In Trouble With The Bon!!! Please Advise Me...

GrnHonu99, RN · May 11, 2005

as a new grad, i can tell you that you MUST ALWAYS remember the 5 rights to med admin. read the order, look at the dose, reread the order, recheck the med, re-read the order and re-recheck. if you still have questions...ASK FOR HELP!!!!! the only stupid questions are the ones not asked. Yes, med errors happen in school, but not if you check and recheck yourself, and ask your instructors for help. Never think you know what you're doing. Always know that there is that possiblity of something going wrong. I have my 5 rights taped to the front of my med book and i carry my med book everywhere with me when handing out meds. I probably always will. Too scared not to. My instructor taught me to never get 'comfortable' with my job. That that is when most mistakes happen. Hope this advice helps. Good luck in school. And by the way, you're not 'just a nursing student'. you're a nursing student and you are just as important as a licensed nurse. Students give care and help the injured and ill also. :)

Thanks!!! that is really good advice, in fact after I read this I went home and cut out my 5 rights and taped into my binder and my med book! Im so glad this board is here, I may never have thought of that otherwise and now atleast I know some things to watch out for...i dont have any friends (other than the ones im about to meet) that are in nursing school so I dont really have a sounding board...anyway thanks! :)

mattsmom81 · May 11, 2005

My advice: call your local bar association and ask for a nurse attorney (RNJD) Let her advise and represent you in this matter. She can quickly find out what the BON is planning in this matter. Its important to realize the BON is NOT on your side.

LadyBugLass · May 11, 2005

well for one thing, i'm glad you were able to resign your post voluntarily, reducing any further negative *attention* onto yourself & possibly others.
that being said...you've mention several things that raised red flags for me though. one being the bon recognizes is your sloppy (at best...divertive at worse) documentation technique/problem before you did! the other thing is the amount of errors made that you *remembered* enough to post here. my only fear is that there were many more. luckily for you...those didn't have immediate/adverse reactions. however...i was concerned with the way in which you seemed to blow-off your *mistakes* simply because "no harm" was done. i also know how catty many nsgs are with each other....let alone with new to practice nsgs. i also understand how one can get caught-up in the nuances of each medical/surgical service preferences. however....no matter how others behaved or tried to bully you...you're ultimately responsible for the care of your patients & that absolutely means being diligent over medication administration, proper handling/disposing of narcs, & proper documentation! those things are basic in nursing...period. how did you manage to get through nsg school if you didn't master that? why would you take-on (more importantly...keep) such an intense position when you *knew* you were in over your head? and yet you'd stayed :angryfire!!!! that's what sooooo troubling for me :uhoh21:!!!
what could've happened to you to either make your ego so huge or deflated that you weren't strong enough to go to your nsg educator for refreshers in medication errors/documentation. why didn't *you* approach your nm instead of letting things go as long as they did? didn't you think that *someone* was looking at those slips of papers & that a record was being kept somewhere? these things indicate an unsafe practioner in any clinical area...not just critical care!!! the mistakes you've described here could've very easily have been committed on a med/surg unit....make no mistakes about that!!! if someone was either injured or worse, died from your negligence....you bet your bottom dollar that not only would the hospital been sued...but you would be held accountable too. criminal as well as civil charges could've been placed & you wouldn't have had a leg to stand on because in the court of law...nurse experts would testify what a prudent nsg should/would & shouldn't/wouldn't know within their scope of practice...even if said nsg is a novice one!!! if i'm sounding a bit strong or harsh...its only because i *do* care & *am* concern for you!!!
now...i'm not holding you totally responsible for what happened on your unit in terms of how you were taught to sign out 10mg of morphine to use 2mg at a time & save the rest until it's gone (or *other* bad habits). whoever taught you this should be held accountable for that & if this is how your colleagues practice signing out narcs...then it's definitely a system wide error that must be addressed!
that said....i still sense a lack of responsibility on your part...especially where the bon is concerned. please correct me if i'm wrong but...if the bon told you to *turn yourself in* & you've not done so as of yet....why not? especially if you have nothing to hide!!! you've gone out of your way to take drug screenings without hesitation and gone through a battery of tests which seem to prove that you don't have an abusive or co-dependency habit with drugs/etoh. however...i'll be the devil advocate here because i don't quite understand what the bon means by *turn yourself in*...unless they're saying for you to voluntarily surrender your license. now if that's the case...then absolutely not!!! did you seek legal counsel yet? and if not...why not?
quitting this job removes you from the road of more/potential med errors & was the right thing to do for not only yourself...but for that of the patient's & your other colleagues. however...i'm still concerned it took your nm to approach you regarding this problem. you mustn't make the mistake of thinking that this matter is going to *go away* just because you've left & haven't heard anything from the bon. trust me when i tell you...if your nm told you this was going to be reported to the bon...it was!!! she has to cover the hospital for state/jcaho investigations. sooooo...if you value your license & nsg career...then take the time, money, & effort to seek legal help! but you must first take full responsibility & recognition for your actions resulting in your current position (all the personality bs crap on the unit aside). you didn't properly go through the five rights of medication administration...you didn't properly/effectively document what you've given(& my bet is that you've not done so with *other* meds/procedures as well...not just with narcs)...& that you could've injured or killed someone over it!!!
i implore that you digest all of this....then you'll be able to go on from there.
good luck to you & do pray ~
regards,
moe

