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I was accepted into a state school and an ivy league school for my MSN in midwifery, starting this fall. (I'm already an RN.) It looks like I'll be getting only loans this first year at either place (my applications weren't complete by the first deadlines, so I was waitlisted, then got in each program, but by that time the scholarships were all gone). I think the ivy league school's final financial aid offer, which I'm still waiting for, will actually cover my living expenses, unlike the offer from the state school, which was only for tuition and school costs, so it may be more practical to go there.
When it comes to finding a job after graduation, does it make a difference where you attend school? I want to attend the ivy league school, but the tuition will be twice that of the state school. I'm thinking there will be many benefits to the ivy league school, like networking; better clinical experiences; more non-nursing students (ie GEPN or direct entry), students who have done other things than nursing; plus the prestige of an ivy league graduate degree. I've also never been to the east coast and would love to live there for a couple of years.
Or is it prestigous in nursing to attend an ivy league school? I already have a MA from a top ten school (religious studies) and this has not made two bits of difference in nursing. (If not the RNs, the MDs do notice these things, however ...)
Is there anyone out there reading this who has inside knowledge about the relative merits of degrees from various schools? BTW, the state school is top ranked, I have no hesitation to go there, it has a wonderful reputation, it's in my hometown, and I want to eventually return there to work as a CNM.
If you plan to go into practice with MDs, the ivy league education may be of greater benefit. MDs definitely notice credentials, and unfortuantely many have misgivings about MSN's to begin with (& doubt that the schooling is rigorous) -- therefore, I'd chose the program that is most competitive.
However, you also said that the state school is highly ranked. Does it have a school of medicine that is highly ranked? If so, then you will have good credentials with the state school. For example, the U of Washington is ranked #1 in primary care (medicine) -- a nursing degree is also ranked #1 in the country, and it is respected by both MDs & nurses. So I guess it really depends on the which state school you're considering.
You mention "Prestige" a couple of times. Sounds like you're more concerned about a status symbol, rather you should consider the quality of the education.
2 people you know that went to an "ivy league" (Why do they call them that?) school told you they wished they had attended elsewhere.
I have been around the block also, & I'm not impressed with people who tout there alma mater & then are upset because I do not know what state their "renowned university" is located in. Ok so I did not know where: Cornell, Vanderbilt or Villanova were located, but these individuals thought the world revolved around these universities. It doesnt. And even with their degrees from "Fancy Name Universities they ended up working right along with me!!!!!!
Doing the same job, HA ha.
I have received a perfectly, competent, clinical education beginning as an LPN, ADN, did get a BSN at a private, Southern BAptist university but only because the state university was on probation from board of nursing due to low pass rates. Received MSN/FNP at Universtiy of Texas-El Paso. At the time I graduated, all grads of FNP program passed the ANCC certification the first time. It is considered a very good program due to the endproduct.
S0- if you think attending Yale is your ticket, think again. Hmm-Does driving a Cadillac/Lexus etc make you a better driver than driving a Yugo/Hyundai/Kia???? Will you be a better clinician just because you went to Fancy school??
Do some more research. Ask about clinical sites/preceptors, who actually teaches the didactice courses Nurse practitioners need to be high quality clinicians.
How many students are in each course? How much attention is devoted to you as an individual?
What makes you think the fancy named school will provide better clinical experiences? You are going into primary care/family practice & the best experiences will probably be at low income clinics/county hospitals.
You state that you may have people that have done other things besides nursing. You are probably going to find the opposite-people who had rich parents pay for undergrad, whose parents are paying for grad school & they have never held any type of jobs at all, they had no need to work.(Think about the George Bush's of the world).
Many people who attend state schools actually have really lived life & come with many different occupations as they had no choice but to work while attending school.
Good lord, the OP is just asking for advice! Calm down...
Some Ivys are research-oriented and some are clinically oriented. Columbia, for example, has two separate tracks depending on what you're interested in. Go with your gut. I went to a state school for undergrad and I'm at an Ivy now. Both were/are great. The Ivys tend to be associated with excellent hospitals, but sometimes the snoot factor can get a little wearisome.
Good lord, the OP is just asking for advice! Calm down...Yes, she asked for advice which I gave. I was gentle in my response. SO-put the claws away. :uhoh21:
Some Ivys are research-oriented and some are clinically oriented. Columbia, for example, has two separate tracks depending on what you're interested in. Go with your gut. I went to a state school for undergrad and I'm at an Ivy now. Both were/are great. The Ivys tend to be associated with excellent hospitals, but sometimes the snoot factor can get a little wearisome.
Columbia, Who? What? Where exactly is it?????
Ok, so i'm hitting this topic a little late (by about a year), but because i know people do searches (forum search, google search, etc...) about the topic, I think it's still relevant.
