We have had countless threads involving nurse's beleif that we are professionals and should be treated as such.
I agree, even us lowly LPNs are professionals and should be treated as such. AFTER it is earned!
A degree/lisence does not a professional make. Respect, and the view of professionalism comes from the public. It is not something that can be assigned based on license or degree.
Yesterday, I was up at the hospital visiting my dad. He's nearly 82. This 26 (or so) year old nurse comes bee-boppin in and says "Hi Ray!". Then immediately turns to me and asks, "Does he go by Ray or Raymond?" WHAT!?
This little bimbette expects to be respected and treated as a professional and she has none for this man? A man who is very obviously her senior. A human being who should be treated with repect and she has no simple common courtesy, let alone professionalism.
Very simply I told her "he goes by Ray, but Mr. F******** would be much more appropriate.
How can nurses expect to be treated as professionals if they are not? No professional would have come into the room, first meeting, and spoken the client/pt in such a familiar manner. This is not a pediatric unit!
She was not the only person I have heard calling my dad by his first name. I would like ot know how many of you out there also show so little respect for your elders and what your rationale is for doin so.
I do not have a problem with RNs. That's just plain silly, we are all nurses and until a specific nurse gives me reason to think she is less than acceptable I really don't care what her title is (or his title for that matter) I am a big proponent for LPNs and our usefullness in the acute care setting and the abilities many of us have. However, this discussion is not about RNs/LPNs or CNAs. It is about rudeness within our ranks, treating our pts in a professional manner, nothing more. The ranks includes ALL nursing staff. She happened to be an RN, that is something I can not change. I would have had the same complaint if it had been a CNA or LPN or even a new Doc on the case.
I think, by the way you talk, you may have a big problem with LPNs and accepting the fact that we are nurses and not (usually) too stupid to recognize unacceptable nursing in those with a presumably better license. You may presume RNs have more responsiblity than the LPNs, but a pt is a pt. And when a nurse accepts the assignment, she is responsible for that pts care. The RN may have more tasks, but she is no more responsible for my pt than I am, even if the RN does have to come in and "do" the IV pushes or TPN. I am still responsible for making sure my pt is responding correctly to the entire plan of care/treatments and to make sure action is taken (usually by the RN assigned to the lines) to correct the situation if not.
No, you are not to forward in asking. I firmly believe the only stupid question is the one not asked; therefore, all questions are valid.
The beef is exactly as stated. I am not a complicated person. She entered the room at the speed of light addressing my dad by his first name. Turned to me and asked ME if he goes by Ray or Raymond instead of asking him. Simple as that. Nothing else to it.
The other issues I have mentioned since the original post were all after this initial introduction. I didn't even evaluate her nursing care until laer that evening, after I had gone home and didn't think any more of it than she is young and inexperienced. It was the next day before I found out that so many errors had been made, and not just by her. So, my beef was and still is the familiarity with which many "professionals" address their elders at the first meeting.
My family is very strict with these things. I know he would never tell a "kid" to call him Ray.
Anyway, it's as simple as I put it. I have no other beef and really don't see where you find in my opst that their may be one.
Perhaps with redwinggirlie that would be a nonissue. It's a nonissue with me as well. If it were my dad in the hospital, I wouldn't have noticed that the nurse came in and say "Hi Dave". I absolutely would have noticed inadequate handwashing or other sloppiness. But the name would have been a nonissue in my family.
I too was raised to respect my "elders". But I'm grown now, so I don't necessarily consider my patients "my elders". I quit having elders when I grew up. Even when I was young and working in insurance my boss was "Mr. so and so" but not because he was my elder, but because he was my boss. The rest of the engineers I worked for were much older than me and I addressed them by first name. So if I address my patients as "Mr. and Mrs." it's not because they are my elders. I certainly don't expect "kids" to call me Mr. so and so.
But we all have our perspectives on how the world should be. I agree it was unprofressional of her. But not necessarily because it was being disrepectful of an "elder". He is a client, not an "elder" to be respected just because he's old. This nurse is a grown woman with a profressional license, don't call her a kid.
Any one who is working caring for patients in the health care arena deserves respect wether they are a NA or PhD. We have a crisis in healthcare at this time and how we get through it depends on how we work together as a team and act as professionals. let's cut out the us against them attitude we're all supposed to be working together for the good of the patient.
So far you have stated this nurse "bee bopped" into the room, called her a kid and a bimbette. I can certainly understand the issue at hand...should we use first names when addressing our patients. Sounds like there is more than one issue here and the major one is this nurse. When my mom was in the hospital I didn't care what they called her, as long as they assessed her appropriately and made her comfortable. I address my patients by their first name once I know them and I also have nurses tell me in report, "This patient goes by Ray" or whatever.
If she was giving good nursing care give her a break. I find more offense at your description of this nurse than how she addressed her patient. I also would have been upset at all the visitors in the room making it difficult to get to the patient but that is a different discussion.
when i meet the patient for the 1st time and when family is present, my initial attn. of course, goes to the patient. that's how i do the initial assessment.
in this assessment, one is determining pain, cognition, sensory deficits, communication, mobility and any related concerns. i find it important to ask the patient on how they would like to be addressed, if appropriate to the situation.
but yes, i do have a personal view on elderly. and just because i'm an adult, i think they should be treated with just a bit more honor, no matter how cranky.
So far you have stated this nurse "bee bopped" into the room, called her a kid and a bimbette. I can certainly understand the issue at hand...should we use first names when addressing our patients. Sounds like there is more than one issue here and the major one is this nurse. When my mom was in the hospital I didn't care what they called her, as long as they assessed her appropriately and made her comfortable. I address my patients by their first name once I know them and I also have nurses tell me in report, "This patient goes by Ray" or whatever.
