The "bully" nurse - page 4
Hi, I was wondering if people could help me with a project that I was working on for one of my classes. We have heard nurses complaining about being "bullied" but I'm not sure what that means to... Read More
Oct 6, '05[QUOTE=Daytonite]Very good points! I don't want to start the ADN/BSN controversy, but I have to say that in my BSN program we got way more communication, psychology and leadership study and training than I ever had in my ADN program. And, if I'm not mistaken the MSN get tons more of it.
Thanks Daytonite for your comments and encouragement. I thought I would take a little time off from the bullies and work on my BSN. I agree with you that we can never have enough education. I have about a year to go on that. Then I may jump back in and go again. Either that or try to get a little higher up the food chain by getting my PA or NP.
Oct 6, '05Quote from MikeyBSNI'm being bullied right now at work.I just started a new job at a hospital,on a med/surg floor,and we have 2 bully nurses (CNA's).And all they do is walk around and talk about everyone all day..it's funny....how do they get their work done if all they do is walk around all day?But anyways,the nurse manager doesnt do anything about them"because their job performance is so good".....I went to her and reported them,but that's the answer I got.So,what do you do?I just try and do my work and ignore all the gossip,but it is very hard,especially when you are new.I can't just quit my job,I need the money,and I am getting paid double than what I was at my last job.I just think it's up to the nurse managers to do something about it,instead of being afraid of their employees.Hi, I was wondering if people could help me with a project that I was working on for one of my classes. We have heard nurses complaining about being "bullied" but I'm not sure what that means to different nurses. So, in your oppion, what makes a "bully nurse?"
Oct 7, '05Hmmm. Lots of things come to mind... Passive-aggressives, antisocials, narcissists,
impulse control disorders, and borderline personalities, are all part of what comes to mind. Perhaps there should be a classification for bully nurses in the DSM-IV. lol
Oct 7, '05Throughout the various classes you will be taking for your BSN pick the brains of your instructors and professors on strategies to deal with the kind of bullying behavior you experienced. These are problems of leadership as well as interpersonal behavior. As a BSN it is very likely that you will eventually find yourself in a management or supervision position and will have to deal with this kind of problem (more than once, I'm sure!).
Oct 7, '05Quote from controlThe blessings of being in a shortage field we all know well. The drawback is that in a fight where any warm body will do, all, regardless of abilities, in some way are leveled, and let's face it, nursing hours are a commodity. And people feel, well, ignored as people, which is something I suppose everyone needs to get over whatever their line of work, 'cause if we were supposed to have our ego needs met by the workplace, we'd be the ones doing the paying.Nurses tend to be very competitive with one another
Oct 7, '05in our unit, we get bullied by the HUC's (unit clerks) - I've seen nurses almost have to grovel to get orders entered into the computer - I've also seen nursing staff jump to answer the phone that's not getting answered because the HUC is on the phone herself, talking loud enough for us to all know that it is a personal call...
just recently, I decided that I'm not going to take it anymore - I'll be professional and polite but no more butt-kissing - some of these people are getting dangerous - here's the story:
the physician wrote: Nitroprusside drip to keep systolic BP <165
Neosynephrine drip to keep systolic BP >110
one of our snottiest HUC's who is taking all sorts of hormones in preparation for in vitro pregnancy transcribed the order as such: Nitro drip to keep systolic BP <165
Neo drip to keep systolic BP >110
now, I've only been in ICU for 7 months but I know that "Nitro" is not the abbreviation for "Nitroprusside" - I took the coward's way out and went to our manager who didn't formally write her up but did address it. The HUC confronted me and kept saying "why didn't you just tell me I made a mistake"? She wouldn't answer my question "why didn't you just write exactly what the doctor wrote?" but kept chewing me out. OK, I should have talked to her before going to the manager (which was going to happen anyway) but I think it's pretty bad that 1) she is so crabby that I was afraid to approach her (she bit my head off one time when I was in orientation) and 2) a unit clerk feels that they can take it upon themselves to edit a physician's order for vasoactive drugs - incorrectly, I might add. This was also allowed to happen because of a weakness in our system - no one should have to be transcribing medication orders when we have a computerized MAR system so I discussed it with our manager and I'm utilizing the PI program we use to try to change this practice.
sorry this was so long but I just wanted to show that other people in a unit can be bullies too............Last edit by Thunderwolf on Oct 8, '05 : Reason: profanity edited
Oct 7, '05Quote from DaytoniteSounds like good advice! Thanks again for your thoughts.Throughout the various classes you will be taking for your BSN pick the brains of your instructors and professors on strategies to deal with the kind of bullying behavior you experienced. These are problems of leadership as well as interpersonal behavior. As a BSN it is very likely that you will eventually find yourself in a management or supervision position and will have to deal with this kind of problem (more than once, I'm sure!).
