If BSN is preferred in NYC, Why Have ADN Programs?

U.S.A. New York

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Been trying to look for an answer to this question for a while now, and old threads don't seem to address it. I understand BSN degrees are increasingly preferred at the New York City hospitals, but if that is the case, what is an ADN new grad to do for work in a hospital setting? I also think it is interesting that a school like Phillips-Beth Israel SON grants the ADN but Beth Israel is a major NYC hospital, are they TOO preferring the BSN? In which case, what happens to the graduates of this school?

I'm just brainstorming here, perhaps someone out there can enlighten me. As for me, I am applying to accelerated BSN programs primarily but in the event those are cost-prohibitive for me I am applying to ADN programs as a backup. Of course, working in NYC for me would be ideal but I am not opposed to working in Long Island, NJ or upstate NY if ADN prospects are better in these areas. If I earn an ADN, I intend to continue my education for a BSN or MSN (even an ADN > MSN program if possible) after a few years as staff.

Of course, my question is notwithstanding the recession and increasing lack of openings for new grads at this time. I am speaking in terms of trends. Thanks for all replies :up:

RNDreamer

1,237 Posts

Specializes in acute care.

Here is the site to Continuuim Health Partners (Beth Isreal Hosp, etc). It looks like they are looking for RNs with experience at this time. Some of the postings clearly state that New Grads will not be considered at this time.

http://wehealny.org/

JeanettePNP, MSN, RN, NP

1 Article; 1,863 Posts

Specializes in Pediatric Pulmonology and Allergy.

The answer is that the preference for BSN over ADN is a relatively recent phenomenon. Hospitals, even bottom tier, are getting a flood of applications for every open position so they can afford to be choosy. As for why ADN programs are still around, that's because these schools have been around for years and aren't shuttering so quickly. We don't know what the future trend will be, if ADN programs will eventually be phased out or if graduates will just go on to RN-BSN bridge programs. Personally I think if you have a choice you should go straight into a BSN program.

DoGoodThenGo

4,129 Posts

Associate and diploma (the lone one left in NYS at least), aren't going away anytime soon for several reasons. However it remains to be seen where such graduates will find work in future, current economic and profession upheavals not withstanding.

First and foremost not every person graduates high school capable of dealing with a four year college degree program. This is especially true of BofS degrees with heavy science and math requirements. For this one needs a good and decent background either from high school or elsewhere up to basic algerbra and general chemistry. Some two year programs skirt around this by developing "chemistry for those who hate chemistry" and *very* basic math, both designed to get one where you need to be for the program.

Nursing being a dynamic profession is always changing, which is as it should be, however this also reflects changes in what "sort" of nurse hospitals (still the largest employer of nurses in the United States), require.

It is fair to say by and large hospital patients have *acute* in that your average patient on the floors today, would have been in a unit just ten years ago. Much of the routine and sub-acute care has moved to clinics and or walk in services. Nursing care for these types of patients is rapidly moving from just applying nursing theory, towards evidenced based practice models of care. A nurse working in hospital today must be able to process and analyze various information, assess her/his patient and make changes accordingly and quickly.

Rightly or wrongly many hospitals feel BSN nurses by way of not only their nursing classes, but core and related ones as well is more "rounded" and performs better under such situations. Granted there are vast differences between all nursing programs, so general statements should be avoided, but that is how things seem on the ground at the moment.

There is also the rise in using UAPs to perform more and more of the "pillow plumping" and "bedside" nursing care, leaving the RN more as a manager of patient care than the one who directly provides much of it. The question on many a hospital/nursing administrator's mind is "what is the best use of a RN's time"? Here again the answer more using the BSN nurse with support staff.

Another side of the coin is the increase of home care, which most always favours the BSN due to the independent nature of the work. Granted diploma and ADN nurses were doing homecare long before the term was invented, but because many of these patients range from acute to quite accute,the range of interventions/treatments broad, many services providing HHC chose the BSN for those and other reasons.

For anyone thinking of entering the profession today, I would strongly suggest going for the BSN if at all possible. If one already has a four year degree, the IMHO second degree programs should be a no brainer. I mean one is going to spend two years more or less in a NP anyway, why not just go for the BSN and get it over with.

As for the future of ADN grads in NYC, much is going to depend how the healthcare landscape shakes out, and the effects of "ObamaCare". Within the past two years four major hospitals have closed, many more have merged, and what is left are large the large healthcare networks. We know from the business world models, once control of goods or services lies with one or a few major players, it becomes that much eaiser for them to control many areas.

As Beth Israel hospital and by extension it's nursing program are part of Continuum Partners, it would be surprising if that group ceased hiring ADN grads all together. What would it say about a school of nursing where grads aren't even hired by it's own hospital? One of the reasons many great NYC hospital nursing programs closed or merged with colleges, was the preference for ADN/BSN nurses. Bellevue's school saw this early and merged with Hunter. By the way did you know while a hospital program, Bellevue had linked with NYU's schoo of nursing to allow it's grads to go on for their BSN?

guiltysins

887 Posts

It's kind of like asking why there are a lot of associate degree programs for things you can't do anything with. What can you do with an associate's in psychology? You can barely do anything with a bachelor's in psychology. But there has to be something there for the people that don't want to go straight to a bachelor's degree. Not to mention you can't assume that every RN wants to actually work in a hospital, some people have other dreams, one of my friends wants to go into business but they want to get their RN first. Plus there's a lot of accelerated and bridge programs, so for some people they'd rather it do it that way instead of going straight for the bachelor's in the first try. Also a BSN in NYC is ridiculous money. My 4 year degree costs 104K unless you're lucky to break it into one of the CUNY programs.

I would suggest anyone who can to just go straight for the BSN, it's the safest route at this point and especially in NYC they seem to be the easier programs to get into compared to the ADN's (which the exception of the CUNY BSN programs) but also cost more.

Plus you know NYC is not New York State or anywhere else for that matter. Maybe some of these people have no intention of actually staying in the city.

Donald11

187 Posts

"Another side of the coin is the increase of home care, which most always favours the BSN due to the independent nature of the work. Granted diploma and ADN nurses were doing homecare long before the term was invented, but because many of these patients range from acute to quite accute,the range of interventions/treatments broad, many services providing HHC chose the BSN for those and other reasons."

I don't know where you came up with this, but it is completely wrong. My mother has been doing home care in NYC for 10 years with several agencies... all with just an ADN. My mother has never had trouble finding a job with just an ADN and for that reason would never consider doing a BSN. Many nusring schools will try to sell you BS about how you need a BSN to get a job in order to get you to enroll with them, so you need to do independnet research by speaking with actual nurses.

Your also wrong about your comments regarding Continuum. My mother worked for them, not once, but twice. First right after she graduated from Phillips Beth Israel and then a few years ago as a home care hospice nurse.

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