Nursing is pathetic... - page 15
It's to bad you feel this way I work in the E.R.and am constantly exposed to hiv, hepatitis,and a host of other diseases you can protect yourself. Why did you really go into nursing ws it for the... Read More
Oct 19, '00Originally posted by ShannonB25:
Wow! After reading that last post I am really excited about getting to work in California next year. Thanks for sharing Stephanie!
Perfect here in California?
No. But with the CNA we are working TOGETHER to improve for ourselves and our patients.
Oct 24, '00Originally posted by nursedude:
That about sums it up for me... I am a 34 year old guy and live in Pittsburgh Pa. Have been an RN for 10years. I have done the following in nursing: Cardiotharacic ICU, ER,UR, Case Management...
THe problems with nursing I have found:
1) Poor compensation- I have friends that are Registered Plumbers and registered electricians, Certified computer specialists etc. All of them make twice as much $$$ as I do- none of them have a college degree. None of them are exposed to HIV, TB, Hepatitis on a daily basis.
2) You can't really practice nursing on your own even though you are licensed- See above- The plumber, the electrician and the computer guy all work full time jobs and also do business on the side from home and make money... Did you ever practice nursing on the side? its called illegal...
3) Nurses are on the bottom of the food chain...Doctors, PA's, CRNP's, Administrators all look down on nurses- at least here in Pittsburgh they do. Nurses here are just another load on the revenue generated by hospitals...
You are the man. I agree totally. Some of these people went into nursing after the big killer hit the decks. HIV. I didn't sign on for that. I graduated in 1974. Nor did I sign on to be treated like garbage. As to the question, NO, and I have pointedly told people not to go into it. They all smile that little 'you're having a bad day' smile like they know something I don't. Okay. Live it up. I left two and a half years ago and am writing a book. I have moved cross country, and have re-done the house I bought last year.
I don't think if I had known that it was such an abusive work place that I would ever have become a nurse. It's the disrespect and the bullyism and rankism, and let's face it, there's too much of the passive aggressive whining about 'that's just the way it is.' Too many parallels between nurses who stay in abusive workplaces and battered women who stay with the batterer and 'don't see the light.' Amazingly similar dynamics.
And I agree that nursing is dying out. This is the second board I've been on and the stories of abuse are rampant. Talk about no status. With all the talk of healthcare today, who are the main players--per the press and media? The doctors, the patients, and the insurance companies. Nurses aren't even mentioned. Except for a September article I heard about in the Chicago Tribune that stated that thousands are killed by Nursing Errors. Apparently it was a three or four installment article. So, how's that?
Oct 24, '00Originally posted by Nursing Slug:
What's this about "feeling good about helping people". The "boss" makes sure that's not about to happen! There is little 'on the job satisfaction'. The workload is tremendous, one nurse is pushed to the physical and mental limits just to perform the paperwork and basics, to maintain their liscense from being revoked. The days of sitting down and consoling a patient are over.... it's "Open wide, I'm shovin' the pills down the throat... without even breakin' my flyin' stride"~~~~> Gotta get back to the paperwork, sign off a few thousand treatments that I can't possibly perform due to ~~~> WORK OVERLOAD. PS: Do you think nurses get "Burned out" because they "enjoy" or have "fun" at their jobs?
My job was like yours. I was exhausted and depressed all the time. Never ending 'new procedures.' What the doctors used to do, the nurses 'got to do' all of a sudden. Bully bosses. All the reasons I went into it 26 years ago dried up after 1987.
Oct 24, '00Originally posted by nursedude:
So you mean to tell me some hospital is paying you $25 or $30 bucks an hour? Boy, have you got them fooled. Congrats MIRN...
As far as where I live- I'm from western Pa. Allegheny General Hospital Just went bankrupt for 1.5 BILLION dollars, ten years ago, AGH was the top revenue producing hospital in the nation. Since filing for bankruptcy, ALL employees at AGH have taken substantial pay cuts, doctors have lost thier practices and also gone bankrupt. The University of Pittsburgh Health system- originally consisting of 6 hospitals has taken advantage of the market- They started thier own HMO and bought up most other area hospital- guess what? They looked at AGH's demise and many of thier employees have taken cuts too!!!
And guess what else? AGH went bankrupt because of a few greedy administrators, they were getting paid tons of money while the backs of the hospital's employees were breaking.(ie: RN's) Now they have all taken pay cuts to keep thier jobs. Theres also much scuttlebut about the start of a nursing union. (If nursing was so good, why would nurses need a union?)
Personally, 10 years ago I never would have imagined that this could have happened. I bet that we all will see this more and more. I bet MIRN that you'll see this happen sooner or later in your area too.
By the way mirn, I would say that the average base pay for an RN in the pittsburgh area is anywhere from $14 - $21 an hour- I don't see this going up here-in fact I'd say its going to go down.
No wonder why Hillary Clinton said back in 1992 "...Nurses are undereducated and overpaid ..." I'd bet that the hospital administrators were you work think that RN's are overpaid. Why aren't they paying you more? I mean for crying out loud, we as nurses sometimes hold our patients lives in our hands- administering blood, life threatening medications etc for a measly $25 dollars an hour, come on MIRN I think you are cutting the profession of nursing off at the knees.
Again, the purpose of this forum was for us to post our opinions. I posted my opinions,and by doing so I seem to have gotten a large response from nurses who say that" when they get burned out..." For crying out loud! If nursing were so good, why are all nurses burned out so frequently????
I believe that because I am part of this profession that the most important job I have as a nurse is that of patient advocate- the hospitals no longer allow us (nurses) to do that job and this is where I believe that the value of being a nurse really lies..
[This message has been edited by nursedude (edited September 29, 1999).]
Taking off on what you said. First of all, I cannot stand it when someone 'accuses' another of being 'burned out.' Like it's some kind of judgment against that person. They were trying that crappy line in Calif. more than a decade ago. Like "you're just not taking good enough care of yourself." Okay. No, You're just treating me like garbage. My view of it is that there is not enough 'outside life' to accommodate the terrors of some 'jobs.'
Do architects get burned out? Do lawyers? I mean, the only professions I hear of getting burn out are cops, nurses, paramedics, fire personnel, the high people-interfacing, high tragedy jobs. Not architects and other professionals who do get more career esteem over time. It's not always about money. It's about the worth you feel at work. And for me, there wasn't any in nursing. I don't know how I hung on as long as I did, but it was by my fingernails and a whole load of denial. No career should have the concept of 'burn-out' built into it. That's just not acceptable, but too many nurses accept this idiocy. Like it should be 'normal' not to continue in this career without some big switcheroo.
Anyway, did that hideous Hilary really say that? Oh, my God, how did I miss that?
Oct 24, '00Originally posted by Nurse Kate:
Boy, after sitting here for 30 minutes reading all of these replys I feel really depressed about becoming a nurse. Is this what I have to look forward to? All these feelings of anger and resentment. I hope not. Sometimes, it is easier to remember the bad times and not the good. Lately I have been questioning my choice of becoming a nurse. But let me tell you I know a lot of people who aren't nurses who moan and groan about there jobs. Nothing is perfect. Perhaps we all need to remember the old saying, 'the grass is always greener on the other side.'
I agree with the respondent who wrote education is the key. It is! Nursing is such a diversified field. There are so many opportunities in nursing, just open your eyes and look!
By the way, yes, I am one of those "blonde Florence Nightengales" that you, nurse dude, so fondly look down upon. And you know what? I am proud to say it!
So, would I recommend nursing as a profession? YES! As long as a person goes into it with their eyes wide open, not with the blinders on.
Did you think some of us veterans went in with 'blinders on?' At least there is an internet with bulletin boards for you to consult as you proceed down your career road. If I'd heard stuff like this in the early seventies when I was a new grad and already 'wondering' about the high level of abuse to nurses in the ER I worked in, I would have had my inklings 'validated' and I would have run like hell. There was no one to validate what I perceived. I was told that it was 'my problem.' Well, I was young and insecure, so I swallowed it.
Turns out I was right. Don't criticize until you've been there. Yes, I'm out and out for good.
Oct 24, '00I agree with you ND. I think that RNs will soon be a thing of the past. I no longer work as a nurse at all, but keep my license...probably won't even renew next time. Why renew it? It's nothing but a license that says "Abuse me!" And the abuse comes from everywhere; too frequently from my RN sisters. I am also a man and we're socialized differently. Women think men are primitive because we openly display our anger/aggression. I find all the passive-aggresion infuriating.