digest this:

thank you so much for advice from someone who, obviously, never made a mistake (or more). you are not one of those "catty" types you mentioned, it seems. good thing. may every move you make at work never be placed under a microscope.

if you think that i have not been wearing a hair shirt over this for the last 3 months, then your "nursing intuition" has failed you miserably. i don't sleep, i have lost weight, and i am taking antidepressant medications.i have panic attacks nearly every day. my finances are in the crapper. my whole life plan is disturbed, and i wish to god that i had never even considered nursing school. then i would have never soiled the profession (calling?) of nursing for the really "good" nurses like you. so sorry. is that contrite enough for you? do you feel better now? how about if i told you that the only thing that keeps me from wanting to kill myself somedays is my daughters? got a care plan for that one?

if i had been taking or selling drugs, this whole process would have been easier. then you just blame it all on a "disease", and you get all these nice support groups, and there is no question that you get to keep your license and job. if you are just an idiot like me, well...it crossed my mind more than a few times to just lie and say i am a junkie or a dope dealer just because that would be easier. but, unfortunately, i believe lying is wrong.

save the lectures for one of your poor underlings. i asked for advice, information, personal experiences, maybe even a little reassurance. i really don't require you regurgitating the obvious to me. i live it every sleepless night and everytime the postman comes to my door.

i know why rn's make a good salary now...they have to put up with other nurses like you.

by the way, if you read my post, did you notice i have anger issues?

ZZTopRN, BSN, RN · May 12, 2005

well for one thing, i'm glad you were able to resign your post voluntarily, reducing any further negative *attention* onto yourself & possibly others.

that being said...you've mention several things that raised red flags for me though. one being the bon recognizes is your sloppy (at best...divertive at worse) documentation technique/problem before you did! the other thing is the amount of errors made that you *remembered* enough to post here. my only fear is that there were many more. luckily for you...those didn't have immediate/adverse reactions. however...i was concerned with the way in which you seemed to blow-off your *mistakes* simply because "no harm" was done. i also know how catty many nsgs are with each other....let alone with new to practice nsgs. i also understand how one can get caught-up in the nuances of each medical/surgical service preferences. however....no matter how others behaved or tried to bully you...you're ultimately responsible for the care of your patients & that absolutely means being diligent over medication administration, proper handling/disposing of narcs, & proper documentation! those things are basic in nursing...period. how did you manage to get through nsg school if you didn't master that? why would you take-on (more importantly...keep) such an intense position when you *knew* you were in over your head? and yet you'd stayed :angryfire!!!! that's what sooooo troubling for me :uhoh21:!!!

