Future looks bleak for CRNAs - page 3

Thesre will be not much jobs and hence unemployment in 2022 onwards... Read More

  1. by   manusko
    There's are now studies pointing to the fact that many CRNAs will retire in the next 10 plus years.
  2. by   twinsmom788
    Quote from offlabel
    Better pick something else then.
    You say you are a FMG...have you taken and scored WELL on Step 1 and 2? If not, then I might understand why you are pursuing a BSN. You certainly have a long way to go to be a CRNA. I would recommend concentrating on your current studies and then worry about a career.
  3. by   twinsmom788
    I just read your other posts that you have taken the USMLE and had acceptable scores...why are you not in a residency then and working as an MD??
  4. by   superking
    I have acceptable scores for primary care residencies but not for Anesthesiology. And Anesthesia is my passion. That's why I want to do CRNA.
  5. by   NurseDiane
    There is always a battle between anesthesiologists (MDA) and CRNA's. MDA's feel insulted that nurses do the same jobs that they do, and sometimes they feel that CRNA's are "taking away" business. However, they don't complain about supervising 3-4 CRNA's during the day, sitting on their behinds in the break room & talking to their stock broker on the phone a good part of the day. If they had to be in a room, doing a case, they wouldn't be doing that. CRNA's enable an anesthesia group to spend far less money on employees and make lots more money because they can do more cases for less money then if they hired MDA's in all of the CRNA positions. Sometimes, MDA's work very well with CRNA's as a team, and sometimes there is palpable tension between some MDA's and CRNA's---and it isn't CRNA directed at MDA, it is MDA directed at CRNA.

    I used to be a CRNA. Have been an RN since 1987. There have been SO MANY CHANGES in healthcare. The rules & regulations that the government has instituted have resulted in far more paperwork than necessary----redundant paperwork where errors are often made. With declining reimbursements, volume is the most important thing---the more patients you can move in & out means more money. In the OR it is very obvious---the powers that be are ALWAYS up the anesthesia providers behinds to decrease turnover time. They want anesthesia to literally run to the PACU with the patient on a stretcher, throw the patient in a slot & run back to the OR to get the next patient on the table (and usually, when anesthesia gets back into the OR, the next patient is already on the table & hooked up to the monitors). I've had nurse managers stand in the doorway of the OR grilling me about why the patient was extubated, why the patient was still on the table, why I can't take the patient to PACU on a t-piece. It was infuriating. I don't care how much time I am "wasting"---I will not put a patient in danger or at risk just so they can turn the room over faster. There are patients that just don't wake up as fast as others---and in this day & age of bariatric surgery, obstructive sleep apnea & morbidly obese patients being regular patients in the OR, extra diligence is necessary to keep them safe. The same nurse manager tried her routine of standing in the doorway of the OR & grilling an MDA about why his patient was still on the table, and he turned around to her and yelled "THIS IS MY PATIENT. WHEN YOU GO TO MEDICAL SCHOOL FOR 4 YEARS AND DO AN ANESTHESIA RESIDENCY FOR 3 YEARS, YOU CAN DO WHATEVER YOU WANT WITH YOUR PATIENTS. YOU CAN BRING THE TO THE PACU WITH THEIR BELLY OPEN & PULL THE ANESTHESIA MACHINE WITH YOU IF YOU WANT. BUT, THIS IS MY PATIENT AND I WILL TAKE CARE OF MY PATIENT THE WAY I WANT. IF YOU HAVE ANY PROBLEM WITH THAT, YOU CAN CALL THE MEDICAL DIRECTOR. IN FACT, WHY DON'T WE CALL THE MEDICAL DIRECTOR TOGETHER, AND CONFERENCE IN THE CHIEF NURSING OFFICER SO THEY CAN BE AWARE OF WHAT IS GOING ON IN THIS OPERATING ROOM. WE SHALL THEN FIND OUT WHAT THEIR STANCE IS ON ANESTHESIA CARE AND TURNING OVER THE OPERATING ROOM." After he did that, she hung her shoulders & walked out of the doorway, never to give anesthesia a hard time again. It would be a very difficult thing to try to explain to a jury that you brought your patient to the PACU when they weren't breathing because the nurse manager told you to do so, and it resulted in hypoxic or anoxic brain damage. But, the only thing the nurse managers care about is room turnover, time & getting more patients in & out of the rooms because that's what is being shoved down their throats by the administrative bean counters who have no knowledge or experience in health care or how an operating room & anesthesia works.

