Would you rather? An Application Process Discussion

RLtinker, LPN · Jun 1, 2012

My school is based of a point system. The points are based off of 4 classes and the TEAS. It works like this, we get x number of points for each letter grade in each of 4 subjects. An A in English and psych for an example is worth 15 points, an A in AP 1 and AP 2 is worth 30 points. We could get a maximum of 90 points from these four classes. The TEAS is worth a max of 100 points for a total max score of 190 points. Each program (LPN and ADN) takes the top 60 students. I believe last semester had something like 300 applicants. As you can image you don't get in without an A's in ENG, PSY, AP1, and AP2 so the real admission criteria is your TEAS score. That is a lot of pressure to put on one test. I wouldn't say it is a great system and I don't particularity like it, but it makes some sense in the context of my school.

Admission based off of interviews is kind of a murky area. How does one grade an interview objectively? Beside some people just don't interview well. Not to mention the amount of time required interview 300 plus applicants. It's not always practical.

rubato, ASN, RN · Jun 1, 2012

My school had a GPA based system mixed with ACT scores and an interview. The interview was worth 40% of the final score, but the only way to get in to the interview was with the ACT and GPA. So, the top 115 based on grades were put in interviews and out of those, the top 64 were selected. I think it works, however, I have friends that don't do well on tests that would be excellent nurses. They were turned down in favor of people that do test well (same GPAs).

I think it's important that you be able to learn, so the GPA does have to count for something. I also think it's important that you can take a test and not have major test anxiety, otherwise you'll never pass the NCLEX. But, I think someone's ability to think fast on their feet and handle the stressful situations that will arise as a nurse are important too.

metal_m0nk, BSN, RN · Jun 1, 2012

I took an ACT and two placement tests, submitted 3 letters of recommendation and an academic resume and my GPA was 4.0. There were over 500 applicants and only 50 spots. I don't really have an opinion as to which I would personally prefer. If all they had to go on was my GPA, I would have been a top applicant anyway.

OKNurse2be · Jun 1, 2012

My school is based on Achievement points and the max number of points is 24. For instance, having a prior degree is worth points, and GPA matters in the sense of 3.75+ gives 3 points, 3.5-3.74 gives 2 points, TEAS above 62% gives 3 points, so on and so forth. My program admits 72 students per semester with an average of 300 or so applicants, and in general the minimum amount of points that get you in is 16. When they have to choose between mulitple people with same # of points they rank em by GPA. I got in with 18 points for Fall this year. My school is a community college ADN program with excellent reputation in the community. There are no letters of recommendation needed, nor are there any interviews.

Stephalump · Jun 1, 2012

We had a points system, as well. Mind you, there were minimum requirements to even apply - if you have lower than a 2.5, get less than a 75 on any section of the HESI, get less than a C on prereqs, you can't even apply - but once you're

through, it's just basic points.

GPA is up to 4 points, #of prereqs completed is converted for up to 4 points, and HESI score is converted for up to 4 points. So, basically, whoever gets closest to 12 points gets in!

2BRN123 · Jun 1, 2012

Wow thanks for the responses! Lots of points systems going on. The local CC has a points system too but there are THOUSANDS of applicants to the program with limited spots so its kind of confusing what they do beyond that system.

RLTinker had mentioned objectivity being in question. In thinking about this we had talked about how going on GPA and Grades is surprisingly subjective also. My friends and I had taken the same classes last semester. Micro (with the same professor) and A&P with 3 different professors. We all studied together and had a great understanding of the material, but one of the 3 professors graded spelling where the other two did not. My friend in the spelling graded class ended up with a C in the course despite the fact that she would score higher on the departmentalized multiple choice tests!

We also had other students in our A&P class tell us that they had taken Micro in previous semesters and found it to be a cakewalk (they didn't have our professor). No lab reports, quizzes galore to help build your grade, bonus points for attendance. We had none of that! Nobody escaped our class with higher than a B! And to top it off we had only 4 examinations, and 4 lab reports, one of which was nearly 30 pages long.

This is really where the challenge is. Is it fair to judge people only on their #'s considering even GPA is a deceptively subjective matter?

