ADN's being pushed out - page 25

I work for a large Magnet hospital. As nursing becomes more popular, and nurses not in short supply, I have noticed something ominous has being going on lately. Several of our older and very seasoned... Read More

  1. Visit  green34} profile page
    0
    Ours is a payscale issue. They want to hire newer nurses that cost less.
  2. Get the hottest topics every week!

    Subscribe to our free Nursing Insights: Student Edition newsletter.

  3. Visit  carolinapooh} profile page
    1
    Quote from OCNRN63
    Oh no. When I worked in Day Surgery, I got a patient from the floor (I forget why) and when I checked her IV site it was in "backward." As in, the tip was facing the fingers. I shut it off, then I called the supervisor to come look at it because I thought no one would believe me if I wrote up an event report about a backward IV.

    I don't like to write up another nurse, but she was obviously in need of some remedial education.
    Yeah, I eventually figured out that 'backward' = 'facing the wrong way'.

    Night shift brain, I guess. Sometimes I'm spatially inept.
    OCNRN63 likes this.
  4. Visit  avengingspirit1} profile page
    2
    I think by now we all know who's driving the BSN push and why. I am an RN with a previous Bachelor's in Business Management. Anyone with an ounce of common sense would consider that a common sense substitute for the almighty BSN. But being realistic I know that 4 year colleges, the ANA, IOM and AACN don't stand to gain by allowing for common sense. I live in Phila., PA, with the University of Pennsylvania (the school that published the research). The individual who headed the research is nurse who probably hasn't touched a real patient in well over 10 years. As a matter of fact, I spoke with nurses at Univ. of PA hospital who don't even know who that individual is. The bottom line is that the research was funded and supported by the very people who stand to gain financially by forcing nurses to run back to school. About every three years, she publishes another study to to give a booster shot to the BSN push. And to the argument about what higher degree pushes have done for other professions; I've spoken to PTs, OTs and Pharmacists who told me the only thing it's done is make more expensive to graduate with nothing more learned that will benefit patients in the least.

    We also know that Magnet Status is nothing more than a marketing gimmick meant to make the uninformed general public feel better about one hospital versus another. I have spoken to many nurses who work at magnet hospitals who told me there is no better care given and in many cases it's made conditions worse. More time spent on the computer and less time spent with patients? Someone tell me how that is providing superior care. Hospitals pay the ANA thousands of dollars for this false seal of approval and then receive a large stipend from the federal government for obtaining and maintaining magnet status. Would you also believe that here in Phila., all nurse hiring is done online. For a job that requires the utmost of interpersonal skills, they don't even want to talk to you. Is it any wonder patients here are complaining of inadequate care.

    This is why I've been talking to the media. This is what I'm going to make sure the public knows about.
    redhead_NURSE98! and sallyrnrrt like this.
  5. Visit  nursel56} profile page
    1
    The only thing those studies accomplish is to cause more strife within nursing itself, exactly the opposite of what needs to happen according to he an article publishes by the ANA itself. A writer/researcher/nurse combed through all of the records of the four states they targeted to spearhead the campaign and came to the conclusion that BSN entry-to-practice cannot happen without these things.

    1. Unity of purpose within the nursing profession.

    2. Successful enlistment of support from others potentially impacted by the laws (representing hospitals, LTC/Rehab, community colleges etc) These are the groups who stop legislation from being enacted and in most cases pushed through laws prohibiting state boards of nursing from unilaterally changing nursing education requirements.

    3. Highly placed advocates who reach out to the entire nursing community rather than a remote though highly competent nurse executive who gives the impression of not understanding the reality of life as a working RN.

    4. Avoidance of a top-down approach to policy initiatives.

    The author repeatedly stated the need for the first condition.

    A small excerpt from the article sums it up:

    Another factor contributing to the lack of cohesion was that the entry issue was not brought about by any type of crisis, but instead by leaders of the nursing community at the national level. There was never any ground swell of support for the issue among the nursing community as a whole or from the general public. Rather the entire process was controlled by the ANA and the various boards of nursing, which did not truly reflect or represent the nursing community as a whole.

    It's just depressing to think that we're likely to see this protracted period of internal warfare continue.
    sallyrnrrt likes this.
  6. Visit  Laurie52} profile page
    0
    Quote from avengingspirit1
    I think by now we all know who's driving the BSN push and why. I am an RN with a previous Bachelor's in Business Management. Anyone with an ounce of common sense would consider that a common sense substitute for the almighty BSN. But being realistic I know that 4 year colleges, the ANA, IOM and AACN don't stand to gain by allowing for common sense. I live in Phila., PA, with the University of Pennsylvania (the school that published the research). The individual who headed the research is nurse who probably hasn't touched a real patient in well over 10 years. As a matter of fact, I spoke with nurses at Univ. of PA hospital who don't even know who that individual is. The bottom line is that the research was funded and supported by the very people who stand to gain financially by forcing nurses to run back to school. About every three years, she publishes another study to to give a booster shot to the BSN push. And to the argument about what higher degree pushes have done for other professions; I've spoken to PTs, OTs and Pharmacists who told me the only thing it's done is make more expensive to graduate with nothing more learned that will benefit patients in the least.

    We also know that Magnet Status is nothing more than a marketing gimmick meant to make the uninformed general public feel better about one hospital versus another. I have spoken to many nurses who work at magnet hospitals who told me there is no better care given and in many cases it's made conditions worse. More time spent on the computer and less time spent with patients? Someone tell me how that is providing superior care. Hospitals pay the ANA thousands of dollars for this false seal of approval and then receive a large stipend from the federal government for obtaining and maintaining magnet status. Would you also believe that here in Phila., all nurse hiring is done online. For a job that requires the utmost of interpersonal skills, they don't even want to talk to you. Is it any wonder patients here are complaining of inadequate care.

