I see that this catagory has been slow moving lately and I wanted to start a new thread with a different direction. I would like to get everyone's opinion (even the people that have never suffered with addiction). What do you think about your state's peer assistance/recovery program? Do you think it is too harsh or not harsh enough? What state are you in, and do you know the rules or guidelines of your states recovering nurses program?
I just want to get a general view of nurses' education on the matter. I have noticed lately in my hospital that the nurses do not know that there is a recovery program out there. They don't know that there are options and many are scared to report someone, especially if it is their friend. They are scared to report themselves if they need help.
I know that there are more impaired nurses out there than any of us want to admit. I think that if we were educated more on the matter, we could get a better grasp on the situation.
My friend said she would rather jump thru every BON hoop than have to reveal to a new employer that she is on probation. She would rather take the 90 in 90 and the random drug screen with daily call in and the program sponsor if she could get by with a censure. She went to her previous employer after vol. treatment and told about diverting. They fired her but she immediately got new employment with better pay and bennies. More important, she is clean and sober. Once she starts her NP program she hopes her employer will consider her too valuable to let go. They state where she lives has no peer program. I wish it did for her sake. I think the states that have peer programs are more realistic with the discipline handed down.
I know that in Texas, employers MUST know about the program that you're in. It is not off your record until AFTER you're finished. But you do have to work through it to finish it, and everyone knows. It is humbling and it does work.
I have been reading these threads and am wondering if the "success" rate is higher or lower relation to other professions?
If also seems to me that the rigid structure and parameters set by various BON's is more conducive to long term stabilization and recovery as opposed to just going to the 28 day programs then 90/90. It takes far more time for the addict to discern between "not using" and real recovery.
If one was in another profession, once you went through the 28, 90/90, you are pretty much on your own and basically set-up to fail.
The addict does need and requires parameters and rules in which to succeed in recovery. Prior to that our lives were out of control and little did we know how much so, until we have a little "clean" time.
IMO it takes about a year of clean time to get grasp on things as they were and see with some clarity what was happening to not only us but those around us.
In my 28 day rehab, there were 25 people on my floor, the counselors said that probably out of the 25 there would be only 3 that would make it a year without using, not very good odds to say the least.
I have been sober for 24+ years to this point and if recovery was easy everybody would be doing it.
Well,, as you know, it takes several years, depending on what state you're in, to 'graduate' from these programs. It seems to be, in my experience, that most, if not all nurses that graduate from these programs have a huge success rate in staying sober in the years following their completion.
To complete these programs it takes a strong person, a nurse who loves her profession almost as much as she loves to be alive. If the love for the profession is not there, the program could fail for that nurse. It will fail because most of the time the will to stay sober is not backed up by a 'reason' to stay sober. Other than to save one's own life, that is. This is just in my experience with my own recovery and the nurses that I've worked with in their programs and recovery.
Specializes in Impaired Nurse Advocate, CRNA, ER,.
i know that in texas, employers must know about the program that you're in. it is not off your record until after you're finished. but you do have to work through it to finish it, and everyone knows. it is humbling and it does work.
if addiction was truly accepted as the chronic, progressive, potentially fatal disease that it is, sharing your status with an employer wouldn't have to be mandated, it wouldn't be a problem. a nurse with cancer, ms, or brittle diabetes doesn't hesitate to share their status. unfortunately, addiction (the modern scarlet letter) isn't accepted as a disease by a majority of our "profession". look at the language used...nurse addicts are "caught", not diagnosed. nurse addicts have a "problem", not a disease. can you imagine saying a woman with breast cancer was "caught" with this "problem" in her breast? or a man was "caught" with this "problem" in his prostate? it's laughable.
it's truly pathetic the amount of ignorance in the "profession" of nursing regarding this disease and it's prevalence in our colleagues. yes, it's a common problem in other professions and in society as a whole, but i'm focused on nursing. think about it, how can we expect to change society's view of this disease if we can't change it in our own "profession"?
as an example of how our own colleagues attempt to avoid the reality of this disease, they focus on the wide variation quoted in the percentages of nurses who suffer with substance abuse and addiction ( depending on the article, the rate is quoted between 8 - 25%), as if this somehow proves the problem isn't as "bad" as some say. what they never take into consideration is the large number of those with addiction who are never "discovered" or who never "report" their status and are therefore left out of the numbers. anything to keep from facing the reality that this disease is the number one public health problem in our country, and that nursing isn't immune.
