Would you like nursing unions in Alabama?

U.S.A. Alabama

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I'm just curious after reading some of the comments on unions in other threads, what nurses in Al. think about unionizing. Are you for it or against it and why or why not?.

You have to have money in the coffers to get anything done. Besides, given the South's history of resistance to change and the response groups from outside get when they try to advocate for change here, I don't think it would be productive for them to try to make changes w/o the local nursing core behind them. I don't know that unions would be the best way to bring about change but they are one way and I don't see anyone stepping up w/ another idea.

What exactly is "the South's resistance to change?"

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Specializes in Cardiac Care, ICU.
What exactly is "the South's resistance to change?"

Check into any time unions have been proposed and I think you'll see stiff resistance in all cases. Also, the South just tends to be a very traditional area and anything that sounds like something new and liberal is looked on w/ a little suspicion. That is not altogether a bad thing, change is not always synonamous w/ progress, but it does mean that sometimes things move a little slow here. The urban areas tend to be a little more foreward moving but there are things in my neck of the woods that haven't changed in who knows how many years.

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Specializes in General.
I'm not a nurse (yet), but FWIW, I think unions would be a bad move for Alabama. Yes, the pay is not exactly on par with other states, but the cost of living is less here too. With health care costs being such a hot button issue at the moment, unionizing in order to raise pay and reduce workload will only serve to eliminate nursing jobs as the greater financial pressure forces downsizing of hospital services offered. The line between keeping pay high and pricing yourself right out of the market is very thin and a union would only make that line thinner.

I'm sorry but I must disagree. When you do become a nurse and work for what we work for, and lay your license on the line every time you accept a patient assignment, you will see. Hospitals are a business, FYI they are NEVER not for profit, regardless of what they say, maybe the foundation themselves, but there are plenty of suits pulling in huge paychecks to make decisions. Nurse to patient ratios in this state are horrible. I see it in ALL AREAS in the hospital, and we accept it because we have to. They don't care if 2 or 3 of you walk out unhappy, because there are 2 or 3 more waiting to come in. Not to knock new grads, but they are taking jobs and leaving jobs left and right because they get a taste of what they will be thrown into. The turnover rate for nurses in alabama is LESS THAN 2 YEARS!! There is an ongoing research program taking place, and I have a feeling that it is to lay the groundwork for labor unions to start to come south and "talk with us" as a whole. I've heard from administrators at 3 of the larger hospitals that the "research" is digging up some big problems. Funny thing is, when the reality sets in and unions start talking up plans, you will see a HUGE increase in hospital pay and retention bonuses, etc. because they will absolutely PANIC. Hide and watch :lol2:

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If the Unions' priority was Nurse-Pt Ratio and other safety concerns, then why are they not here in Alabama advocating for that now instead of wanting to establish a union first? There is no law preventing them from lobbying the Legislature for new laws before dues are sought. Just food for thought.

That is exactly what nurses in Texas are doing:

http://www.calnurses.org/nnoc/texas/

Probably if you get a few nurses together you can start working on asafe staffing ratios, patient advocacy, and whistleblower protections for nurses in Alabama too.

http://www.calnurses.org/nnoc/

I haven't been to Alabama but do work with nurses who grew up there and attended Auburn University. The University of Alabama is a premier nursing research and trauma center.

People have made amazing changes in your state.

And NURSES can do it!

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I'm sorry but I must disagree. When you do become a nurse and work for what we work for, and lay your license on the line every time you accept a patient assignment, you will see. Hospitals are a business, FYI they are NEVER not for profit, regardless of what they say, maybe the foundation themselves, but there are plenty of suits pulling in huge paychecks to make decisions. Nurse to patient ratios in this state are horrible. I see it in ALL AREAS in the hospital, and we accept it because we have to. They don't care if 2 or 3 of you walk out unhappy, because there are 2 or 3 more waiting to come in. Not to knock new grads, but they are taking jobs and leaving jobs left and right because they get a taste of what they will be thrown into. The turnover rate for nurses in alabama is LESS THAN 2 YEARS!! There is an ongoing research program taking place, and I have a feeling that it is to lay the groundwork for labor unions to start to come south and "talk with us" as a whole. I've heard from administrators at 3 of the larger hospitals that the "research" is digging up some big problems. Funny thing is, when the reality sets in and unions start talking up plans, you will see a HUGE increase in hospital pay and retention bonuses, etc. because they will absolutely PANIC. Hide and watch :lol2:

Don't forget though, that Unions are big business also. They are ONLY in it for the dues.