Oct 7, '05Quote from MamaTheNurseSorry I didn't understand; where did the physician write what he wrote, and where did the unit secretary write what she wrote?the physician wrote: Nitroprusside drip to keep systolic BP <165
Neosynephrine drip to keep systolic BP >110
one of our snottiest HUC's who is a walking ****** right now because she is taking all sorts of hormones in preparation for in vitro pregnancy transcribed the order as such: Nitro drip to keep systolic BP <165
Neo drip to keep systolic BP >110
Oct 8, '05Quote from MamaTheNurseHello MamaTheNurse,in our unit, we get bullied by the HUC's (unit clerks) - I've seen nurses almost have to grovel to get orders entered into the computer - ...- I took the coward's way out and went to our manager who didn't formally write her up but did address it.
I have also been in situations where a CNA ran the entire unit due to her personality and issues, (obviously everyone else thought that nice people just tolerate that toddler behavior). Then I transferred after a year or so to a different department with a great crew on a midnight shift, really great crew. However, the day staff had a cluster of big bullies, truly amazing, shouting and loud talking about what 'you' will do, (so much loud talking that in the six or so months there the staff meetings were loaded with reports and requests for 'unanymous' staff to keep it quiet. Of course, the loudmouth bullies never thought it was meant for them.
After I transferred from there to another department which I really loved and felt I found my clinical niche, there was another bully. This one was very emotionally devestating to me, I thank her now because she will forever be the last bully that I gave the 'authority' to be so mean.
From her I discovered that you cannot relate to a bully as if they were a normal person, they are on a power trip, not on a cooperation trip. They are missing something fundamental.
On my clinical review from the manager everything was great until I read the conclusion where the manager had written something like, "must learn to deal effectively with others" I realized that managers do not want to break up bullying, that it is our responsibility to nip that in the bud.
When I student taught a kindergarten class and saw a child misbehaving I would firmly and respectfully point out the proper behavior without insulting them. I consider bullies to be in this same class, they are not mature, they are not considerate or empathetic, their world is all about them, either by choice or chance they do not know any better.
I have ignored them in the past and found that is not really very good either because the mess the create talking behind your back is frustration.
Unemotional, firm directeness immediately upon a 'tactic' seems like the way to go and then dropping the issue to avoid humoring them, I think now, (any other advice).
Oct 8, '05Quote from kurosawathe physician wrote the order in the chart and then it got transcribed onto a sheet that keeps track of IV fluids and their rates and also PRN IV/IV med orders which should be obsolete now that we have the capability to keep track of those things in our computerized MAR program (just happened recently) - I pointed this out to my manager and she agreed so I'm writing up a plan to eliminate the need for transcription............it's really sad - I've had conversations with co-workers about how much power our clerks wield and how intimidated most of the staff is by them (day shift - afternoons aren't like that)Sorry I didn't understand; where did the physician write what he wrote, and where did the unit secretary write what she wrote?
