a slap in the face for LPN's

  1. Our emergency department was going to open two LPN positions for an 1800-0200 shift. Then there was a big management shuffle. Our new director has changed those two positions to care aide positions. Their arguement was LPN's don't have the knowledge to deal with the acuity in emerg. Give me a break! And care aides do???????Here in BC care aides do the absolute basics. They do not even take vital signs. It is a 3 month course geared for their work in extended care facilities. In the job description someone got a hold of, it lists vitals, setting up buck's tractions, cast splitting, etc. They would have to train the care aides to do these skills. Why not hire an LPN who already knows them?? I am livid. Surrounding hospitals use LPN's to their full capacity in their emergency departments. It doesn't make sense to me not to have an LPN in emergency to help out,doing admissions, assessments,vitals, catherizations, etc, enabling more crucial time available for the RN to deal with the serious acutely ill. They changed the job description to read nursing assistant position. Nursing assistants don't even exist in BC. There has been an ongoing battle in my hospital between RN's and LPN's. We LPN's want to work within our full scope of practice, that includes pharmacology. We are trained to do assessments and do have critical thinking. They refuse to recognize us as part of the health care team, and continue to regard and treat us as the enemy. It does not make any sense to me at all. Am I missing something????
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  2. 23 Comments

  3. by   KaraLea
    Wait a minute, let's see if I have this right...

    LPN's don't have the knowledge, but Aides do?

    NOPE, doesn't make sense to me either.
  4. by   Y2KRN
    Go figure???? LPN's work in my ER and do a fine job I may add!!

    Y2KRN
  5. by   jayna
    What is LPN?
    Is it the same as Enrolled Nurse? Asking from the southern hemisphere point of View.
  6. by   P_RN
    Sounds not so much a SLAP as a SNAP of the old wallet.

    They're saving MONEY! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ is THE bottom line and to he^& with safe nursing care.

    I'd take a good LPN anyday over someone with NO training and NO license, and ultimately NO help to me..



    PS Jayna LPN is similar to your EN.
  7. by   DaSuperRN
    Hi

    I use to be an LPN,C but I quickly realize I could never do anything I wanted or get anywhere either, so I got my RN, HAHA, and I am still struggling. I am presently enrolled in the BSN program maybe then huh? I took a course in case management, it was 6 months in duration; however, after I finished I could not find work anywhere under that job description. How much education does one really have to have?
  8. by   DaSuperRN
    Hi

    When I was LPN I made 12.95 hr in 1997 I started out 9.94 in 1995. In year 2000 nursing assistants in my area entry level made 10.75 hr, LPN's 13-14.50 and RN's 17.75. Where is the thinking here I mean we had to go to school for 1 year LPN or 18 months depending on state, and RN 2-3 years, and AIDES only participate in a 2 week course or 3. However, once again it is depending on the State you live in on how one attends school for a particular program. CNA's or certified nursing assistants are making close to LPN wages now in 2002???????????
    In some LTC facilities LPN's have to perform many tasks and deal with medication pass, documenting and legal issues. They have to assume charge nurse responsibilities and do patient care on occassions when there is a shortage. I think it is incomprehensible to pay AIDES 13.75 hour for a 2 week course of education and LPN's 14 something. It is a wonder anyone would want to pursue a LPN career when you can make good money as a CNA with less worry!!!!!! I am sicken by the whole process. I know we need AIDES, but sooner or later that is all the hospital and LTC facilities will have left, so yeah why not downsize is how they think.


    :imbar

    Last edit by DaSuperRN on Jul 3, '02
  9. by   fergus51
    I am with PRN, it's all about money. I am surprised they would have caire aides in emergency at all. Ours is an all RN staff (the only place we have care aides is in geriatrics). A care aide isn't better trained than you she's cheaper. Welcome to health care under the Liberal gov't. I have gotten so used to taking it in the a$$ this last year that I just bend over anytime someone from management says something
  10. by   nursedawn67
    Originally posted by DaSuperRN
    Hi


    In some LTC facilities LPN's have to perform many tasks and deal with medication pass, documenting and legal issues. They have to assume charge nurse responsibilities and do patient care on occassions when there is a shortage.

    :imbar

    In my facility I do all this and am a charge nurse, I pass meds, I hang IV's (I just can't insert the IV), I chart and document everything, when a resident passes I call the time of death. Where I work I pretty much do anything the RN's do except IV insertion.
  11. by   BBFRN
    Hi! New to the posts! I am currently an LPN working on my RN, and I work on a Level 1 Trauma med/surg floor. I do EVERYTHING the RN does except hang blood and push IV meds. I do admissions, start IV's, draw blood, and a majority of my patients have trach's, chest tubes, traction, external fixators, you name it. I have had a problem with the unfairness of the payscale for a while. LPN's are just as responsible for our patient's welfare as the RN's are, excluding maybe the charge nurse, yet we are paid closely the same wages as CNA's. I was a CNA for several years, and I know it's hard work, but you don't have as much responsibility, and you pretty much know what you're in for every day when you go to work. Also, the LPN's on my floor outnumber the RN's (sad, but true), so we are taking more patients than the RN's because they might have to take time to push our IV meds for us. LPN's take 7 trauma patients each, and the RN's take about 4. These unfair wage and assignment practices were what encouraged me the most to get my RN. Who wouldn't want to take a lighter patient load and get paid more money to do it?! If I'm going to do the work, I might as well get paid for it!
  12. by   DaSuperRN
    Hi