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Specializes in Home Health.
I'm sorry but I must disagree. When you do become a nurse and work for what we work for, and lay your license on the line every time you accept a patient assignment, you will see. Hospitals are a business, FYI they are NEVER not for profit, regardless of what they say, maybe the foundation themselves, but there are plenty of suits pulling in huge paychecks to make decisions. Nurse to patient ratios in this state are horrible. I see it in ALL AREAS in the hospital, and we accept it because we have to. They don't care if 2 or 3 of you walk out unhappy, because there are 2 or 3 more waiting to come in. Not to knock new grads, but they are taking jobs and leaving jobs left and right because they get a taste of what they will be thrown into. The turnover rate for nurses in alabama is LESS THAN 2 YEARS!! There is an ongoing research program taking place, and I have a feeling that it is to lay the groundwork for labor unions to start to come south and "talk with us" as a whole. I've heard from administrators at 3 of the larger hospitals that the "research" is digging up some big problems. Funny thing is, when the reality sets in and unions start talking up plans, you will see a HUGE increase in hospital pay and retention bonuses, etc. because they will absolutely PANIC. Hide and watch :lol2:

I agree that hospitals are in the business for profit. I also agree with you that the bottom line is more important to them than a couple of unhappy nurses. This is why I don't think unions will work. The decision makers aren't in the business of satisfying nurses- they are in the business of treating as many paying customers as possible with as little staff as possible. Look at the auto industry right now. The big three had unions getting them better pay etc. and now they are being laid off left and right. All because they got a little too close on the bottom line. Another wrinkle you should take into consideration is that more and more nonpaying customers are walking across the borders everyday. That just further stresses the already delicate balance between prosperity and poverty.

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Specializes in Pulmonology/Critical Care, Internal Med.
I haven't been to Alabama but do work with nurses who grew up there and attended Auburn University. The University of Alabama is a premier nursing research and trauma center.

People have made amazing changes in your state.

And NURSES can do it!

Yeah for AUBURN !!! And don't you mean The University of Alabama at Birmingham. UA and UAB are two very different critters. :)

Having done my clinicals at the hospital that Fronky Bean works at, I can tell you its not the greatest place to work. EAMC (the hospital) is the epitome of business in action. They do make a profit, and they do give the profit back tot he employees in the form of profit sharing. However, I'd take a raise in base pay over the bonus anyday. Many of the manager there are pretty clueless about what their folks want, and they will often skirt the real issues at hand.

As for the south, the south probably views a union as a yankee plot to overthrow the confederacy and the old south. No one told them the confederacy is gone. They are very distrusting of things that aren't southern, and most southerners are taught not to fight those above you so to speak. You are where you are because that is what and where you are supposed to be. You get the pay you get because thats just how things are, and dont' go stiring up the hornets nest trying to change it. It can be hard to explain you really have to experience it for yourself to understand.

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Specializes in Cardiac Care, ICU.
Yeah for AUBURN !!! And don't you mean The University of Alabama at Birmingham. UA and UAB are two very different critters. :)

Having done my clinicals at the hospital that Fronky Bean works at, I can tell you its not the greatest place to work. EAMC (the hospital) is the epitome of business in action. They do make a profit, and they do give the profit back tot he employees in the form of profit sharing. However, I'd take a raise in base pay over the bonus anyday. Many of the manager there are pretty clueless about what their folks want, and they will often skirt the real issues at hand.

As for the south, the south probably views a union as a yankee plot to overthrow the confederacy and the old south. No one told them the confederacy is gone. They are very distrusting of things that aren't southern, and most southerners are taught not to fight those above you so to speak. You are where you are because that is what and where you are supposed to be. You get the pay you get because thats just how things are, and dont' go stiring up the hornets nest trying to change it. It can be hard to explain you really have to experience it for yourself to understand.