i'm a member of a national group of recovering nurse anesthetists. there are hundreds of members with long term, continuous sobriety who do not share their status as recovering individuals with their employers (this is after years of recovery, not while they are in treatment and in the alternative program). they know things would begin to deteriorate if that information was shared. how do they know? because they have experienced it in their own lives or the lives of their colleagues. (that's the purpose of the americans with disabilities act, to protect a person with a disability from outright discrimination by employers, schools, etc.). i'm not saying the employer shouldn't know a nurse is recovering and in the alternative program. of course they should. denial of the disease is the major sign/symptom. an addict can't truly recover if they don't break through denial and accept they have the disease. in order to recover, the addict must learn as much about their disease as possible, how it alters their thinking which allows them to continue to use despite the increasing negative consequences of that use. in order for that to happen, they have to be abstinent long enough for the brain to heal, allowing them to retain the information necessary to learn new ways of coping with life's stresses without the use of chemicals. but a person isn't going to seek treatment if they are afraid of all the fecal material that will be heaped on them if they actually admit they are ill.
one of the things i do as a peer advisor for nurse anesthetists is provide a "wellness" booth at all association meetings/programs. we provide information about the disease (which is the #1 health risk associated with the practice of anesthesia!) and that treatment can, and does, lead to long term recovery. we also provide contact information for the 2 peer advisors in the state of ohio, how we can help if they think a colleague or they themselves might have a "problem". (we offer educational programs to hospitals, anesthesia departments, surgery centers, and anyone else interested in learning what they can do to help their colleagues with this disease.) it's really pretty comical, and sad, to watch the activity around the booth. if one of us is at the booth, no one will stop by to pick up the free information (which includes free dvds about the disease in the anesthesia provider), pens, pads, brochures, "wellness warriors", etc. but if we drift away and watch from an area where we can't be seen, people stop and read things and pick up the info, etc. it's almost as if they are afraid they might catch the disease by talking with one of us (because we aren't the least bit shy about telling people our stories). even worse, someone might think they have a "problem"! we also have an open meeting during the conference where recovering anesthetists, friends, colleagues, and family can attend and learn more about the disease, treatment, and recovery. it's rare that we have any significant attendance. people might think they have a problem".
we are fortunate here in ohio. the nurse anesthesia association supports us 150%. four of the 5 training programs have us speak to every incoming class about the risks of using alcohol and other chemicals to deal with the stress of the program and the profession. the 5th program never responds, so we have no idea what their thoughts are on the subject. other states aren't so lucky. there are numerous training programs openly hostile to the peer advisors and want no part of them or their message to their students. again, it's as if they think their students might "catch" the disease.
all you have to do is read some of the comments posted on this website (not just in the recovery area, but the entire site) to see the ignorance and blatant prejudice aimed at those unlucky enough to have this disease. the refrain "you did this to yourself" is posted over and over. yet nothing is said about the nurse who smokes and has lung cancer or heart disease. how about the obese nurse who becomes diabetic? they too "did this to themselves". there was even a thread not too long ago about how the board of nursing shouldn't become involved when a nurse is caught driving drunk because what a nurse does in their private life has nothing to do with work. (what!?) according to the dui foundation, a person drives under the influence 87 times before they get caught. if getting caught driving impaired isn't a sign of a "problem", i don't know what is. (http://www.duifoundation.org/)
it's exceedingly frustrating to see the ignorance in the profession and little desire to change this ignorance. i've teamed with a nurse attorney in my area to bring a series of workshops to the nursing community. our first workshop is next week and no one has signed up despite a huge blast of info to the hospitals and nursing schools in the area. pathetic.
Specializes in Impaired Nurse Advocate, CRNA, ER,.
I have been reading these threads and am wondering if the "success" rate is higher or lower relation to other professions?
If also seems to me that the rigid structure and parameters set by various BON's is more conducive to long term stabilization and recovery as opposed to just going to the 28 day programs then 90/90. It takes far more time for the addict to discern between "not using" and real recovery.
If one was in another profession, once you went through the 28 90/90, you are pretty much on your own and basically set-up to fail.
In my 28 day rehab, there were 25 people on my floor, the counselors said that out of the 25 there would be only 3 that would make it a year without using, not very good odds to say the least.
I have been sober for 24+ years to this point ..........wish I put $25.00 down in Vegas 25 years ago on that bet!! Oh thats right I didn't have $25 then......................
Mark
a nurse wannabe
You are so right Mark. Currently, the majority of treatment is based on an acute care model. That means we wait until the crisis is so bad we can't ignore it anymore and we have to intervene. Then the treatment is most likely to be "intensive outpatient" for several weeks. "Graduation" occurs and there may or may not be a formal aftercare program. It is expected that this person is now "in recovery" and a relapse is a sign that they either don't want to recover or that treatment failed.
The disease of addiction causes significant structural and chemical changes in the brain. These changes mean the person has significant alterations in their emotional health, and psychological function. They have serious changes in the ability to make decisions. Most importantly, they have a serious decline in their ability to comprehend and retain new information...in other words they have a serious decline in their ability to LEARN! In order for the brain to heal, it requires abstinence for 18 months to 2 years! This means the person's ability to learn about the disease and how to develop new coping skills is LOWEST at the very time when we provide it.
