When do they get a return on investment?

Havin' A Party!, ASN, RN · Aug 2, 2012

Hi, Sensual. You hit the nail on the head!

Your post clearly exemplifies why a facility contract with a new hire (eg, for the payback of training costs) is likely to be held unenforceable if the challenged by the employee.

Concisely put, the info sought in your post isn't readily available to a job applicant. And even if some general statements are made by someone along the hiring chain, the reliability of the info supplied may be of questionable merit. (Can we say "HR sales pitch"???)

SENSUALBLISSINFL, BSN, RN · Aug 2, 2012

Hi, Sensual. You hit the nail on the head!
Your post clearly exemplifies why a facility contract with a new hire (eg, for the payback of training costs) is likely to be held unenforceable if the challenged by the employee.
Concisely put, the info sought in your post isn't readily available to a job applicant. And even if some general statements are made by someone along the hiring chain, the reliability of the info supplied may be of questionable merit. (Can we say "HR sales pitch"???)

Thank you Havin', I was afraid no one would read my post since it was so long (I tend to write and write....LOL).

I am glad someone understood my point. I like stability and familiarity, I want to stay in a job for several years, my record with past employers indicate my commitment and my dependability. I am professional and reliable. I just want the same consideration, as it can be seen, at the end of the day, I was indispensable, first my hours were cut then finally laid off, it did not matter how many years I was there , the letters of praise from the patients to the office, or that I never once called in sick in all of those years (yep, as unbelievable as it sounds), in the end it was what was best for them not me. I would not have minded staying there longer, even with the working conditions, giving me the chance to take my time and find a job that I like, and I would have given them enough notice, I told them repeatedly I would not leave without making sure someone was trained properly and in fact I did just that. Now I am afraid the desperation of finding a job will be too tempting and I will accept the first job that comes into my lap, and that is exactly what I do not want to do. There is no nursing shortage in South Florida, so that will be my challenge.

Oops, I am doing it again, I will stop writing here...LOL

Pets to People · Aug 2, 2012

I don't see why you would include the salary of your trainer, you would include anything they are paid over their salary for training you, and from other posts on AN many hospitals don't pay anything extra for training, or very little, such as $1 or so over hourly salary. Then you would include the cost of any classes, etc they provided for you.

BrandonLPN, LPN · Aug 2, 2012

Are people really discussing sticking with a job they don't like in order to "pay off" the cost of their orientation? You owe an employer the courtesy of a formal two weeks notice. Thats it. Or am I just not understanding? I feel like Alice in "Through the Looking Glass" here....

BrandonLPN, LPN · Aug 2, 2012

And if you leave a job in only a couple months, you just don't put it on your resume. Everyone knows that. Just say you took time off for a family issue or something.....

llg, PhD, RN · Aug 2, 2012

And if you leave a job in only a couple months, you just don't put it on your resume. Everyone knows that. Just say you took time off for a family issue or something.....

...and if they find out you are lying (as is likely to happen in a smaller community or specialty facilitity), you will be automatically fired with no chance of rehire -- which could make it harder to get future jobs.

gypsyd8 · Aug 2, 2012

I have been reading this thread with my mouth open in disbelief but when I came upon this gem I nearly spit my beer all over my phone.

All I can say is....What the ? what planet are you ???? huh?

To the OP-ever seen Kill Bill? remember this line : you don't owe them $#!%

It is a job, you do work to get money, so you can buy stuff. What could you possibly owe them? You are the one providing the service, which is why you are getting paid. If the scenery sucks, change it. It is your right.

To others on this thread who seem to think orientation is free education- I beg to differ. I received my education from a University. I paid them for that. My employers provide orientation (and even as a new grad at the height of demand I never heard of a six month long orientation) in order to ensure I am competent to perform my duties to their specifications while meeting various regulatory requirements. They are not doing anything for me that they do not do for all employees in order to be in compliance with various and sundry regulations from the governmental and accrediting agencies that oversee the facility. Its not that big a deal.

