The Dreaded Death Bath and a Moral/Ethical Dilemma?

Specialties MICU

Published

So my coworkers and I were discussing a patient who had died recently during bathing. Well, let me clarify..patient didn't actually die during bathing, but the stress of bathing caused a chain of decompensating events that we colloquially call the "Death Bath." This is a pretty common (and anecdotally well known) event in ICUs. With this specific patient another nurse (mind you jokingly) responded "WHY DID YOU BATHE HER??" to which the nurse taking care of said patient replied "She was dirty!"

This made me realize a very interesting moral/ethical dilemma within nursing. With insurance companies, medicare/medicaid cutting reimbursements for patients who recieve HAI's/pressure wounds, should you or should you not perform preventative wound care on patients who are terribly hemodynamically unstable?

One point you could bring up is that the patient who is so unstable that turning/bathing ultimately leads to their demise is statistically not likely to survive long anyway. But one case we have is a patient who went from horrid septic shock crashing to..."recovering" who is now still in our ICU on day 28, but hemodynamically stable. So, had we been doing q2 hour turns on him during his bad phase while he was on multiple pressors and CRRT, we could've possibly killed him (The Death Turn, the evil cousin of the Death Bath). On the other hand if we don't turn him and he gets a decubitus and survives, we don't get reimbursed.

Now, I hate to make you guys think that this is all about money...buutttt....I work in a Level I trauma center which also happens to be the safety net hospital. Money is a huge issue at our hospital and with the increasing costs and reimbursement cuts in healthcare...it's a semi-valid point argument. We're kind of backed into a corner on this one.

Specializes in ICU/Critical Care.

Reminds me of the night we had a patient go into SVT or A-Fib, can't remember which. HR was 180-200. The nurse was in the other room silencing the alarm on her other patient's monitor, never mind going into see the other patient. Oh and after we got the patient's HR stable, she wanted the CNA to help her bathe him. The CNA refused. I would have too.

Anywho, if my patient is hemodynamically unstable they don't get turned.

Specializes in Dialysis.

Since the percentage increase from resting SVO2 in bathing is the same as in visitation (22% vs 23%) could an argument be made that limiting visitation is BENEFICIAL in some patients?

http://books.google.com/books?id=_vWmbeuYRN8C&pg=PA513&lpg=PA513&dq=bathing+causes+40%25+increase+in+oxygen+consumption&source=bl&ots=bF2qKR8I9f&sig=PxsDpEz6FFReLAm41oD4a0JGmcY&hl=en&ei=VcVbSp6RBoic8QSItqzVBQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=9

Specializes in PICU/NICU.

Ahhh, the "death turn".... I know it well. Or how about the ones that drop their pressures and desat simlpy at the sound of the portable XR rolling by their door???:uhoh3:

Fact is some patients do not tolerate stimulation of any kind- 5 pressors, open chest, CRRT, ECMO -whatever.... you just cannot turn some of them, and forget about a bath. I guess if they survive, a pressure ulcer might be the least of their concern.

Like another post said- sometimes I do think they expect "magic".

Specializes in Trauma acute surgery, surgical ICU, PACU.

This is before I worked in ICU...

There was a pt who had been at one point so unstable he could not be turned. So he ended up with a large pressure ulcer on his buttocks. He had a traumatic brain injury, among other things.

I was his nurse on the ward when he transferred out of ICU.

I just remember his wife thinking we had taken a chunk out of his a$$ to fix his brain. (That was exactly how she said it!)

Still makes for funny memories, all these years later! :lol2:

Specializes in ICU.

This relates to a question I asked my manager a few months ago. Not about the ethical piece of it, but the reimbursement piece: If a pt who is A&O x3 refuses to be turned, do we still get reimbursed if s/he develops a decubitus? Pt was unable to move himself but refused us to turn him. So will CMS pay? Us? The pt?

Never got an answer, BTW.

Specializes in Critical Care.

I think the fatal factor involves baroreceptors. IME it it soooo not necessary to bathe a patient who has no reserve. If you turn a patient and he de-sats or drops his pressure precipitously---STOP!!

I have participated in what one might refer to as "benificial patient negligence" more than once.

COMMON SENSE, people. Sheesh............

Another suggestion: get a "DO NOT TURN" order from you MD's. I've done it. CYA to the max.

Specializes in ICU.

Maybe it's just me, but I don't take reimbursements into consideration when I'm caring for my patients. If they can't handle a turn or bath, they don't get one. However, I do document as such and pass on in report so no one thinks I'm being lazy or forgot.

I would think that if the facility adequately documents it, maybe MD orders like the one poster had, insurance can't refuse to pay.

Specializes in SICU.

Great post. I am a new grad. I will be starting in the SICU on monday. I did my capstone in the MICU. My preceptor ALWAYS bathed and turned the patient....even when there were 9 drugs going in, vent, CRRT, multiple organ failure. Was she wrong?

Specializes in Trauma acute surgery, surgical ICU, PACU.
Great post. I am a new grad. I will be starting in the SICU on monday. I did my capstone in the MICU. My preceptor ALWAYS bathed and turned the patient....even when there were 9 drugs going in, vent, CRRT, multiple organ failure. Was she wrong?

If the pt was on all those drugs.... and was still able to maintain adequate BP and oxygenation when turned/bathed, then no she was not wrong. That is good nursing care.

But if the pt dropped his bp or sats while this was going on, she was endangering his life for the sake of a bath.

Specializes in CTICU.

If someone is at high risk of skin breakdown, they get a fancy pants mattress that can do at least some of the alterations in pressure points.

If I can, I always bathe. If they are too unstable, I don't.

If they have unstable C-spine/open chest/new VAD/ECMO that really can't get rolled, we used to use a jordan frame to lift them straight up and at least change the bed and wash the bits we could get at. Was a huge undertaking with lots of people.

We did have one cardiac surgeon once who would not permit us to roll new LVAD patients to the right for 24hrs postop because they could drop their flows so much just from reduced flow thru the LV apex in that position.

Specializes in ICU,CCU, MICU, SICU, CVICU, CTSICU,ER.
As a new grad in a level 4 MICU, how long do you think it would be before I get a patient like that!?? :shudder:

they'll asign you tomorrow:lol2:. Just kidding---You may bget something like this on orientation but after that they should ease you into what you're comfortable with after orientation. That's how we do it with newbies...we tend to retain nurses when we do it this way.

Treat your patients like they were your Mom, Dad, little brother. What would you like someone to do for them? Not turn them? My Dad got heel ulcers in our hospital ICU. They were too concerned for his heart to pay any attention to turning. Being his daughter- meant I didn't know my stuff. The ICU nurses were okay with him having his feet on the bed all the time, why was I so nutty about it? Well he recovered to be transfered to the SNF floor--for heel ulcers so big- he didn't have heels anymore. Long story short--he had his legs both amputated. What do you do- turn or not turn? Do what you would do for your own loved one!:mad:

+ Add a Comment