If she was giving good nursing care give her a break. I find more offense at your description of this nurse than how she addressed her patient. I also would have been upset at all the visitors in the room making it difficult to get to the patient but that is a different discussion.
Like I said, I had just come into the room and my sister and was leaving. We do not all stay. We are talking about an 82 year old man who is very likely dieing. We take turns staying with him as much as possible. When I worked in acute care, I was happy to see so much family with my elderly pts. I was never so busy with lines and assessments and other nursing tasks that I forgot there is a human being who needs his or her family with them. Even if that meant the room was crowded for a few minutes as they came and went. So tell me, why would you be concerned that the room was crowded? Are you so professional that your needs as a nurse become more important than the needs of your pt and their family?
The following day many errors were found. I kept them between her and I, as true professionals would at least attempt.
did you ever think of (gasp) telling her? it could simply be a matter of not knowing any better--three out of the four clinical instructors far regularly refer to elderly clients as honey or dear. while core nursing knowledge is mandated by the state, simply "good manners" are hard to test! perhaps nobody else has taken the time to enlighten "this bimbette"? just a thought....
I am 48 and still to this day address many people as Mr., Miss or Mrs. I never use Ms. as it has no meaning. I was taught as a child to call adults and as an adult those you don't by their sir name and last name. Where I work it is "Inmate Doe".
That's kinda a tough statement in light of the fact that this was her dad. A patient and/or family has every right to expect to be called by whatever name they prefer- decided by them and not the nurse.
In this case the nurse decided for them. Not cool.
Defaulting to the most formal and letting the patient/family de-formalizing down is just common courtesy. Again, when I've dealt with other professionals, they've never just called me "Susie."
There was a patient I was helping to take care of; a 82 y/o retired pediatrician with terminal CA. He wanted to be called Dr. So and So and that's what he was called. He has that right.
I agree with the post that we should use Mr/Mrs form until told otherwise. When I started working in health care we were taught this by our employer. If a pt had another preference, we honored that. I had one pt who wanted to be called Judge Jones (retired Sup court judge) and another elderly dying pt who not only wanted to be called by her first name, she didnt want us wearing scrubs either (home care, liked street clothes). I agree it is a generational issue, the elderly were taught this as kids, that it is RUDE and insulting to address your elder/superior by their first name.
This is probably just a sign of the times. Not that I like it or would put up with it.
Having said that I've been known to call some of the ladies in our LTC wing "Sweetie". :)
steph
Actually I too would prefer I be called Mrs______ by everyone too until I decide otherwise...but hospital name badges insist on our first name in HUGE letters. I think this encourages too much familiarity myself.
I was raised to address others in this way, formally. In Texas, most kids are still raised to do the same.
I call my patients Mrs, Mr or Miss until asked not to. And yes, some of my patients are sweetie too IF the shoe fits and the term is appreciated.
but yes, i do have a personal view on elderly. and just because i'm an adult, i think they should be treated with just a bit more honor, no matter how cranky.
I don't necessarily think the old need any more honor than the young, I treat all equal. I'll call my 18 year old "Mr. so and so" as well as an 80 year old patient, and attempt to get on a first-name basis with both.
But I certainly appreciate that a lot of people feel as you do.
I quit saying "yes sir" do my dad a long long time ago. It certainly isn't a sign that I'm disrespectful, it's just how things have changed as I myself have become an adult. We're on equal ground now. Now it's "hey geezer!". :)
But I do have high esteem for the wisdom and stories of the old. I think the greatest respect and honor we can show them is to listen and learn from them.
There's a nurse on another floor that calls me "Sir", when I'm the house supervisor. I don't bother to correct him, but it makes me uncomfortable. :)
Actually I too would prefer I be called Mrs______ by everyone too until I decide otherwise...but hospital name badges insist on our first name in HUGE letters. I think this encourages too much familiarity myself.
I was raised to address others in this way, formally. In Texas, most kids are still raised to do the same.
I call my patients Mrs, Mr or Miss until asked not to. And yes, some of my patients are sweetie too IF the shoe fits and the term is appreciated.
I'm sure it's my generation and the area of the country I live in, but I prefer first names for staff. I want patients to call me Zach but I always call patients Mr. or Mrs. so-and-so. I, however, speak to most staff members (docs included) by using first names. We are all part of the healthcare team. Out of respect, I sometimes address attendings with Dr. even though I know them by first name.
Dixiedi
458 Posts
I do not have a problem with RNs. That's just plain silly, we are all nurses and until a specific nurse gives me reason to think she is less than acceptable I really don't care what her title is (or his title for that matter) I am a big proponent for LPNs and our usefullness in the acute care setting and the abilities many of us have. However, this discussion is not about RNs/LPNs or CNAs. It is about rudeness within our ranks, treating our pts in a professional manner, nothing more. The ranks includes ALL nursing staff. She happened to be an RN, that is something I can not change. I would have had the same complaint if it had been a CNA or LPN or even a new Doc on the case.
I think, by the way you talk, you may have a big problem with LPNs and accepting the fact that we are nurses and not (usually) too stupid to recognize unacceptable nursing in those with a presumably better license. You may presume RNs have more responsiblity than the LPNs, but a pt is a pt. And when a nurse accepts the assignment, she is responsible for that pts care. The RN may have more tasks, but she is no more responsible for my pt than I am, even if the RN does have to come in and "do" the IV pushes or TPN. I am still responsible for making sure my pt is responding correctly to the entire plan of care/treatments and to make sure action is taken (usually by the RN assigned to the lines) to correct the situation if not.