the real saving grace in many situations - and Magnet designation doesn't make sure you have fair representation in a situation where your job is on the line. Unions do.

[TiffyRN, BSN, PhD]

Why do they make nurses do posters and other arts and crafts projects for Magnet?.

I had the same question for years. Then in my studies for BSN I would be researching for a paper and find links to poster presentations given at conferences. I now know that professional poster presentations are a long-respected medium for quickly & succinctly communicating research findings. Scientists, researchers (including medical doctors) did these for years before nursing took it up. Arts and crafts can enhance one's poster but is far from mandatory.

http://www.acponline.org/education_recertification/education/program_directors/abstracts/prepare/pos_pres.htm

[avengingspirit1]

"do you think for profit or non profit will suffer more under the ACT"

Good question. Honestly, I'm not sure. I'll have to run that by either my brother, who is an actuary or an acquaintance of mine who works in the insurance industry. For-profit hospitals may have a little more leeway as far being able to do things to increase revenue without jeopardizing non-profit status and the tax breaks that come with it. Both for and non-profits are just starting to feel the repercussions of this law. And it's just getting started. A non-profit community hospital here in Northeast Phila. which is part of a university healthcare system just downsized a few weeks ago and went from 180 inpatient beds to 110. They stated that one of the major reasons for the change was declining reimbursement for services.

[avengingspirit1]

As I've stated before; all those driving the BSN push are in some way affiliated with academia or an organization that will benefit monetarily from having nurses scramble back to school. I believe Patricia Benner currently works for the University of California.