It seems that when SOME people hear the word "Ivy," it hits a nerve. Would there be the same hostility if someone said that they received their nursing degree from ANY top-ranked university?? Are those nursing schools that earn acclaims for their Nursing programs wrong for doing so? Should they not continue researching new methods for patient care? Is it bad to attend (or even want to attend) a top university for Nursing? Or is just the word "Ivy" that elevates the BP? (just like angiotensin II... sorry, bad physiology joke)
Originally Posted by sailornurseYou state that you may have people that have done other things besides nursing. You are probably going to find the opposite-people who had rich parents pay for undergrad, whose parents are paying for grad school & they have never held any type of jobs at all, they had no need to work.
LOL!! i just had to laugh at that because I'm a product of public high school, a community college, and a Texas public university.. so I know great education can be found anywhere. I'm in the second-career, entry-to-practice program (bsn-msn) at Columbia University (in New York City). Right before attending, one of my jobs included unloading 18-wheeler trucks at 5am before heading to my community college on the other side of town to take my prerequisites for the nursing program. I worked 2 jobs during my undergrad to both help pay for college, and help my mom out. Of course there are people who's families never had to worry about money, but I also saw a LOT of that at both Texas Tech and my Community College.... sooooooo that statement is just a generalization, a stereotype probably seen on a TV show.
Back to the point. Is attending an Ivy league school for your MSN worth it?
From my point of view, if you got accepted to an Ivy... YES. YOU SHOULD GO.
1) You were selected among hundreds of HIGHLY ambitious and intelligent people to be taught at one of the most selective schools in the nation with some of the best faculty in the profession and rotations located at some of the best hospitals in the world.
2) Your classmates have been THOROUGHLY selected (on MANY aspects other than just GPA)... and for the most part, REALLY want to do incredible things in the field of nursing. Again, not to say that it's not present anywhere else... but you're HIGHLY likely to be amongst VERY progressive and goal-driven people... you're in one of the best positions to make great connections for the future...
3) You are put in the CENTER of research and technology, and sometimes educated on it before it hits the nation (Columbia was one of the innovators of Nursing PDA. click here for more info).
4) Columbia (i cant speak for the other ivy schools) has OVER 100 years of experience and a HUGE alumni base who work in every scope of the profession and are VERY open and willing to help you as you both begin and grow in your nursing career, no matter WHERE want to work.
BUT, it all depends on you. Being at an Ivy gives you awesome opportunities, education, connections, and may open some doors... but it's up to YOU to decide if you want to use those resources. I'm not here to put down certain schools like some folks here. I'm just replying based from my experience.
Whatever decision you make just remember that Nursing is about the patient. Whatever school that makes you proud and exited about the profession, enthusiastic about helping people, and eager to donate money to scholarships to encourage more to enter the field.... then go for it.
[banana] - a proud product of a Texas public high school and community college. A Texas Tech alumnus currently attending nursing school at an Ivy... [/banana]
My advice, such that it is: NEVER listen to anyone who tells you not to worry about the cost of the program!
That's just dumb. The amount of debt you will be going into now will have a very real and solid effect on your future. Interest rates are getting higher. Taking out a loan for 40 grand now may very well require an ADDITIONAL 25 - 30 grand of interest by the time you get it paid off!!!!! No joke people, I'm looking at my financial aid info for my expensive private school education as I type this. This could affect when you can buy a home, have your family, standard of living etc.
Not to say that this means don't go to the Ivy, just really think about where you want to be financially in 5...10...years and if the cost of the Ivy is going to set your fiscal goals on a back burner for longer than you like.
Personally, I decided oportunity for a private school education was worth the extra cost, and it's not even Ivy. But, I've got dough. I don't think I will be taking out loans and that gives me some freedom in my decision that those who have to take out thousands and thousands of dollars just don't have.
The quality of your education, to a large degree is what you make of it. But I do believe there are networking opportunites you may have access to, that you will PAY for, that going to a cheaper school may not offer. However, this is nursing, we are NEEDED, and so much of networking is just being known as being good at your job. Which can be accomplished anywhere.
In the end, I think my ego got the best of me. I wanted the more prestigious school because I wanted others to know how good/smart/competent/capable I am just by knowing where I'm going to school. It's a valid reason. It allows me to start out a few notches higher in the perspective of those who will be hiring me. I know this b/c I did the same for my undergraduate degree and the "pomp" of it helped me along later (although I HATED my undergrad, and if I had to do my undergrad again, I would go to State).
Some food for thought, good luck.
How many students are in each course? How much attention is devoted to you as an individual?
What makes you think the fancy named school will provide better clinical experiences? You are going into primary care/family practice & the best experiences will probably be at low income clinics/county hospitals.
