Sending nurses over from India???

jgs284 · Apr 24, 2004

Yes! You are right! You can't outsource personal medical care. I am paranoid because I never would have believed the government would let US Companies outsource so much work. In my husband's company, they outsourced most of the IT department and this is a big DEFENSE contractor. Workers in Mexico are doing the IT work for Lockheed Martin Corporation, including personnel records and administration. I do believe if they (big business/hospitals) can figure out a way to outsource, they will, but it seems impossible, doesn't it? Thank you for your reply -- my blood is warming up! Now, if I could just get into clinicals .......

Sheri257 · Apr 24, 2004

I do believe if they (big business/hospitals) can figure out a way to outsource, they will, but it seems impossible, doesn't it?

Well, speaking of tech, outsourcing and paranoia, here's something to watch. Nurse robots:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s1065623.htm

Does this pose a long term threat? Who knows? I wonder if you can teach a robot "critical thinking" and all of the other stuff we have to learn in nursing school. :chuckle Not to mention, it's questionable whether the states or federal government would go for it.

Nevertheless, since only the paranoid do survive, here's some of the more relevant quotes from the article.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Robots also offer potential in the medical field, where they can be used for nursing as well as for lifting and transporting patients.

Mr Muroi said nurse robots are being developed to take care of a patient's paperwork and record and monitor temperature and medical condition around the clock.

"They don't need to sleep", he said.

Robotic "patient transfer equipment" meanwhile is being perfected by Daihen that would enable patients suffering from conditions such as bone fractures or cerebral haemorrhages to be lifted and moved safely without changing their position or posture.

Another form of transport that could be a boon to the wheelchair-bound was unveiled late last year when Tokyo's prestigious Waseda University introduced the world's first two-legged walking robot capable of carrying an adult human being."

Sheri257 · Apr 24, 2004

I do believe if they (big business/hospitals) can figure out a way to outsource, they will, but it seems impossible, doesn't it?

Well, speaking of tech, outsourcing and paranoia, here's something to watch. Nurse robots:

http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s1065623.htm

Does this pose a long term threat? Who knows? I wonder if you can teach a robot "critical thinking" and all of the other stuff we have to learn in nursing school. :chuckle Not to mention, it's questionable whether the states or federal government would go for it.

Nevertheless, since only the paranoid do survive, here's some of the more relevant quotes from the article.

------------------------------------------------------------------------

"Robots also offer potential in the medical field, where they can be used for nursing as well as for lifting and transporting patients.

Mr Muroi said nurse robots are being developed to take care of a patient's paperwork and record and monitor temperature and medical condition around the clock.

"They don't need to sleep", he said.

Robotic "patient transfer equipment" meanwhile is being perfected by Daihen that would enable patients suffering from conditions such as bone fractures or cerebral haemorrhages to be lifted and moved safely without changing their position or posture.

Another form of transport that could be a boon to the wheelchair-bound was unveiled late last year when Tokyo's prestigious Waseda University introduced the world's first two-legged walking robot capable of carrying an adult human being."

suzanne4, RN · Apr 25, 2004

You wrote "Also note in order to hire a foreign citazen of any sort it must be proven that it is a job no US citazen wants or can fill. (Think migrant worker picking fruit for low wages in the hot sun.) So if US nurses are filling the positions, hospitals are not allowed to bring over foreign workers."
Take it from me, that is no assurance. I AM one of those out-of-work tech workers, now pursuing a nursing degree. This post made my blood run cold, because I do believe this can happen. Those Indian workers who provide tech support speak beautiful English, with only a slight accent. I can also see hospitals using this to drive pay DOWN. Supply and demand. What kills me is the wait lists to get into Nursing school here in COlorado is YEARS -- there are thousands of smart, qualified people waiting to get into clinicals. Would the state or federal government address the nursing shortage by fixing this bottleneck? No. That makes too much sense! But based on my own hard experience I can absolutely see them importing foreign, low paid nurses under some emergency exception to the visa laws. This is a train wreck waiting to happen.
:uhoh21:

The Indian nurses have a BIG probelm with passing the TSE and TWE exams. This is well documented. The hospitals are not permitted to pay them differently. They are not coming in as temporary workers like they do in the I.T. field, but as permanent residents. Big Difference!

Your choice was first high-tech, and you are changing to go into nursing, isn't someone else allowed to enter. Remember that nursing is always going to be here, and there will always be a need. I have been in nursing for over 25 years and have never once had a problem getting a job. Twenty five years ago there was a huge influx of nurses from the Philippines................

Did it ever keep me from getting a job? NO . Did it keep me from working where I wanted to work? NO .

I wouldn't worry about it. There si only going to be more of a need for nurses as the population ages, not less. In this lifetime, you definitely don't have to worry.