Hey A J. I agree w/ totally except for one detail. I think admin. and management know for the most part what we want. They know that they can risk a few of us walking out b/c most won't and even if they have to pay agenct nurses for awile (and they have) it is still cheaper then an across the board raise for all nurses. As for the feeling towards unions that tends to be one held by the workers. Administration knows that if the unions come their paychecks will suffer b/c they will have to pay more. Until the attitude of nurses in the South changes about unions it will be hard to get one started. But, as younger nurses filter in and older nurses start travelling more, I think the tide will change and either we will unionize or pay will go up significantly.

Good to hear from you. Are you in clinicals at EAMC this semester?

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The excellent and kind nurses I work with attended Auburn.

I read the studies coming out of the University of Alabama at Birmingham. They've done important research that has helped my patients. I don't think I know nurses from there.

Anyway I hope the nurses of Alabama discuss ways to advocate for safe staffing so their patients can receive the quality of care they know how to provide.

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Anyway I hope the nurses of Alabama discuss ways to advocate for safe staffing so their patients can receive the quality of care they know how to provide.

Wow, I didn't know the patients in Alabama were receiving less than quality care? Last year my father spent 3 weeks in Baptist Health South CVICU, and I assure you he received EXCELLENT care. I was recently a Pt at DCH Tuscaloosa, and I too received exceptional care. I work as a PCA at a large hospital with a 1 RN, 1/2 LPN, and 1 PCA per patient ratio on med-surge; 1-1-1/4-6 pts on step-down; and 1-0-1/1 or 2 pts in units.

We might talk funny down here, but we provide OUTSTANDING care and service to our patients - without unions thank you!

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Wow, I didn't know the patients in Alabama were receiving less than quality care? Last year my father spent 3 weeks in Baptist Health South CVICU, and I assure you he received EXCELLENT care. I was recently a Pt at DCH Tuscaloosa, and I too received exceptional care. I work as a PCA at a large hospital with a 1 RN, 1/2 LPN, and 1 PCA per patient ratio on med-surge; 1-1-1/4-6 pts on step-down; and 1-0-1/1 or 2 pts in units.

We might talk funny down here, but we provide OUTSTANDING care and service to our patients - without unions thank you!

Your ratios look good. i am very glad you and your father received excellent care.

I was only believing my colleagues who left after several years as registered nurses in Alabama. They tell me it is nice to have the time to provide the care they know how to give since working at our hospital. Maybe if they had worked where you do they would still be there.

I also read threads here on allnurses.com. Maybe the staffing is different in different areas or at different facilities.

https://allnurses.com/forums/f133/staffing-ratios-108606.html

https://allnurses.com/forums/f133/montgomery-anyone-194684.html

https://allnurses.com/forums/f133/hma-hospitals-124691.html

I truly hope the profit motive has not degraded patient care in Alabama as it has elsewhere.

I would never have been interested in a union if new management had not laid off 25% of our licensed nurses and pharmacists. We needed to do something because we can only be in one place at a time.

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Specializes in OB.

I'm sorry, but I have to say NOT LIKELY to the ratios presented in the post above...1 RN, 1/2 LPN and a PCA to ONE med surg patient...tell me where and how do I sign up!!! At our hospital, med surg is usually 1 RN to every 8 to 10 patients (as charge and assessments), then LPNs have 4 to 6 a piece and do meds and bedside care. We may or may not have a PCA on the floor, and at night no secretary. My sister in law is in Birmingham and her M/S unit is the exact same, she too said that her hospital "right sized" about 3 yrs ago, and out the window went the numbers, and 20% of their staff (no warning). This is ACOGs standards, look it up, and they don't care how "fresh" a surgery is or isolation, etc. I have always thought med/surg nurses worked their orifices off, hands down! So if your hospital allows for such numbers, then they are either bleeding money, or I wouldn't get too comfortable. IMHO.

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