    This may be true for your hospital but not mine. As RN I did way more and have way more responsibility. I've been in all shoes personally, and I prefer RN because of the wages, but certainly not the weight of work put on me. At my hospital LPN's cannot do admission or start IV's, I have 10 patients, plus I admit everyone, start approx 30 IV's a evening no kidding we a telemetry as well, do boo coo's IVP's do all heparin IV and boluses, TPN etc....I got so burned out I quit after 3 years of torture now I work LTC and prefer it.



    Registered: May 2002
    Location: Louisville, KY
    Posts: 3
    (Post# 10)

    Hi! New to the posts! I am currently an LPN working on my RN, and I work on a Level 1 Trauma med/surg floor. I do EVERYTHING the RN does except hang blood and push IV meds. I do admissions, start IV's, draw blood, and a majority of my patients have trach's, chest tubes, traction, external fixators, you name it. I have had a problem with the unfairness of the payscale for a while. LPN's are just as responsible for our patient's welfare as the RN's are, excluding maybe the charge nurse, yet we are paid closely the same wages as CNA's. I was a CNA for several years, and I know it's hard work, but you don't have as much responsibility, and you pretty much know what you're in for every day when you go to work. Also, the LPN's on my floor outnumber the RN's (sad, but true), so we are taking more patients than the RN's because they might have to take time to push our IV meds for us. LPN's take 7 trauma patients each, and the RN's take about 4. These unfair wage and assignment practices were what encouraged me the most to get my RN. Who wouldn't want to take a lighter patient load and get paid more money to do it?! If I'm going to do the work, I might as well get paid for it!
    :chuckle :chuckle :chuckle :chuckle :chuckle
  13. by   rennilou
    Hi! I am in Texas and I now see that the battle for LPN/LVN recognition and respect rages on. I am an LVN and have been for nearly 8 years. Not long ago, hospitals in San Antonio did away with LVN's and left only RN's working and CNA's. Well, they soon realized that we are a vital link in the chain of care. Some hospitals have started hiring LVN's but some will only use them via agency and not full-time on-staff. There is a hospital here that uses CNA's, but they call them "techs". These "techs" are taught to draw blood, catheterize patients, check IV sites, restrain patients, and many other duties an LVN would have done in the past but for less money (not that much less!) and without the med pass or documentation. It's ridiculous. When I was in nursing school, they made us feel so proud to be entering such a noble profession. We were proud to call ourselves nurses. Until we entered the world at large and found that we really are classified as "glorified nurses aides". Leesonlpn, I totally understand your outrage and discouragement. This is a huge reason why LVN's are leaving the nursing field. It's a damn shame that those who call the shots can't or won't recognize the importance we have in the system and how much better things would be if we were utilized more, respected more, and paid what we are so definitely worth. Pardon the length, this is a sore spot for me. One more thing, I worked dialysis in a free-standing clinic for 2 years. While there, whenever staff meetings were called, the supervisor would say "I need all the nurses, techs, and LVN's to the floor". This would always make me angry. Apparently, we weren't considered nurses. Gee...I thought LPN/LVN had the word NURSE in it. Go figure.
  14. by   mattsmom81
    I think if hospitals/facilities had their way they would have minimum nurses and maximum techs...it's usually something to do with $$$ when we try to figure out suits...LOL!.

    They staff a few nurses... for legal and liability purposes...to be responsible for the techs if they hurt someone.

    I think our best solution will be for nurses to unite and organize and begin to lobby for laws to set nurse patient ratios and stop the understaffing that goes on today. (among other nurse abuses)

    I don't understand why some facilities do not utilize LVN's....other than they want to get maximum legal protection plus a nurse who can be in charge and 'do' (and be liable for) everything. They don't want a nurse who they see as limited in any way.... of course I would much rather work with NURSES than techs anyday and I believe most nurses would choose this if they had any say.....

    Just a guess as to the suits' motives...but who knows what the suits really think??? Maybe some management types here can enlighten us????

    I am a RN who started as a LPN....if I was still an LPN I would move from facility to agency work if possible....as agency LPN's are very attractive to facilities and I'd have more control over my life and make better $$$. Just a suggestion to those good LPN's out there...luv ya!

    When I was a nursing supervisor I was encouraged to book LVN's do to cost factors....so you guys should use this to your advantage...got several LVN former coworkers in critical care who now do agency and love it.

    I'm sorry your facility is doing this to their LVN's....ain't fair or smart IMO.

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