:balloons:

suzanne4, RN · Apr 25, 2004

You wrote "Also note in order to hire a foreign citazen of any sort it must be proven that it is a job no US citazen wants or can fill. (Think migrant worker picking fruit for low wages in the hot sun.) So if US nurses are filling the positions, hospitals are not allowed to bring over foreign workers."
Take it from me, that is no assurance. I AM one of those out-of-work tech workers, now pursuing a nursing degree. This post made my blood run cold, because I do believe this can happen. Those Indian workers who provide tech support speak beautiful English, with only a slight accent. I can also see hospitals using this to drive pay DOWN. Supply and demand. What kills me is the wait lists to get into Nursing school here in COlorado is YEARS -- there are thousands of smart, qualified people waiting to get into clinicals. Would the state or federal government address the nursing shortage by fixing this bottleneck? No. That makes too much sense! But based on my own hard experience I can absolutely see them importing foreign, low paid nurses under some emergency exception to the visa laws. This is a train wreck waiting to happen.
:uhoh21:

The Indian nurses have a BIG probelm with passing the TSE and TWE exams. This is well documented. The hospitals are not permitted to pay them differently. They are not coming in as temporary workers like they do in the I.T. field, but as permanent residents. Big Difference!

Your choice was first high-tech, and you are changing to go into nursing, isn't someone else allowed to enter. Remember that nursing is always going to be here, and there will always be a need. I have been in nursing for over 25 years and have never once had a problem getting a job. Twenty five years ago there was a huge influx of nurses from the Philippines................

Did it ever keep me from getting a job? NO . Did it keep me from working where I wanted to work? NO .

I wouldn't worry about it. There si only going to be more of a need for nurses as the population ages, not less. In this lifetime, you definitely don't have to worry.

:balloons:

suzanne4, RN · Apr 25, 2004

Well, speaking of tech, outsourcing and paranoia, here's something to watch. Nurse robots:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s1065623.htm
Does this pose a long term threat? Who knows? I wonder if you can teach a robot "critical thinking" and all of the other stuff we have to learn in nursing school. :chuckle Not to mention, it's questionable whether the states or federal government would go for it.
Nevertheless, since only the paranoid do survive, here's some of the more relevant quotes from the article.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Robots also offer potential in the medical field, where they can be used for nursing as well as for lifting and transporting patients.
Mr Muroi said nurse robots are being developed to take care of a patient's paperwork and record and monitor temperature and medical condition around the clock.
"They don't need to sleep", he said.
Robotic "patient transfer equipment" meanwhile is being perfected by Daihen that would enable patients suffering from conditions such as bone fractures or cerebral haemorrhages to be lifted and moved safely without changing their position or posture.
Another form of transport that could be a boon to the wheelchair-bound was unveiled late last year when Tokyo's prestigious Waseda University introduced the world's first two-legged walking robot capable of carrying an adult human being."

If there is a robot to lift patients for me, great..................I remember when the digital machines came out that allowed a nurse to monitor BP, HR, Temp, and pulse ox at the same time, and there were quite a few nurses that thought that that would change their jobs and left them feeling insecure.

Has it? Not at all. Just made our lives easier................And do you have any idea as to how expensive that these robots are going to be? I don't see hospitals running out to purchase them quickly.

suzanne4, RN · Apr 25, 2004

Well, speaking of tech, outsourcing and paranoia, here's something to watch. Nurse robots:
http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/s1065623.htm
Does this pose a long term threat? Who knows? I wonder if you can teach a robot "critical thinking" and all of the other stuff we have to learn in nursing school. :chuckle Not to mention, it's questionable whether the states or federal government would go for it.
Nevertheless, since only the paranoid do survive, here's some of the more relevant quotes from the article.
------------------------------------------------------------------------
"Robots also offer potential in the medical field, where they can be used for nursing as well as for lifting and transporting patients.
Mr Muroi said nurse robots are being developed to take care of a patient's paperwork and record and monitor temperature and medical condition around the clock.
"They don't need to sleep", he said.
Robotic "patient transfer equipment" meanwhile is being perfected by Daihen that would enable patients suffering from conditions such as bone fractures or cerebral haemorrhages to be lifted and moved safely without changing their position or posture.
Another form of transport that could be a boon to the wheelchair-bound was unveiled late last year when Tokyo's prestigious Waseda University introduced the world's first two-legged walking robot capable of carrying an adult human being."

If there is a robot to lift patients for me, great..................I remember when the digital machines came out that allowed a nurse to monitor BP, HR, Temp, and pulse ox at the same time, and there were quite a few nurses that thought that that would change their jobs and left them feeling insecure.

Has it? Not at all. Just made our lives easier................And do you have any idea as to how expensive that these robots are going to be? I don't see hospitals running out to purchase them quickly.

Rep · Apr 25, 2004

I don't think that foreign nurses are taking away jobs mean for American nurses.

In fact, the US goverment makes it harder for foreign nurses to get into the states. Here in the Philippines, the hindrance to it are the different English exams required. Most Philippines nurses failed in these exams although most of us can understand and speak the language well. Even the working visas they are issuing to foreign nurses require the English exams unlike before where one can go to the US with only a CGFNS Certificate. Not this time, aside from the CGFNS, there are the TOEFL, IELTS and TSE exams.