    There will be an increased demand for CRNA's if the healthcare system continues to go the way it is now going---decreasing reimbursement rates, trying to move more patients through the OR & anesthesia departments trying to spend less to make more. When an anesthesia department can bill the same amount for a case that a CRNA does because they are "supervised" by an MDA, yet not pay an MDA salary & instead pay a CRNA 1/3 of what an MDA would cost, it is a very good financial decision.
  6. by   loveanesthesia
    I looked at the study when it was published in 2007. You can find it at: http://www.rand.org/content/dam/rand...RAND_TR688.pdf

    There are some assumptions that I find suspect. Such as (on page 11) : [FONT=AGaramondPro-Regular]While, nationally, supply and demand would have to be equal, within a state, they need not.
    Basically their method starts with the assumption that nationally there is no shortage, and they look at individual states to find the states with shortage.
    10 years later their predictions have not been demonstrated in the market. The demand for CRNAs is accelerating.


    As for your career, if you want to be an anesthesiologist, then that is what you should do. You will not be happy as a CRNA, and nursing school is risky for you. You may not be admitted to a CRNA program.

    [/FONT]
  7. by   superking
    Why I may not be admitted into CRNA school?Any particular reason?Even if I have great credentials?
  8. by   loveanesthesia
    If you are not scoring well enough to get into an anesthesia residency, then you may not score well enough to get into a CRNA program. CRNA programs are not easier to get into than residency, just different with a nursing background.
  9. by   superking
    I am in the 3rd semester of school.So far I have GPA of 3.94.In fact I think I am finding subjects easy as I already know almost everything due to my medical background.If you want to say that CRNA school will not accept me because of me being a doctor,That is another thing.
  10. by   superking
    For God sake Do not ever compare Anesthesiology residency with CRNA school.There is hell of difference in capabilities of applicants.
  11. by   manusko
    Quote from superking
    For God sake Do not ever compare Anesthesiology residency with CRNA school.There is hell of difference in capabilities of applicants.
    Make sure not to say things like this if you do get an interview and find yourself in a position to get into school. You may also need to humble your physician roots while working as a nurse. It may be a bitter pill to swallow if a physician tells you how to proceed while treating a patient and you do not agree.
  12. by   Bluebolt
    Quote from superking
    For God sake Do not ever compare Anesthesiology residency with CRNA school.There is hell of difference in capabilities of applicants.
    This is a foolish statement, especially coming from someone who has not achieved admittance into a CRNA program and experienced the curriculum and clinical rotations. I'm assuming from your posts and loose grasp on the medical/anesthesia world in America that you're originally from a different country. The education and training rigors of medical school or a CRNA doctorate in America will be very different than most other countries. Just do your best in school, work hard on perfecting your English, complete all the steps to submit your application and try to stay humble.

    Manusko, "You may also need to humble your physician roots while working as a nurse. It may be a bitter pill to swallow if a physician tells you how to proceed while treating a patient and you do not agree."

    I'm assuming you're referring to when this student finishes their BSN and is working in the ICU to satisfy his critical care experience requirement to apply to CRNA school. Just to clear the statement for anyone confused as a CRNA you're an independent anesthesia provider and no physician tells you how to proceed while treating a patient. In that case, they would need to come provide the anesthesia themselves if they are so opinionated. If you're working in an ACT model an anesthesiologist may give their opinion on how they would proceed and you would be wise to listen to your colleague if they give sound advice. That isn't to be confused with someone telling you what to do or how to practice anesthesia.
  13. by   manusko
    Correct. There's nothing wrong with the term nurse but I would never leave out the credentials of a CRNA.

    I would also also add that having a great GPA and experience is only part of the puzzle. If you don't interview well then they could care less about who you are or were. You could also get through most of your CRNA program and be removed. Some programs will remove poor performers and people with poor attitudes. Many people have been released after making it most of the way through.

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Future looks bleak for CRNAs