    This is why I've been talking to the media. This is what I'm going to make sure the public knows about.
    So, is a BSN a substitute for a business degree?
  7. Visit  PMFB-RN} profile page
    0
    Quote from avengingspirit1
    We also know that Magnet Status is nothing more than a marketing gimmick meant to make the uninformed general public feel better about one hospital versus another.
    *** I have never experienced or heard of any patient having any idea what Magnet is, or whether or not they were in a Magnet hospital.
  8. Visit  tamitech} profile page
    0
    Hi Everyone!
    I am a surgical Tech who is in the process of taking prerequisites for a nursing program. The college I am currently attending is an AS nursing program. I recently discovered an AA nursing program that upon completion of the AA Nursing degree has a transfer right into a BSN program. What I was hoping for is to do the AA and start working as a nurse (because it's a faster program) and then be plugging away at the BSN while I'm working as a AA nurse. Any suggestions out there? Thank-you!
  9. Visit  PMFB-RN} profile page
    0
    Quote from tamitech
    Hi Everyone!
    I am a surgical Tech who is in the process of taking prerequisites for a nursing program. The college I am currently attending is an AS nursing program. I recently discovered an AA nursing program that upon completion of the AA Nursing degree has a transfer right into a BSN program. What I was hoping for is to do the AA and start working as a nurse (because it's a faster program) and then be plugging away at the BSN while I'm working as a AA nurse. Any suggestions out there? Thank-you!
    *** Such a plan had tremendous advantages over traditional BSN programs for the nurse. So much so that it has caused deep resentment and jealousy among some people and that is part of the reason behind the BSN as entry to practice mindset.
    It's a good plan, one followed by many thousands of nurses. Only two very real problems. Most nurse residency programs want BSN grads. Taking your path you will never qualify. You won't be a BSN grad initially and when you have your BSN you will no longer be a new grad. The other problem is that "working as a nurse" part. If you can get a job as a RN with your associates degree then go for it.
    It's a shame so many people are hell bent on eliminating the path you are considering.
  10. Visit  avengingspirit1} profile page
    5
    Not in all cases. But someone with a BSN and experience would have many transferable skills that are highly desired in a business environment. Attention to detail, good documentation skills, time management, good interpersonal communication skills and the ability to multi-task are all attributes of a successful business executive. However those in management and anal-retentive human resources lugs who don't have the intelligence to think outside the box would pass this type of candidate over; much to the detriment of the company.

    I'm not saying that a BSN can always substitute for a business degree: but an RN with another Degree in Business or the Sciences should be given the same consideration as a BSN. But the institutions that stand to gain by having all RNs run back to school lose revenue that way. Also, the narrow-minded thinkers I mentioned above would need to evolve at least one more generation. The dumbest thing I've ever heard is having a piece of paper trump skills and actually knowing how to do something.
    shortlilgirl02, nursel56, besaangel, and 2 others like this.
  11. Visit  NCmcMan} profile page
    2
    My gosh! another few years you'll have to be a PA just to take a temperature. It's sickening the way all of this is happening. It's like they are saying ADNs are incompetent. We are not amused.
    brandy1017 and Kidrn911 like this.
  12. Visit  NCmcMan} profile page
    2
    My concern is that some nurses aren't trying to be business executives. Some folks just want to nurse people back to health and care for the patients. I can understand not being in management unless you have a BSN, but some people just don't want that. I just wish the hiring managers would get this through their thick skulls.

    Quote from avengingspirit1
    Not in all cases. But someone with a BSN and experience would have many transferable skills that are highly desired in a business environment. Attention to detail, good documentation skills, time management, good interpersonal communication skills and the ability to multi-task are all attributes of a successful business executive. However those in management and anal-retentive human resources lugs who don't have the intelligence to think outside the box would pass this type of candidate over; much to the detriment of the company.

    I'm not saying that a BSN can always substitute for a business degree: but an RN with another Degree in Business or the Sciences should be given the same consideration as a BSN. But the institutions that stand to gain by having all RNs run back to school lose revenue that way. Also, the narrow-minded thinkers I mentioned above would need to evolve at least one more generation. The dumbest thing I've ever heard is having a piece of paper trump skills and actually knowing how to do something.
    Kidrn911 and nursel56 like this.
  13. Visit  PMFB-RN} profile page
    1
    Quote from NCmcMan
    My concern is that some nurses aren't trying to be business executives. Some folks just want to nurse people back to health and care for the patients. I can understand not being in management unless you have a BSN, but some people just don't want that. I just wish the hiring managers would get this through their thick skulls.
    *** I can tell you both as a nurses who has had many managers who had BSNs and as a BSN nurses, there isn't anything in the typical BSN programs that teaches a nurses how to be a manager. The evidence for this is the large number of poor nurse managers out there.
    sallyrnrrt likes this.
  14. Visit  Jory} profile page
    0
    I have never understood the BSN/ADN debate. They are not the same in terms of education...period. Sorry if that offends anyone, but that is just how the world works.

    When I got my BSN after my ADN, I will say that I was a more well-rounded thinker, considered more, had higher critical thinking skills, etc, than when I got my ADN, which was almost completely focused on being a nurse and frankly, learning basic skills and how not to kill someone.

    Let's face it..if you had two candidates, both interviewed well, both new grads...who would you hire? You would hire the BSN, all day long.

    The structure of nursing is changing and people need to change with it. I got my ADN first so I could be working while getting my BSN, but it never, ever occurred to me to NOT get it.

    It wasn't that expensive and I never wanted to let it stand in the way of getting ahead, if I decided to. Trust me, it opened MAJOR doors.


Nursing Jobs in every specialty and state. Visit today and Create Job Alerts, Manage Your Resume, and Apply for Jobs.

Top