Our current method of treating addiction doesn't even come close to what works. Insurance companies refuse to pay for treatment that is effective...long term inpatient followed by sober living and a gradual return to the real world. Imagine treating diabetics the way we treat addiction. We would wait until the signs and symptoms of the disease are so blatant we can no longer ignore them. Then, we would only provide enough treatment to bring their blood sugar down to the point where they can function. Then we would discharge the patient and tell them they have to find their own ways of dealing with the consequences of the disease. The final insult would be when they become hypoglycemic or end up in a coma, or develop infections, gangrene and need amputations (they RELAPSE), we would blame the person because they didn't want to be be well. They OBVIOUSLY would rather eat whatever they want and refuse to exercise. They "deserve whatever happens to them".
Absurd, right? Of course it is because we see diabetes as a "legitimate" disease. The same with asthma, cancer, MS, etc. Until we see addiction as a legitimate disease and change our treatment paradigm from an acute model to a chronic, progressive, relapsing disease, it will remain the number one public health issue in our society.
Specializes in Impaired Nurse Advocate, CRNA, ER,.
Well,, as you know, it takes several years, depending on what state you're in, to 'graduate' from these programs. It seems to be, in my experience, that most, if not all nurses that graduate from these programs have a huge success rate in staying sober in the years following their completion.
To complete these programs it takes a strong person, a nurse who loves her profession almost as much as she loves to be alive. If the love for the profession is not there, the program could fail for that nurse. It will fail because most of the time the will to stay sober is not backed up by a 'reason' to stay sober. Other than to save one's own life, that is. This is just in my experience with my own recovery and the nurses that I've worked with in their programs and recovery.
PRECISELY!! Combined with acceptance of addiction as the chronic, progressive, relapsing disease that it is. In one study performed by the AANA, they found that nurse anesthetists who were part of an alternative program where treatment was long term, participation in a stringent monitoring program that lasted at least 2 years, the sustained recovery rate was 80+%. In fact, the currently recommended treatment protocol of the Peer Assistance Advisory Committee for the AANA is a monitoring program for no less than 5 years, with a strong recommendation that some form of monitoring should be considered by the recovering anesthetist for as long as they practice.
We MUST change our current paradigm about substance abuse and addiction if we are going to make any headway in treating those with the disease. If we can't get nurses to understand this, how can we get the layman to understand it?
Specializes in Impaired Nurse Advocate, CRNA, ER,.
Mag...I still think your post about recovering nurses being the "best" is one of the best I've seen. Here it is again:
Just remember, and I know I've said it before many times, nurses in recovery are the best nurses,, I would rather have a recovering nurse take care of me than anyone else. The reasons are:
We KNOW the recovering nurse is sober, she has to do random UA's, a lot of them.
We KNOW that our recovering nurse wants to be a nurse reallly really bad or why else would she jump through these hoops of fire to keep her license? She could easily choose a different career and bypass all the stuff that comes with peer assistance.
We KNOW that our recovering nurse has hit rock bottom and she can handle 'it' when it hits the fan.
Specializes in Impaired Nurse Advocate, CRNA, ER,.
And what do I have? Just my experience. :)
That's more important than any list of statistics! Unfortunately, our "learned" colleagues with the tons of letters behind their names don't seem to think experience means anything anymore. Give me an experienced nurse to care for me or my loved ones any day! :up:
Speaking of experience...I celebrate 14 years at midnight tonight! :)
Specializes in Med-Surg., Agency Nursing, LTC., MDS..
My response to Jacks' posts here is a loud resounding-- THANK YOU MAN--!!! You don't know how much I wish you could travel to CT. and share your wealth of intelligence,insight,experience and compassion with the sorry lot of ignorant health professionals that reside and "work" here. "Denial" truly is the first and single most important symptom of not only the disease of substance dependence/addiction, but also that of the huge narrow-mindedness in our society. To call this a sad and wasteful state of affairs would be a major understatement. I,too, as a previous poster said, that your enlightened words are extremely book worthy. Thanks, also Jack, for your response to a post of mine,"New job woes". I continue to go to great lengths to give the new position my full attention and energy, just as I do for my Recovery....
Jack I also applaud your posts and inner wisdom and are able to articulate the way you can to the rest of us.
I laughed about your teacher who said don't try to make a living writing. I had a teacher who just after the Beatles were on Ed Sullivan, said that in a year one would never hear about them again, so ignore your teacher
:up:
pollyanna83
52 Posts
My friend said she would rather jump thru every BON hoop than have to reveal to a new employer that she is on probation. She would rather take the 90 in 90 and the random drug screen with daily call in and the program sponsor if she could get by with a censure. She went to her previous employer after vol. treatment and told about diverting. They fired her but she immediately got new employment with better pay and bennies. More important, she is clean and sober. Once she starts her NP program she hopes her employer will consider her too valuable to let go. They state where she lives has no peer program. I wish it did for her sake. I think the states that have peer programs are more realistic with the discipline handed down.