what could've happened to you to either make your ego so huge or deflated that you weren't strong enough to go to your nsg educator for refreshers in medication errors/documentation. why didn't *you* approach your nm instead of letting things go as long as they did? didn't you think that *someone* was looking at those slips of papers & that a record was being kept somewhere? these things indicate an unsafe practioner in any clinical area...not just critical care!!! the mistakes you've described here could've very easily have been committed on a med/surg unit....make no mistakes about that!!! if someone was either injured or worse, died from your negligence....you bet your bottom dollar that not only would the hospital been sued...but you would be held accountable too. criminal as well as civil charges could've been placed & you wouldn't have had a leg to stand on because in the court of law...nurse experts would testify what a prudent nsg should/would & shouldn't/wouldn't know within their scope of practice...even if said nsg is a novice one!!! if i'm sounding a bit strong or harsh...its only because i *do* care & *am* concern for you!!!

now...i'm not holding you totally responsible for what happened on your unit in terms of how you were taught to sign out 10mg of morphine to use 2mg at a time & save the rest until it's gone (or *other* bad habits). whoever taught you this should be held accountable for that & if this is how your colleagues practice signing out narcs...then it's definitely a system wide error that must be addressed!

that said....i still sense a lack of responsibility on your part...especially where the bon is concerned. please correct me if i'm wrong but...if the bon told you to *turn yourself in* & you've not done so as of yet....why not? especially if you have nothing to hide!!! you've gone out of your way to take drug screenings without hesitation and gone through a battery of tests which seem to prove that you don't have an abusive or co-dependency habit with drugs/etoh. however...i'll be the devil advocate here because i don't quite understand what the bon means by *turn yourself in*...unless they're saying for you to voluntarily surrender your license. now if that's the case...then absolutely not!!! did you seek legal counsel yet? and if not...why not?

quitting this job removes you from the road of more/potential med errors & was the right thing to do for not only yourself...but for that of the patient's & your other colleagues. however...i'm still concerned it took your nm to approach you regarding this problem. you mustn't make the mistake of thinking that this matter is going to *go away* just because you've left & haven't heard anything from the bon. trust me when i tell you...if your nm told you this was going to be reported to the bon...it was!!! she has to cover the hospital for state/jcaho investigations. sooooo...if you value your license & nsg career...then take the time, money, & effort to seek legal help! but you must first take full responsibility & recognition for your actions resulting in your current position (all the personality bs crap on the unit aside). you didn't properly go through the five rights of medication administration...you didn't properly/effectively document what you've given(& my bet is that you've not done so with *other* meds/procedures as well...not just with narcs)...& that you could've injured or killed someone over it!!!

i implore that you digest all of this....then you'll be able to go on from there.

good luck to you & do pray ~

regards,
moe

oh moe. what a comfort you are. how do i do without a friend like you? certainly glad you are perfect and have always had the perfect environment to work in. your ego rivals that of governor schwarznagger.

yes, you do have standards to adhere to, but i guess you have never worked in some of the enviroments that other nurses have because management short staffs or does not give adequate orientation.

