Survey of Nurses Rights In Abortion

[kmchugh]

WITHOUT STARTING A FLAME WAR, OR A HOLY CRUSADE!! The thread in OB/GYN nursing got me wondering.

Does a nurse have a right to refuse to participate in certain procedures, if s/he feels those procedures violate their ethical code?

Or, is a nurse required to put aside how they feel about an issue to care for a patient whose moral beliefs may be different?

I'd like opinions, but remember, no flaming or evangelism.

Kevin McHugh

[Riseupandnurse]

2. Okay, this one will cause a bit of controversy. People who passed a background check, and interview process could "pay" women for their kids who otherwise might consider abortion. Here's how it might work. A woman is given abortion options and information ALONG with information about my "abortion diversion program". All perspective parents approved to be in the "program database" would have passed backgound checks, and would agree to followup for some period of time after the adoption (the funds to support such oversight would be paid for by an administrative fee included within every "adoption"). It might save some kids from abortion, and would allow couples to cut years off their waiting period as compared to traditional adoption. In addition, the money might help women who would otherwise abort to go to school or otherwise improve their lives (and would provide another option for those women who were considering abortion due to economic pressures). Included within the program would be "places to live" while they were pregnant (for those women that needed and wanted such accomodations). Again, it's not a perfect solution, but it might be something that both sides could agree on (or at least oppose less). To all of those who say these proposals are immoral or offensive I would ask the question, but are they BETTER than the alternative?

Roland:

This is a good idea, but wouldn't work. If you really hear what these women who choose abortion are saying (and I have talked to at least fifty---don't ask) the whole point is to get rid of the unwanted baby. They don't want it, and they don't want anyone else to have it either. Because it's THEIRS, to do with as they wish. I even asked a few of them the specific question, If the baby could be implanted in someone else, someone who wanted it, would that be acceptable? Absolutely not. It's frightening, but they were dead set on getting rid of it, completely rid of it from the face of the earth. And that is what "Choice" is all about. At any rate, the US is not going to make nurses participate in abortion, no matter what some in this thread would like. As far as nurses/doctors having to tell someone they can go get an abortion, does any woman living in America today really and truly not know that? Jan

[fergus51]

Jan, that med student was here in Canada where women get reffered to specialists, that's why referals are an issue. It isn't like in the US.

[Roland]

JanHetherington, why do you think these women feel this way? Obviously, this calls for speculation since you haven't literally "read their minds". Could it be that they fear someone they don't want to know (such as husband, boyfriend or parent) will find out? I don't think money would convince all of them, just some.

I had a friend make a thought provoking point on this issue. He had lost his job as an attorney and couldn't find another (he did after a year). Furthermore, the court refused to lower his $1,500 per month child support while he worked as a 7-11 manager earning less than half his pervious income because they said his education meant that he SHOULD be able to earn what he had before. He was almost arrested for getting two months behind and had his law license suspended (he was paying about $1,000 so after four months he was two months down). HIS point was that a woman can choose to ABORT the child or give it up for adoption. However, as a man he can't compel a woman to have an abortion or give it up for adoption, BUT he can be compelled to pay or face jail. He said he hates being an attorney and would like to go back to school (to be a nurse of all things) BUT cannot aford to make less money. I don't think that I have ever heard this angle discussed before. Even the IRS can't put you in jail for not paying taxes (they can for failing to FILE or commiting FRAUD, but not for simply not paying, although they will take every tangable asset you own). Child support is perhaps the last situation where we have "debtors prison". Of course I think such laws are necessary, but it lends a new perspective on this only being a "women's issue"

[Spidey's mom, ADN, BSN, RN]

One of the things I've always mentioned to my sons during our talks about sex is that a woman can abort your child and you have nothing to say about it. Adoption is a different matter when it comes to rights though. Hopefully by being open and talking about the difficult stuff, my boys will think before they act.

One can always hope. :)

steph

[Roland]

What's troubling to me Steve L. is that so few people will even discuss this issue anymore. Even worse people are starting to get that way on MANY controversial issues. If we get to the point in society where the only debate originates from groups like the NRA and Handgun Control Inc (Sarah Brady's group) then few are going to be persuaded or educated on anything! I may disagree with Fergus, but I love and respect the fact that she at least makes me "look at" my positions and sometimes see where they are logically weak. People say they don't want conflict. Well one solution to conflict is heated, but still POLITE interaction. People can disagree without hating one another.

[JBev]

I agree that nobody should be forced to do something against their moral beliefs; but what should a person do if someone threatens their licensing or reputation??? Can a nurse just walk away without liability?

I have to say that if I am placed in a position where I was threatened to participate in something against my beliefs... I'd immediately contact an HR rep and my lawyer and walk away.... (fyi... I'm only a student nurse at present, but this is what I would do...)