Why no union! Without Nurses the hospital can't run!

Nurses General Nursing

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Don't take me the wrong way when I ask this question. I will be graduating in 08 and there are several things I question about nursing. I have seen who truly runs the hospitals in which truly I believe to be Nurses. Take the nurses out of the hospital and they will have to close. Why is it that nurses do not have strong unions that stand behind them or why is it that nurses choose not to have unions? For instance I have a friend who works for a Union as a electrician and when he decides to take a job he is protected by that union. If he is being treated bad they will back him and the men 100%. It is just so hard for me to grasp that nurses who possess such power and are so vital to hospitals would have to put up with administration the way many of you have had to do. Educate me on this! I truly do not understand this. I mean honestly, I do not think a Dr. or pharmicist can do the job nurses do and yet they are treated with roses. Just trying to understand!:)

Specializes in ICU-Stepdown.
A union is only as good as it's members. Everyone has to work collectively together for the greater benefit of all. There can not be individual intrests, nurses have too all work together amd not expect a few to carry the entire load. If you are covered by a CBA it is only good if all members insist tat managment abide by the CBA. Ther is power in numbers and that is how a union can help by providing a common loud voice that will help all.

This is VERY true. If the membership isn't willing to go the distance, a union is little more than a club that collects dues every month. MOST even come complete with T-shirt or patch and bumpersticker.

When I was with the teamsters, most of the members who worked with me, really weren't much in the backbone department. If management knows you aren't REALLY willing to 'go the distance', then you are at a distinct disadvantage before you even BEGIN to negotiate. Basically put, you've already lost before you start. Of course, it takes a lot of commitment, and you have to have most of the members be willing to commit as well.

Specializes in ER, ICU, L&D, OR.
To have a union can mean to trade one set of problems for another. Nothing comes without a price.

When my husband works in papermills, union guys won't even hold the end of the measuring tape to help him measure anything-even if they are sitting right where he is measuring and not doing anything else at the time. Union rules, ya know.

Unions promote a Dictatorship of Mass Mediocrity.

Specializes in ICU-Stepdown.

Perhaps, but they also create a group mentality -and that unity can give you more power than a single voice. There are places that really NEED a union just to get needed changes -but its also my position that there are many places (my own included) that are responsive enough that such a measure is not needed.

Before deciding to go with a place that has a union, I always try to find out WHY they have a union (what was so bad about them that a union was necessary to effect change?) and weather or not such conditions still exist.

Perhaps, but they also create a group mentality -and that unity can give you more power than a single voice.

I think this is very true, not just in the facility but in the political arena as well. After the California Nurses Association got the ratio law passed, Schwarzenegger basically tried to dismantle it.

CNA was relentless. They did offend some people but, they took to the streets and protested every public event he attended. They also took him to court multiple times and won every single court challenge. They attacked and attacked until his public approval ratings were in the toilet and he was finally forced to back off.

Now, the ratio law is pretty much bullet proof. There are several court decisions protecting it from any further challenges. And no governor can walk into office and try to dismantle it.

It just goes to show ... when a union is truly unified ... they can accomplish great things.

:typing

As responders here have eloquently shown, it's a real toss-up when it comes to unions. I worked in a state that was part of the old steel-belt, crumbling manufacturing sector. The union that seduced the nurses in our hospital worked relentlessly to get a closed-shop. After they had that, they'd negotiate away almost everything nurses needed and wanted. ('cause... to have a job at all, you had no choice about union membership.

Under those circumstances, unionized nurses don't have just one pimp... they have two.

I now live in a right-to-work state. Unions have to be a lot more interested in listening to their members. Nevertheless, there is not a flood of applicants flowing to the unionized hospital from the non-unionized one in town. In fact, the non-unionized hospital can be more fluid and pro-active in recruiting. Not bound by a contract, they can (and have) raised overtime pay to double, up from time an a half.

I know I'm jaded... but there is no single magic bullet that will solve the problems with which nurses have struggled for generations. Not unions, not mandatory ratio laws.

Specializes in ICU-Stepdown.

Thats very true. I've worked in places where the union actually caused more harm than good -though the union first did a lot of good (they had a real need for a union) but once that was accomplished, the Union didn't know when to quit and keep things as they were. they basically made the situation such that it wasn't worth doing business, and the company closed up and shut down the plant.

Now the place is going to be dismantled, and will eventually probably be sold as lots for housing or some other development. My grandfather, my father and even I had worked in that plant -though for me it was a 'summer job'. My grandfather retired there, my father worked his way through college there. There were other factors at play, but to deny the union some of the fault would be lying as well.

My point is, they CAN go too far.

Specializes in ER, ICU, L&D, OR.
Perhaps, but they also create a group mentality -and that unity can give you more power than a single voice. There are places that really NEED a union just to get needed changes -but its also my position that there are many places (my own included) that are responsive enough that such a measure is not needed.

Before deciding to go with a place that has a union, I always try to find out WHY they have a union (what was so bad about them that a union was necessary to effect change?) and weather or not such conditions still exist.

The group mentality aspect never appealed to me in the least. We are one, We are invincible, We shall overcome, This was never me. I am completely and totally an individual. I have affected my own changes and outcomes in life, good, bad, or indifferent. I have always marketed myself to get what I wanted for what I had to offer. Unions will never have any appeal for me.

The group mentality aspect never appealed to me in the least. We are one, We are invincible, We shall overcome, This was never me. I am completely and totally an individual. I have affected my own changes and outcomes in life, good, bad, or indifferent. I have always marketed myself to get what I wanted for what I had to offer. Unions will never have any appeal for me.

What about merit? I think it's a dangerous nursing setting whenever a nurse is a nurse is a nurse. If you stretch yourself and pass that certification exam, if you are a mentor, if you serve on practice committees and go to bat for patients and peers... shouldn't you earn more and get more recognition? Doesn't a union just promote the notion of putting in your time and collecting your pay check?

Specializes in ER, ICU, L&D, OR.
What about merit? I think it's a dangerous nursing setting whenever a nurse is a nurse is a nurse. If you stretch yourself and pass that certification exam, if you are a mentor, if you serve on practice committees and go to bat for patients and peers... shouldn't you earn more and get more recognition? Doesn't a union just promote the notion of putting in your time and collecting your pay check?

I have titled that " A Dictatorship of Mass Medicocrity"

Specializes in ER/Trauma.
I am completely and totally an individual. I have affected my own changes and outcomes in life, good, bad, or indifferent. I have always marketed myself to get what I wanted for what I had to offer. Unions will never have any appeal for me.
Ditto that.

cheers,

Unions may very well be a "Dictatorship of Mass Mediocrity"

But, at least, it's mediocrity that pays well.

For $800 in union dues my area, you make $4,800 more a year (after union dues) than with a non-union job. That's a 600 percent rate of return on your union dues investment.

Try investing $800 in the stock market and getting $4,800 back at the end of the year. You'd be lucky to get $160 in the stock market with a 20 percent rate of return.

A 600 percent rate of return on your money is far from mediocre.

And, when you take into account the better weekend differential of $3 an hour more, which most nurses take advantage of twice a month, the pay is even better:

$6,600 more a year, after union dues. That's an 800 percent rate of return on your investment.

If you don't want to make more money, then don't work union.

I'm sure there are some exceptions but BLS statistics consistently show ... year after year ... that union jobs generally pay better.

:typing

Specializes in ICU-Stepdown.

Teeituptom -I assess each case on a case-by-case basis. While Unions as a general rule do not appeal to me -too much bad history -personally- but I never rule out the option. I'm a greedy sonofagun and if I can earn more by going union, I'll go union. It just depends.

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