ZZTopRN, BSN, RN · May 12, 2005

Sorry, I have not checked back with site in nearly 3 months! For some reason, about half the original post is missing. But the bulk of the issue is what everyone read!
Update: I did quit voluntarily. And I felt like about a thousand tons was lifted off of my soul. My boss was very nice, but told me that she was still filling out papers for the BON. So okay. That was on March 1.
I called the BON myself and spoke to an investigator. She told me to "turn myself in" ! I was also told to get an independent evaluation from a counselor in addiction issues. I didn't have anything to hide, so I did that right away.
I had to take an MMPI and about 10 other tests (took nearly 4 hours to complete them all.) Then I met with a counselor for about 2 hours. She was really wonderful! She figured about 10 minutes into the process that I was NOT an addict/alcoholic. But we did discuss other problems, like stress management and depression. All said it cost me about $250, but it was not wasted time or money. My written tests were interpreted by a third party. It showed a "low level of deception and a high level of validity", "a very low possibilty of addiction issues", and "a very high level of anger" (angry at myself? YOU BET!:chuckle ) The recommendation, IF requested by the BON, was for education in documentation.
Here's the deal...I STILL have not heard anything from the BON!! I did NOT turn myself in; I have nothing to hide, but I don't want to give anyone the rope to hang me with. Right now, I am doing PRN home health case management, and have not had one problem.
Opinions, anyone? Did my old boss really turn in those forms? Does it take the BON awhile to do things? What? I am starting to get more comfortable looking in the mailbox. I had been told that I would hear from them in "a couple of weeks" and it has been nearly 3 months. What to make of this?
By the way, I did tell my boss when I quit that I had a negative drug screen. I also had been doing some things with narcotics (using a 10mg syringe of morphine, 2mg at a time, over a 12 hour shift) that ALL of the staff did (that is where I "learned" how to do this). Do you think that maybe she decided not to start an investigation that would reflect poorly on the whole unit? This was a floor that was VERY big into looking good.

I know exactly what you mean (that is where I "learned" how to do this). Don't expect any support from the ones that "taught" you. I am sorry you opened yourself up in trust and got kicked in the b....t! I agree that although many things said, speak the truth. But I don't believe that sticking the knife in your back further helps. You have gone that extra mile in doing everything you could to remedy your problems. Wouldn't you just love to be "nursiepooh's" patient. Such an angry person.

Do get yourself a lawyer because as MattsMom pointed out, the BON is not your friend. Your evaluations sound great. You have worked very hard. And who is that j...k that asked if you "diverted drugs." I am so sorry for your pain, and that you cannot be perfect like other people. But don't think about the BON giving up. I've heard they can take a long time. But the most important thing is get that lawyer, and take care of yourself.

BabyRN2Be · May 12, 2005

LadyBugLass,

Wow... I hope that everything works out for you. You are in a tough position, but if you can get passed this, you'll have learned so much and you will be a better nurse.

Let us know how things turn out, and I will keep you in my prayers.

GrnHonu99, RN · May 12, 2005

I know exactly what you mean (that is where I "learned" how to do this). Don't expect any support from the ones that "taught" you. I am sorry you opened yourself up in trust and got kicked in the b....t! I agree that although many things said, speak the truth. But I don't believe that sticking the knife in your back further helps. You have gone that extra mile in doing everything you could to remedy your problems. Wouldn't you just love to be "nursiepooh's" patient. Such an angry person.
Do get yourself a lawyer because as MattsMom pointed out, the BON is not your friend. Your evaluations sound great. You have worked very hard. And who is that j...k that asked if you "diverted drugs." I am so sorry for your pain, and that you cannot be perfect like other people. But don't think about the BON giving up. I've heard they can take a long time. But the most important thing is get that lawyer, and take care of yourself.

i agree, none of us are perfect and there are times in our lives that we do things that we consider "stupid". You are not stupid, just human and as long as your mistakes weren't maliciously intended, which you have done more than enough to prove that they weren't, then you must just consider it a learning experience. What's done is done, it can not be changed no matter how many hours you obsess over it or replay it in your mind (oh i am one who is guilty of obsessing also so i know how agonizing this must be for you). What I am trying to say is, its over, its done, instead of continually punishing yourself try to move on...you sound like a compassionate, caring nurse who was in a bad situation and made some mistakes. I hope everything works out for you!