But I can attest that foreign recruiters would spend everything for foreign nurses just to bring them to the US. These includes fees for the reviews and exams, immigrations , etc. Plus free housing for a couple of months.

So, out of the thousands of Philipines nurses who apply every year for a job in the US , only a few hundreds can realize their dreams. And thousands are needed to ease the nursing shortage. :)

Rep · Apr 25, 2004

I don't think that foreign nurses are taking away jobs mean for American nurses.

In fact, the US goverment makes it harder for foreign nurses to get into the states. Here in the Philippines, the hindrance to it are the different English exams required. Most Philippines nurses failed in these exams although most of us can understand and speak the language well. Even the working visas they are issuing to foreign nurses require the English exams unlike before where one can go to the US with only a CGFNS Certificate. Not this time, aside from the CGFNS, there are the TOEFL, IELTS and TSE exams.

But I can attest that foreign recruiters would spend everything for foreign nurses just to bring them to the US. These includes fees for the reviews and exams, immigrations , etc. Plus free housing for a couple of months.

So, out of the thousands of Philipines nurses who apply every year for a job in the US , only a few hundreds can realize their dreams. And thousands are needed to ease the nursing shortage. :)

powel_44 · Apr 25, 2004

You cannot get a green card without having English skills the same as a native speaker so that severly limits the amount of foreign nurses who will be coming over to the US. I wouldn't worry about them taking a job from you.
There are more than enough to go around.....................
There are actually some unscrupulous people over here promising the nurse that they can go to the US with only a CGFNS exam and no English requirements and work as an RN. Pay is about $16 BLENDED rate as they call it for California, meaning that the nurse works 12 hour... ................but as they say "What goes around, comes around."

Im also a nurse from other country, i was advised not to accept a job offering a salary lower than $7/hour (whether a nurse or not) to any parts of the world. In US territory, an RN is receiving more than >$20/hour(probably at hospital settings)...

Yeah, some poeple are unscrupulous. But one some read carefully the content eventhough the reader does not speak fluently. This will be his/her only guardian from trickery. It is true also that some are not good in english, communication may be mistransmitted that may lead to a further threat/burden. The TSE/TWE is a must. In on of the theory the General Adaptation theory, one/nurse must adopt to his environment, and so therefore, language may too...

Before those nurse make a move ,that do not know that not only CGFNS should be taken in order to work in US, they must first accept the consequences have have been into. Or if they already know the trickery may be possible, they should have been anticipate it. THey must study englich language before accepting the job.

Anyway, CGFNS may serve as a passport. If thewy do not pass in other exams. They can also work as a janitor, waiter in a fastfood. It is a good job with a good salary. Within two years you can buy car or maybe buy a house.

Powel from Philippines

powel_44 · Apr 25, 2004

You cannot get a green card without having English skills the same as a native speaker so that severly limits the amount of foreign nurses who will be coming over to the US. I wouldn't worry about them taking a job from you.
There are more than enough to go around.....................
There are actually some unscrupulous people over here promising the nurse that they can go to the US with only a CGFNS exam and no English requirements and work as an RN. Pay is about $16 BLENDED rate as they call it for California, meaning that the nurse works 12 hour... ................but as they say "What goes around, comes around."

Im also a nurse from other country, i was advised not to accept a job offering a salary lower than $7/hour (whether a nurse or not) to any parts of the world. In US territory, an RN is receiving more than >$20/hour(probably at hospital settings)...

Yeah, some poeple are unscrupulous. But one some read carefully the content eventhough the reader does not speak fluently. This will be his/her only guardian from trickery. It is true also that some are not good in english, communication may be mistransmitted that may lead to a further threat/burden. The TSE/TWE is a must. In on of the theory the General Adaptation theory, one/nurse must adopt to his environment, and so therefore, language may too...

Before those nurse make a move ,that do not know that not only CGFNS should be taken in order to work in US, they must first accept the consequences have have been into. Or if they already know the trickery may be possible, they should have been anticipate it. THey must study englich language before accepting the job.

Anyway, CGFNS may serve as a passport. If thewy do not pass in other exams. They can also work as a janitor, waiter in a fastfood. It is a good job with a good salary. Within two years you can buy car or maybe buy a house.

Powel from Philippines

Sheri257 · Apr 25, 2004

If there is a robot to lift patients for me, great..................I remember when the digital machines came out that allowed a nurse to monitor BP, HR, Temp, and pulse ox at the same time, and there were quite a few nurses that thought that that would change their jobs and left them feeling insecure.
Has it? Not at all. Just made our lives easier................And do you have any idea as to how expensive that these robots are going to be? I don't see hospitals running out to purchase them quickly.

True. It does appear unlikely that this could replace nurses entirely, so I don't really view it as a threat. But you never know. I guess because I lived in Silicon Valley, I learned not to underestimate technology. Remember when the nobody thought the internet would amount to much? And, now, here we are.

:lol2: