Nursing Issue - Medication Aides

caye · Apr 6, 2005

Hello all. Now don't get upset at my comments. I am tying to post information.

I live in Houston and the state of Texas has a Medication Program with required curriculum from the state that must be used in the Medication Aide Training Program in addition the pharmacology textbooks. I was the Program Director as well as involved in putting the program together and submitting it to the state for approval. It is a very lengthy process. The program must be taught by an RN and a Pharmacist. The class was 9 weeks and the students have to be CNA's employeed at a Long Term Care facility (Nursing Home); they do their clinicals where they work under the supervision of a licensed nurse. So, yes, there are training programs out there. My students learned pharmacology and all of the basics we learned in nursing school regarding passing meds. My students all passed and are working as CMA's (Certified Medication Aides). CMA's help take the burden off the nurses in nursing homes from passing po meds so the can concentrate on the tube meds, injections, BS checks, breathing treatments,documentation, assessments,etc.

Caye

Hi. I am new to the post. Very shortly a bill will be presented to our legislation on Medication Aides for my state. I am looking for some feedback regarding these aides. I know other programs have been implemented in many other states. How is it working? What are the current problems? Where can I go to find out more information?
In my state they will be mandatory in non-health focused care settings such as: schools, prison, assisted living, daycares, and group homes. The health focused areas are: long term care facilities, rehab centers, home health, hospice, public health depts., clinics, and acute care settings. However, some say it optional for health care facilities. The training is 24 hours. I feel this is very dangerous. It is being implemented to help alleviate some of the nursing shortage we will experience in the near future. Plus, a lot of these med aides already work in some of these facilities and there has never been any formal training. How they were hired is beyond me, but now there is a need to train these individuals. The only requirement to date is: 21 years old and a high school graduate. No prior medical experience. Scary!!!
I am looking for information on how programs of this type are working in other areas? Any problems experienced with the program? Is there an increase in med errors? Where I can go to gather more information?

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Apr 6, 2005

CMA's help take the burden off the nurses in nursing homes from passing po meds so the can concentrate on the tube meds, injections, BS checks, breathing treatments,documentation, assessments,etc.

But whose license if on the line, though? That wouldn't take a burden off of me, it would only add to it to depend on someone else, and TRUST that they would do their job. KNOWING that if they didn't, it's my butt.

GLORIAmunchkin72 · Apr 6, 2005

LPN2RN05

Come to our place: we are hurting for LPNs (and CNAs). If I were to compare the nursing entity to a large animal, say an elephant, we use every part of it. Nothing goes to waste.:)

There was a similuar discussion on another thread that I posted on conserning this very issue. I work in Alaska and in a long term care facility CNA's pass the medications after a 4 hour course on correct ways to pop the meds out of the prepack,,they teach nothing about the medications themselves..except for digoxin..like taking pulse etc.
I was a CNA doing this very same thing for about four years. I looked up my meds to see what I was giving, but honestly I knew I did not have the knowledge base. Although I was accurately passing medications and only had had one minor med error (Thank God) I knew that I was taking a Nurse position. It upset me that not only was I expected to do this among other nursing skills, but I was not getting paid for it, and working outside my scope of practice, because of a loophole in the state law.
So I went into nursing..took my pharmocology and then it hit me hard. the realization of when I was a CNA...I had not clue.
Now that I am a LPN..I am having a hard time finding a job..(guess why)..all that learning for nothing...
I had to recert for my CNA lisence so I can get a job in this town!!!!
Thank God that I am almost finished with my RN..because LPN just arent wanted.
Why pay an LPN if you can have a CNA do the same job for less money??
Pretty much sucks!!

caye · Apr 6, 2005

CMA's have a certification that is on the line. That is if they want to work as a CMA and not on the floor as a CNA. There butt IS on the line.

Caye

But whose license if on the line, though? That wouldn't take a burden off of me, it would only add to it to depend on someone else, and TRUST that they would do their job. KNOWING that if they didn't, it's my butt.

caroladybelle, BSN, RN · Apr 6, 2005

CMA's have a certification that is on the line. That is if they want to work as a CMA and not on the floor as a CNA. There butt IS on the line.

Unfortunately, they will take down a licensed nurse with them.

If I give a med incorrectly, my CNA does not lose her license. But if a CMA gives a med incorrectly, s/he goes down and takes down several others, that may have done absolutely nothing wrong.

In the time it takes to properly and honestly "supervise" others in giving meds safely, the nurse could easily perform the task herself. The use of other lesser educated staff to give meds, to so-called "extend" the nurse's skills, endangers patients, while increasing profits at facilities.

Until a CMA is considered completely and totally responsible, with no other caregiver assuming any responsibility whatsoever for the errors that the CMA may commit, s/he has no business giving meds to my patients. And I will not work in a facility that permits use of CMAs.

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Apr 6, 2005

CMA's have a certification that is on the line. That is if they want to work as a CMA and not on the floor as a CNA. There butt IS on the line.
Caye

Along with the nurse's. :stone

caye · Apr 6, 2005

Along with yours, the ADON, DON, Administrator, Executive Director, etc.

Their butt is also on the line for whatever mistakes you make.

Persoanlly, I enjoy assistance from anyone qualified (and many CMA's are) that can help make my job and life a little easier whether they are an LVN, CMA, or CNA. :)

However, as ADON I left the position because I got tired of being on call and having nurses call with stupid questions and they just wanted to write that the ADON was notified thinking that that got them off the hook. (It doesn't)

I mean really stupid things like telling me the admission was there and what do they do? :uhoh3: They knew what to do when I asked them.

Everyone above you, well lets just say their butts are on the line too.

Caye

Along with the nurse's. :stone

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Apr 6, 2005

Along with yours, the ADON, DON, Administrator, Executive Director, etc.
Their butt is also on the line for whatever mistakes you make.
Persoanlly, I enjoy assistance from anyone qualified (and many CMA's are) that can help make my job and life a little easier whether they are an LVN, CMA, or CNA. :)
However, as ADON I left the position because I got tired of being on call and having nurses call with stupid questions and they just wanted to write that the ADON was notified thinking that that got them off the hook. (It doesn't)
I mean really stupid things like telling me the admission was there and what do they do? They knew what to do when I asked them.
Everyone above you, well lets just say their butts are on the line too.
Caye

And everyone "above" me choses to do this. I'm saying i choose NOT to risk it. I worked hard to get were i am, and i'm not taking chances of delegating medication resposibilities, therefore, will not work in a place that does this.

caye · Apr 6, 2005

You don't have to worry, in Texas at least, CMA's do not work in OR's or anywhere in a hospital setting.

Caye

And everyone "above" me choses to do this. I'm saying i choose NOT to risk it.

caroladybelle, BSN, RN · Apr 6, 2005

Persoanlly, I enjoy assistance from anyone qualified (and many CMA's are) that can help make my job and life a little easier whether they are an LVN, CMA, or CNA.

Thus is the problem. The limited amount of education/training that the CMAs receive does not remotely "qualify" them for safe administration of meds. And have to "supervise" 2-5 CMAs with the vital conditions/medications/treatments of all of their patients is much harder than having a reasonable patient load and administering meds yourself as an RN.

Marie_LPN, RN, LPN, RN · Apr 6, 2005

You don't have to worry, in Texas at least, CMA's do not work in OR's or anywhere in a hospital setting.
Caye

Wasn't worried in the first place.

I'm done here.

caye · Apr 6, 2005

I did not say ALL CMA's were qualified. I said many CMA's are. It is the same as in all jobs in our profession. There are many nurses that are not qualified as well. Where do you work? Are you in LTC?

Caye

Thus is the problem. The limited amount of education/training that the CMAs receive does not remotely "qualify" them for safe administration of meds. And have to "supervise" 2-5 CMAs with the vital conditions/medications/treatments of all of their patients is much harder than having a reasonable patient load and administering meds yourself as an RN.