**SKM-NURSIEPOOH, BSN, RN** · May 12, 2005

digest this:

thank you so much for advice from someone who, obviously, never made a mistake (or more). you are not one of those "catty" types you mentioned, it seems. good thing. may every move you make at work never be placed under a microscope.

if you think that i have not been wearing a hair shirt over this for the last 3 months, then your "nursing intuition" has failed you miserably. i don't sleep, i have lost weight, and i am taking antidepressant medications. i have panic attacks nearly every day. my finances are in the crapper. my whole life plan is disturbed, and i wish to god that i had never even considered nursing school. then i would have never soiled the profession (calling?) of nursing for the really "good" nurses like you. so sorry is that contrite enough for you? do you feel better now? how about if i told you that the only thing that keeps me from wanting to kill myself somedays is my daughters? got a care plan for that one?

if i had been taking or selling drugs, this whole process would have been easier. then you just blame it all on a "disease", and you get all these nice support groups, and there is no question that you get to keep your license and job. if you are just an idiot like me, well...it crossed my mind more than a few times to just lie and say i am a junkie or a dope dealer just because that would be easier. but, unfortunately, i believe lying is wrong.

save the lectures for one of your poor underlings. i asked for advice, information, personal experiences, maybe even a little reassurance. i really don't require you regurgitating the obvious to me. i live it every sleepless night and everytime the postman comes to my door.

i know why rn's make a good salary now...they have to put up with other nurses like you.

by the way, if you read my post, did you notice i have anger issues?

first of all...my post to you was obviously taken as an attack on you...i do apologize as it wasn't intended that way. and as i'd believe i've said in my previous post....i know i sound a bit harsh...& it wasn't to put you down...but to give you advice (that you've asked of us all)...i just wanted you to get some idea of what to expect should you have to go to court (hense the "what a prudent nsg...& so forth). i don't believe i've said that i (or anyone else here) are the perfect nurses or that we've not had any mistakes within our careers. however...we're not the ones facing the bon here from what *you've* told *us* all.

i don't know or quite understand what sort of advice & comments you were looking for exactly because from what i've read here so far....most have said exactly the same thing i have...most did so without being as blunt as me (i'll admit that...& again i'm sorry for that). but like i said before...i got the impression that you've not fully accepted your responsibility here. as i'd said before....correct me if i'm wrong about that! you've singled my post out (i think) without really reading it fully. you read it & did so in anger & for that...i'm sorry.

i hear your anger & do feel for your situation....i really do! but how dare you try & lay some sort of guilt trip on me (or any other person giving you advice about the *obvious* :angryfire) is again...concerning to me. telling me you'd rather kill yourself rather than face your situation (professional as well as financial...which we knew *nothing* about by the way) but stop short due to your children is scary to me. you definitely must seek professional help for your anger (self or projected) & depression before it's too late.

i'm keeping you in my prayers because no one should have to feel this way. again...i apologize for being harsh in my choice of words. i don't mean to be unkind...just the opposite. it's because i *do* care is why i don't sugar coat what i've say.

good luck & best wishes to you,

moe

ZZTopRN, BSN, RN · May 12, 2005

first of all...my post to you was obviously taken as an attack on you...i do apologize as it wasn't intended that way. and as i'd believe i've said in my previous post....i know i sound a bit harsh...& it wasn't to put you down...but to give you advice that you've asked of us all. i don't believe i've said that i (or anyone else here) are the perfect nurses or that we've not had any mistakes within our careers. however...we're not the ones facing the bon here from what *you've* told *us* all.

i don't know or quite understand what sort of advice & comments you were looking for exactly because from what i've read here so far....most have said exactly the same thing i have...most did so without being as blunt as me (i'll admit that...& again i'm sorry for that). but like i said before...i got the impression that you've not fully accepted your responsibility here. as i'd said before....correct me if i'm wrong about that! you've singled my post out (i think) without really reading it fully. you read it & did so in anger & for that...i'm sorry.

