If we make BSN the entry level degree, we should be paid more

Nurses Activism

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First, I do not want to challenge nurses with several years of clinical experience that are ADN or diploma trained nurses or those nurses that graduated recently with a ADN, and I do not want to challenge anyone by saying that there is a difference between the ADN versus the BSN prepared nurse.

There is a push for all nurses to be BSN prepared or for ADNs to achieve their BSN; however, there is no increase in wages for the majority of those with their BSN or those going from an ADN to a BSN. I find that as a workforce, we do not understand our worth. Why do we need the BSN as it costs more and it has no pay benefits. Students that have an ADN from a community college have less student loans, and they make the same a student that has a BSN; however, the BSN student has increased student debt with no increased monetary income to show for their degree.

I challenge the nursing workforce to acknowledge our value as a profession, and demand an increase in pay if we are to have a BSN. The current yearly income of a nurse is based on the costs of an ADN level of education; however, it does not match the cost of a BSN cost of education. If I am required or it is preferred that I have my BSN, I need to be paid accordingly. I do not practice nursing strictly for the income, but I do appreciate putting a dollar value on the work I do.

Thoughts?

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
Nurses do have a high level of responsibility. Curiously they don't have a high level of liability but that is another discussion.

Do school bus drivers hold children's lives in their hands daily? Do pilots and air traffic control techs hold hundreds of lives in their hands?

*** I didn't say nursing is the only field with a high level of responsibility.

Do you have an opinion on nurses pay? If so please share it with us.

Specializes in Medical Oncology, Alzheimer/dementia.
*** With the exception of a few other health professions, like respirator therapy and physician assistant, what other professions receive the same training and do the same job regardless of degree?

I'm sure I could come up with a few.

Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.
*** I didn't say nursing is the only field with a high level of responsibility. Do you have an opinion on nurses pay? If so please share it with us.

My personal opinion matters little but I do feel that nurses have a tough job and are well rewarded.

There is just no evidence to support that more education means better nurses. I just hope that a mandatory bsn would control supply and demand and help sustain nurse wages.

Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.
There is just no evidence to support that more education means better nurses. I just hope that a mandatory bsn would control supply and demand and help sustain nurse wages.

There are a half dozen major publications on the topic.

Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.

I think we need to get to one level of entry education because I am tired of these discussions. smiley_beat_dead_horse2.gif

I don't believe a BSN nurse should get paid more than ADN/ASN diploma grad.....they are doing the same job they should get the same pay. Where is someone paid because of the amount of debt they have? That argument makes no sense...equitable pay for equitable work.

I have heard this for 35 years....this is the closet I have seen it become a reality and it's due to the plethora of nursing grads flooding the market and unregulated new, mostly for profit, 2 year schools pumping out as many grads as they can to make a dollar.

As far as the studies out there .....they are performed by the very regulating organizations that are pushing this agenda....data can be manipulated to reflect your desired out come.

So all of the ADN/diploma grads that have worked at the bedside during this incredible time of growth and advancement in medicine in the last 30 years have no value? and can't possibly have good outcomes because they don't have a BSN? I happen to disagree.

Who do you think cared for all of these patients the last 35 years? I can tell you it wasn't a BSN dominated nursing work force.

Specializes in Critical Care, ED, Cath lab, CTPAC,Trauma.
My personal opinion matters little but I do feel that nurses have a tough job and are well rewarded.
As you, as a nurses, are as well.

But I think as nurses...our pay does not commiserate with what nurses are responsible for and I have to disagree with you that nurses have little liability. We all bear liability for our actions....bedside nurse or FNP

I wouldn't say that adns have no value, but in our society higher education should (and usually does)=higher pay. The people who go to school longer typically make more money:

Anesthesiologist>MD>RN>CNA

It's life. And the point OP made is that if a hospital is going to require you to have a 4year degree then yes, they should pay you more. It's not that 2 year degree holders are stupid or inadequate, but I'll be damned if I (as a 4 year degree holder) should get paid the same as someone who graduated high school and got certified to do ________ . (I am NOT saying ADNs are only high school educated, using HS education to drive a point)

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I think we need to get to one level of entry education because I am tired of these discussions.

*** One thing I never hear addressed. When one advocates for a single entry point to nursing does that mean doing away with the DE MSN programs as well as the ADN & diploma programs? I would assume so otherwise we would hardly have a single point of entry.

So all of the ADN/diploma grads that have worked at the bedside during this incredible time of growth and advancement in medicine in the last 30 years have no value? and can't possibly have good outcomes because they don't have a BSN? I happen to disagree.

Who do you think cared for all of these patients the last 35 years? I can tell you it wasn't a BSN dominated nursing work force.

*** Good point!

Specializes in Adult Internal Medicine.

1. That argument makes no sense...equitable pay for equitable work.

2. data can be manipulated to reflect your desired out come.

3. So all of the ADN/diploma grads that have worked at the bedside during this incredible time of growth and advancement in medicine in the last 30 years have no value? I happen to disagree.

1. Pay depends on far more than the job description, I would think we could all agree about that. Cost of living, education and training, hours and days worked, benefits, etc.

2. Data can be manipulated. How exactly was this peer-reviewed data manipulated? What are the flaws? Why have there been no studies that refute it? Why do studies from other countries have similar results despite their entry-to-practice?

3. Not in the slightest. I don't think anyone would argue that your experience is irrelevant. All these arguments are based on aggregate where experience is held constant as to not confound. Experience and education both play an important role.

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
My personal opinion matters little but I do feel that nurses have a tough job and are well rewarded.

*** We disagree. Have you ever worked as a bedside RN?

Specializes in burn ICU, SICU, ER, Trauma Rapid Response.
I wouldn't say that adns have no value, but in our society higher education should (and usually does)=higher pay. The people who go to school longer typically make more money:

Anesthesiologist>MD>RN>CNA

*** That's not the case. The MD doesn't make more than the RN because they went to school longer. They make more money because more money is required to attract people to the field. Imagine the US was flooded with hundreds of thousands of highly qualified and eligible for licensure foreign physicians. Such a thing can't happen but I am trying to make a point. Don't you think physician pay would go down? Import enough physicians and their pay could be less than RNs.

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