You state that you may have people that have done other things besides nursing. You are probably going to find the opposite-people who had rich parents pay for undergrad, whose parents are paying for grad school & they have never held any type of jobs at all, they had no need to work.(Think about the George Bush's of the world).
Many people who attend state schools actually have really lived life & come with many different occupations as they had no choice but to work while attending school.
You are absolutely right about the students. George Bush went here, you know. I'm a fool, and this has been the worst possible place for me at this time in my life. I can only blame myself for my mistakes.
You are absolutely right about the students. George Bush went here, you know. I'm a fool, and this has been the worst possible place for me at this time in my life. I've been in hell since last August, my self esteem in the toilet -- I can't compete with them, it's not a level playing field. If I knew what I figured out after I moved here I would have never come here in a million years. They're not even giving me enough financial aid to continue here next year; manipulating financial aid is one way schools get desirable students to stay or undesirables to leave. I can't work 24-36 hrs/wk and do IP clinicals, call, study, thesis, make decent grades, &c. I can't survive on 4 hrs of sleep a night. I have interviews lined up at other programs and hopefully will get accepted elsewhere so I can just finish the dadgummed degree and be done with it. I could say a whole lot more, like about the quality of instruction, but won't. I will say I am ignored and not supported in the least by the faculty, because I don't fit their student demographic, haven't lived a fancy life, am old, and am a nurse, I guess. The faculty remind me of nurse managers who love the young new grads because they can influence them more readily than seasoned nurses. I've never worked with snottier midwives than the graduates of this program. They remind me every day I'm at work that I'm there to serve them.I hope other potential students will see this these threads to help them make a decision; I couldn't find sufficient information to make an informed choice and was taken for a fool, by the glamour of a potential Yale degree. I'm a working class schmuck. I can't afford a plane ticket to visit my kids, and these kids talk about their latest overseas adventure. I need to be around at least a few other people who are like me or who value what I have to bring to the table. Otherwise my anxiety levels are so high I can't learn.
Look at the top programs in US News and World Report. There are mostly state schools: Univ of New Mexico, Univ of llinois, Univ of Michigan, UC, Univ Washington, &c. My advice is to go for those schools, or your local. Many prominent midwives are Frontier graduates! They will have a diversity of students in age, class, and experience, RNs returning to school, as well as DE, which is OK. If you are independently wealthy and can easily afford to cover your living expenses and tuition, if you have someone in your life who loves you and supports you and is by your side while you are in school, and if you understand what kind of social class you will be in contact with on a daily basis, if you can compete with hypercompetitive young women, then go for the Ivy. (Maybe Columbia is more diverse, from what the poster from Texas was saying. I'm from TX, too! More power to you!)
Wow....that sounds like hell, literally. Come back to Texas ! I'm at UT Arlington, pay about 800.00 for a 3hr class and am just plodding along at my own pace. I see my daughter daily, am not stressed out, have time to exercise and have a hobby or two and most importantly...I OWE NO MONEY AND WILL NOT OWE A PENNY WHEN I GRADUATE :balloons: I've never asked a Dr. where they got their degree, so I don't really plan on anyone asking me. I'm sure it is a great program for some people, but it doesn't sound like a good fit for everyone.
Wow....that sounds like hell, literally. Come back to Texas ! I'm at UT Arlington, pay about 800.00 for a 3hr class and am just plodding along at my own pace. I see my daughter daily, am not stressed out, have time to exercise and have a hobby or two and most importantly...I OWE NO MONEY AND WILL NOT OWE A PENNY WHEN I GRADUATE :balloons: I've never asked a Dr. where they got their degree, so I don't really plan on anyone asking me. I'm sure it is a great program for some people, but it doesn't sound like a good fit for everyone.
You go, girl! I just want to be a fulltime student and finish school. I heard of RNs attending grad school who worked full time while going through school. A nurse I worked with in 1992 and I took they physical exam class at the same time; she went ahead with MW school, like a fool I didn't. She worked 12 hr/nights, would leave work at 8am to go to clinical, have clinical all day, go home and sleep 3-4 hours, then back to work. I cannot do that. To those of you who can do that: wow. I couldn't do medical school because I can't stay awake for 36 hrs or get by on 3-4 hrs sleep a night.
Wow, you bring back memories. I took a few prenursing and nursing theory classes at UTA around 1983 - 1984. (I graduated from UD a few years before that.) Susan Grove taught one of them; she wrote the research text we used here last fall.
Best of luck to you.
LDO
19 Posts
hi, if it is YALE I would so go for it. I live in New Haven and that schools campus is just great and plus I would love to be able to say I went to Yale. I know that sounds so bad. good luck and congrats!!!!