i hear your anger & do feel for your situation....i really do! but how dare you try & lay some sort of guilt trip on me (or any other person giving you advice about the *obvious* :angryfire) is again...concerning to me. telling me you'd rather kill yourself rather than face your situation (professional as well as financial...which we knew *nothing* about by the way) but stop short due to your children is scary to me. you definitely must seek professional help for your anger (self or projected) & depression before it's too late.

i'm keeping you in my prayers because no one should have to feel this way. again...i apologize for being harsh in my choice of words. i don't mean to be unkind...just the opposite. it's because i *do* care is why i don't sugar coat what i've say.

good luck & best wishes to you,
moe

you "definitely must go away." of course you care!! ("how dare you lay a guilt on me....") that is about as attacking and angry as you can get. you are not qualified to be the judge of another person with all this nutty rhetoric. i would suggest you have some anger management counseling or some other kind of counseling for your emotional problem.

**SKM-NURSIEPOOH, BSN, RN** · May 12, 2005

oh moe. what a comfort you are. how do i do without a friend like you? certainly glad you are perfect and have always had the perfect environment to work in. your ego rivals that of governor schwarznagger.

yes, you do have standards to adhere to, but i guess you have never worked in some of the enviroments that other nurses have because management short staffs or does not give adequate orientation.

this isn't about *me* or any other nurse here...it's about the op & them asking *us* for *our* advice on what to do!!!

i did ask for some clarification where the bon is concern...about what did *they* mean by "turn yourself in." did i get that response....no! but what was given was projected anger towards me because i gave some heart felt & good advice. what i'd said to the op wasn't intended to stray them away from what they need to do. it was a bit harsh (& again...i apologize for that)...but i feel the need for this person to really see/realize the impact of their situation is most important. i never said that this person "soils" the nsg profession...they read my post & decided that that's what i meant...instead of really reading the message...which was to be careful in what you do as a nsg. that the basic psycho-motor skills of nsg must be in the forefront of any prudent nsg! that's all.....i just wanted this person to see that *they* apparently didn't realize or want to face the fact that they were in too deep until their nm interceded. that's what i believe is the crock of the op's problem that i believe they still don't understand.

that said....again movingalong....this thread isn't about how *perfect* i or anyone else here *is*/*are*...it's about helping the op get through their situation...even if the truth hurts now....it'll help them in the long run if they actually get the advice being offered. sometimes...sugar coating or handling situations like this with kid gloves doesn't do the person with the problem any help. i'm sorry that the op has placed them self into this situation...i really am. i just want them to understand that the nsg here on allnurses.com do care for each other...even when we fight among ourselves...we still *do* care tremendously!

cheers!

moe

jelrtLPN · May 12, 2005

Dear Ladybug,

OMG, im so glad you stood up for yourself here!!!!! that post was uncalled for. We as nurses are usually more compassionate than that. And before she jumps on me too, we all make mistakes, you have, i have, the BON has.. Its people like you who intimidate the people like her and make her feel inadequate. How dare you??? What she did was wrong, but not unheard of. She got into a tough situation and im sure she was petrified. Im not saying it was right, just understandable. Maybe when some of you nurses get off your moral high ground phrases like " nurses eat thier young" will dissapear. As for you ladybug, Good luck, God bless, and remain true to your self :)

**SKM-NURSIEPOOH, BSN, RN** · May 12, 2005

you "definitely must go away." of course you care!! ("how dare you lay a guilt on me....") that is about as attacking and angry as you can get. you are not qualified to be the judge of another person with all this nutty rhetoric. i would suggest you have some anger management counseling or some other kind of counseling for your emotional problem.

with this attack on me & my advice to the op. wow...what a sweeping generalization you have of me as a person.

i've never stabbed the op in the back nor did i kick them in the butt as you've accused me of. and wtf do you get off at attacking me anyway? you're the one who needs to *go away* with all of this anger rhetoric...not me. i really think you should check your emotions here. remember the tos!!

ciao!

moe