Finally, with all due respect, I do not have to divulge every job I have ever had to a potential employer unless I am 1) applying to work at a nuclear facility (which I did, and got the job, and KEPT the job) or 2) applying for a high security government position. The HR nimwits at most private facilities cannot scry on me nor do they have a crystal ball. I include the jobs on my resume which apply to the position I am seeking. I have different resumes on my computer depending on the potential employer. I do not include my job at the nuclear power plant because it is irrelevant to nursing, I do not include my first job at a company that no longer exists, and I do not include the jobs I was fired from. HOWEVER, when I worked at the nuclear power plant, enlisted in the military, and when I apply for corrections positions, you bet your sweet pie I list every job because they actually have the ability to look that stuff up.

I have never heard of anyone being fired for omitting an irrelevant position from their resume. It is extremely common practice, even expected.

...and if they find out you are lying (as is likely to happen in a smaller community or specialty facilitity), you will be automatically fired with no chance of rehire -- which could make it harder to get future jobs.

hiddencatRN, BSN, RN · Aug 2, 2012

...and if they find out you are lying (as is likely to happen in a smaller community or specialty facilitity), you will be automatically fired with no chance of rehire -- which could make it harder to get future jobs.

Not including a job on a resume isn't a lie. Resumes aren't supposed to be comprehensive job histories but targeted marketing documents specialized to the position you're applying for.

ge104042 · Aug 2, 2012

I just recently quit a job after 2 months, it was not a good fit for me. This is what orientation entails, your employer puts you on 90 day probation and if they think you're a good fit they will lift the probation and you become an entitled member of the staff but if you fail the expectations then you are let go. it should be 2 way, if you don't think they fulfill your professional or personal needs then you fire them. You don't owe them anything, Of course there has to be a plan b to fall on like lining up a new job before you quit.

TiddlDwink · Aug 2, 2012

I retire in 23 days.

Once in my career I had a job that I knew from day 11 of orientation (my first day actually on the unit) was not a "fit" for me. So I went to the charge nurse and told her. I also asked if she wanted a 2-week notice, which I was willing to work. She said that there was no reason for that, and to just go to HR and tell them. I did.

I do not include that job on my resume, because I was never a real "full time" employee at that hospital. I was an orientee.

Now, that has been almost 20 years ago. It has never come up or been mentioned.

SENSUALBLISSINFL, BSN, RN · Aug 2, 2012

I retire in 23 days.
Once in my career I had a job that I knew from day 11 of orientation (my first day actually on the unit) was not a "fit" for me. So I went to the charge nurse and told her. I also asked if she wanted a 2-week notice, which I was willing to work. She said that there was no reason for that, and to just go to HR and tell them. I did.
I do not include that job on my resume, because I was never a real "full time" employee at that hospital. I was an orientee.
Now, that has been almost 20 years ago. It has never come up or been mentioned.

TiddLDwink, but when you started there was no such thing as signing a contract. Here in South Florida, they want you to sign on the dotted line and if you do not fulfill it they make you pay for orientation. The dilemma that the O/P is facing.

After reading this post, I asked my friends who have graduated since 2008 and all of them had to sign a 2 year contract (I thought it was 1 year so imagine my surprise :idea: ), and the one that actually got hired in 2008 (some did not until the years following), got a bonus as high as $7K (half after 90 days, the other half at then end), she still had to sign on the dotted line though. Bonuses it apppears do not exist down here anymore.

A classmate of a friend who graduated in April 2012, got hired at a hospital in Oklahoma and they gave him a bonus plus moving expenses, and he is a new grad....sheesh, is it not freezing up there...LOL. I mean I like cold, but freezing my bouteee not so sure

This post has made me ponder about my prospects now even more.

CONGRATULATIONS on retiring though. Celebrate and have a margarita on moi :yeah:

hiddencatRN, BSN, RN · Aug 2, 2012

TiddLDwink, but when you started there was no such thing as signing a contract. Here in South Florida, they want you to sign on the dotted line and if you do not fulfill it they make you pay for orientation. The dilemma that the O/P is facing.

No, it's not. My dilemma is that I feel bad about leaving the job so soon after starting it and was interested to know how long an employer feels they need a new hire to stick around for it to have been "worth it."