Stephalump · Jun 1, 2012

It's usually just a list in order of points from highest to lowest. They start at the top and give spots until there aren't any more left. My district is in a large, urban area, and there are far more applicants than spots, the points go out to the thousandths place, and if there's still a tie, they use the score on the A&P section of the HESI as a tie breaker.

rubato, ASN, RN · Jun 1, 2012

RLTinker had mentioned objectivity being in question. In thinking about this we had talked about how going on GPA and Grades is surprisingly subjective also. My friends and I had taken the same classes last semester. Micro (with the same professor) and A&P with 3 different professors. We all studied together and had a great understanding of the material, but one of the 3 professors graded spelling where the other two did not. My friend in the spelling graded class ended up with a C in the course despite the fact that she would score higher on the departmentalized multiple choice tests!
We also had other students in our A&P class tell us that they had taken Micro in previous semesters and found it to be a cakewalk (they didn't have our professor). No lab reports, quizzes galore to help build your grade, bonus points for attendance. We had none of that! Nobody escaped our class with higher than a B! And to top it off we had only 4 examinations, and 4 lab reports, one of which was nearly 30 pages long.
This is really where the challenge is. Is it fair to judge people only on their #'s considering even GPA is a deceptively subjective matter?

In my school, I had the hardest A&P professor, by far. During the semester I felt bad because I had to work harder than people with other professors. But, I learned it! And my A looks a lot better than someone's A from the other professors. It looked so good that when I was talking to an advisor from another school that I will transfer to for my BSN in 2 years, they waived the separate anatomy and physiology classes and are letting me get away with the combined one because they know how hard my professor was! :up:

♑ Capricorn ♑ · Jun 1, 2012

Is it weird to anyone else that a seeming growing number of nursing schools are requiring fewer and fewer application items and relying solely on GPA?
Would you rather be judged solely on your GPA? or do the work of completing additional materials to factor in to your admissions decision?
Which system is more fair to the applicant pool? ...provides a BETTER student pool?
What kind of things did you have to do / submit as a part of your application?
Any "ol' bats" notice a difference in the types of students being graduated, or feel like their application process was harder? easier? smarter?
This is really where the challenge is. Is it fair to judge people only on their #'s considering even GPA is a deceptively subjective matter?

Q1. To me, I think it depends on the location and the school. What one school may consider necessary, another may not. I could see how & why a large CC or University would require less for admissions, than a smaller and/or private school who would require everything. Its up to the discretion of the school. Maybe some schools do it to cut costs or maybe some find certain requirements not necessary anymore, maybe some do not find it beneficial to the student and the school. Whatever their reason may be, the final decision rests with the school. I personally, have not noticed this in my area. Then again, I only applied to one school and was accepted. Do I think it is weird? Sorta. To me, I get the impression that a school is taking the easy way out, or maybe just simplifying their admission process so they have less to deal with. However, in doing so, it increases the pressure on the student to really and seriously get those good grades for admission!

Q2. Nope, not solely on GPA. I'd rather complete all the additional materials and have it factored in to my admissions decision. Let me tell you why. The GPA is a number, right? But, the applicant is a person. Who is to say that an applicant with a high GPA will succed and graduate from a nursing program, more than an applicant with an average GPA who might fail or quit the nursing program. In fairness, an average GPA student has the same opportunity as a high GPA student would to succed in nursing school when given the same tools, information, and education etc. So, why must a number define a person as a whole and what they are capable of? Is it truly a competition of accepting the best GPA of the best, or being accepted for oneself and doing ones best in school? See...that is where the GPA fails. Sure, the GPA does provide a statistic of how one did in school, based on numbers. But, it is the person who must master and learn the material to the best of their knowledge and ability. GPAs don't test knowledge or ability. Exams test knowledge and people demonstrate ability. Yep, I think the GPA system is flawed. Because, it does not factor (pun, intended) in people and life. It does not factor in a student's problems or issues during school. Or, if a student was having a bad semester or had a "bad" teacher. Or, if a student wasn't being treated fairly or given the same opportunities as others. The list can go on and on. So, no. I'd rather do more than what is required or given, than being judged solely on GPA.

Q3. The latter one. Because, the person is involved in the process, not just the GPA. Provides a better student pool? Hmm...that is relative to me.

Q4. I had to submit an application, transcripts, an essay, letters of recommendation, references, and I had to interview with the Dean of my school. My school follows the point system too.

Q5. "Ol bats" :lol2: I can't answer this because I am not an RN or a nurse educator, just merely a nursing student.

Q6. See Q2.