Oct 8, '05Quote from rhinojoggerI think you might really like the OR-there are a lot more male nurses and the female nurses tend not to have that prissy, catty cliquish behavior that occurs all too often on the floors. I hate to slam my own gender, but I think that we need more male nurses to offset some of the cattiness that goes on! I'm fortunate, I work 3-11 as a CST in the OR and I'm the only female. This is generalizing, but when guys have an issue, it is usually dealt with in a upfront manner wheras I find that women backstab each other a lot. I blame society for this though. Women tend to be an oppressed poulation so problems tend to get taken out on those they perceive as weaker than themselves. My only worry is that when I finish nursing school, I have to orient on days and I'll miss the guys on evenings-they are awesome about teaching new people.As a new nurse, I got a job on an SICU and felt fortunate to be there. However, the hospital policy was that all new hire nurses were to make their first attempt at the NCLEX within 90 days. My supervisor told me she wanted me to have my NCLEX scheduled within 2 weeks and wanted me to have taken it within 30 days, even though the hospital allowed me 90. She came up to me about a week later and asked me if I had scheduled to take it and I said no. She started yelling and screaming at me. That was the first of several bad experiences. Needless to say, that job did not last long. I passed my NCLEX with flying colors, but did not seek employment for about a month after my "bad" experience. I then got a job with an Emergency Dept. in Monroe, Michigan. I got the flu, had a temp of 103 something for about 3 days, had a chest x-ray, a levequin pack, Dr's office reciept, but had to call in sick on a weekend I was scheduled to work. Keep in mind I was new there and had a preceptor. But when I came back to work, the supervisor called me a liar for calling in sick, and ranted and raved for a while. The topic also came up that I am in the Ohio Air National Guard. (We go to war and help hurricane victims, etc.), but an employer is required by federal law to allow a guard member to be off for their once a month guard drills. Well, she informed me that if the schedule called for me to work on my guard drill weekend, that I would just have to find my own coverage so I could serve my country and state. Forget the federal law.I thought about contacting my senator, but two days later I decided to quit that job. That was this last spring, I have not been back to work as a nurse since and think that I made a bad choice in selecting nursing. I think the way some nurse managers get selected is that a person might be a very good nurse, work very hard, and when a management position comes open, they say that what's its name is a good nurse, let's make them the new manager. Well, a good nurse does not necessarily make a good manager and I think this is where frustration and bullying and intimidation come in. Just as new nurses need precepting and mentoring, new nurse managers should also be given guidance, preceptoring, and mentoring to become good managers. They just don't become one overnight. Another thing...it seems that nurses have long wanted to be treated more professionaly than they have been. If we are always cat fighting, ********, whining, and moaning, eating our young, and generally acting like children, and other professionals see this behavior, then how can we ever expect to be treated and recognized as professionals? Others just laugh at us! We are not just butt wipers, and the ones who bring the soda or a snack, and even though we care about and for our patients, others (patients and the public) should know (like we do) that nursing has a very math and science based foundation.
I don't know if part of my experiences happened because I am a red-headed 53 y/o male and a big guy. I know some nurses want males in the workplace and I think others don't. I think I may have intimidated some of the nurse managers and they just jumped on me to show me who was the boss? I know I am frustrated about all of this and I may not seek employment as a nurse again. I graduated near the top of my class in May of 2004, but I feel I am starting to lose what I have learned because I have not worked as a nurse for about 6 months. I guess I am starting to ramble, but would appreciate any feedback one might have to offer. Feel free to send comments to PM box.
Oct 8, '05To me what describes a "bully" nurse is one that loves to correct you or go over your head to supervisors. I have a good example of a bully nurse. I currently work in a nursing home and there is this one particular nurse that really thinks she knows it all. She walks around being loud and rude to everyone. She's never on time, but is so close with the bosses of the building. She can get anyone into trouble, but is never in trouble herself. She talks down to you like you don't know what your talking about and complains that no one does their job like they are supposed to when in return she never charts, leaves orders for others to do, refuses to be a team player, and will be nice to your face and as soon as your turn your back she's ready to talk ugly and rude about you. To get off of my soap box. But I fully understand those nurses who have bully nurses in their lives.
Oct 8, '05Quote from ortess1971wow - you must work in an OR from another dimension - I've had interactions with OR's in 3 different hospitals and I've witnessed some of the worst bullying that I have ever seen!! there always seems to be 1) an alpha dog and 2) their team of co-bullies and/or snivelling followers who make your life a nightmare if you don't follow their rules - at one of the hospitals, they managed to always be represented in interviews for new staff and no matter what the manager decided, THEY decided who got hired..........and one of their "crew" was male although I do agree with you that males generally don't participate in catty behaviour...............I think you might really like the OR-there are a lot more male nurses and the female nurses tend not to have that prissy, catty cliquish behavior that occurs all too often on the floors. I hate to slam my own gender, but I think that we need more male nurses to offset some of the cattiness that goes on! I'm fortunate, I work 3-11 as a CST in the OR and I'm the only female. This is generalizing, but when guys have an issue, it is usually dealt with in a upfront manner wheras I find that women backstab each other a lot. I blame society for this though. Women tend to be an oppressed poulation so problems tend to get taken out on those they perceive as weaker than themselves. My only worry is that when I finish nursing school, I have to orient on days and I'll miss the guys on evenings-they are awesome about teaching new people.