To all the people who think that nurses should be happy to make squat and spend their retirement years eating cat food: Why don't you do it for free then? Why not go all the way and REALLY be altruistic?
Oct 26, '00Hi nursedude. Tell me more about the sick ins or lay outs. Have you done it? If not, would you please sign up for the ER and then call in sick or lay out and let me know what happens. Just make sure that it's not in a hospital with a union, because I work in a right to work state. By the way, is Pennsylvannia a right to work state?
Oct 27, '00Chigap,
I must say it's refreshing to be able to share the same point of view with someone for a change as opposed to the constant nagging...
Apparently there are many nurses on this board who probably feel that because of my ability to openly display my anger/agression and feelings about nursing that I must be a bad nurse. That I am in nursing for all the wrong reasons, that I am not compassionate and that I am uncaring at best. The truth of the matter is that I could care less about what they think. First off, I enjoyed being a nurse- really. But, the truth of the matter is that there is so much apathy in the nursing profession that it's pathetic. You pointed out "passive/agression" others have used the term "co-dependant" and some go as far as to compare the mindset of most nurses to that of a battered woman unable to leave her abusive husband. For some reason there are a number of nurses- like those who want to organize and march that can see that there are problems in the profession, yet when asked to take a strong action (ie: nationwide sick day(s))they shield themselves with the same old excuse "But who will take care of the patients"? Or better yet, "Then the government will step in"! Don't they see? Our federal government is already involved in healthcare. Our state governments are so deeply entrenched in healthcare that all thats left hanging out are their ankles... As far as the who is going to take care of the patients attitude- I say I agree- who is going to take care of the patients once corporate bigshots and hospital admins get they're way in 5, 10 or 20 years when janitors and housekeeping will be cross trained to do ABG's , EKG's, IV inserts and all the rest of patient care? Who then will be taking care of your patients???
Look, in my honest opinion something very drastic must be done to prevent further erosion of the nursing profession- not just for the sake of the profession itself, but more importantly the patients that depend on nurses. Here in Pittsburgh, as I'm sure in other areas, hospital staffing with licensed professional nurses is extremely low. In retirement and nursing homes the staffing is pathetic at best. I have never heard anyone say something like "Oh, there were so many nurses there to help me." rather I always hear "I kept pushing the call button for the nurse and it took her a half hour to get to me..."
What in the name of Florence is it going to take to get nurses (professional licensed nurses) to realize that they are being and have been getting squeezed out of the healthcare picture and replaced with less qualified, unlicensed staff???? When are these nurses going to come out of the deep denial that they live in and see that they are seen by hospitals, insurance companies and the like to be nothing more than expendable and reduce-able overhead???? Why are they allowing themselves to be played like the sucker???
I know the reason why to all of my above questions... the reason is "That's the way it's always been..." That answer fits in well with "who will take care of the patients" just fine don't you think?
So, in regard to all those nurses who are willing to march, yet are also afraid of loosing their jobs, or are worried about who will take care of the patients while they are gone or to those nurses who cross nursing picket lines I say "Keep holding on to your ankles and bend over a little more".
I just wish that they would see how used and for that matter, as you've pointed out Chighap, and abused that nurses really are. It's like the alcoholic who has had several DUI's lost his family and job and knows something is terribly wrong in his life yet swears that he dosen't have a drinking problem...
But it must be my testosterone or something... So, for all of those passive aggressives out there just keep on considering me primitive...
Dec 8, '00Just thought I'd check in on the status of this beloved thread...
Apparently not much interaction as of late.
Needless to say, I still think nursing is pathetic. I have recently quit my PRN position as a nurse...I did that after the hospital where I was working PRN sent me an inter-office communication that simply stated that they were cutting the salaries of their PRN nurses. Oh well, guess what? I decided to cut their staff as a result so I quit...
You know, there was no meeting prior to their decision to cut salaries. Their was no asking -"if we cut your salary would you all still stay?". They just cut it...Proof positive to me, that the profession of nusing is a farce.
Another thing that makes me wonder about nursing/nurses can be found on this board. For instance, if you go back out to the "Would you recomend nursing as a career?" heading, you'll see what I mean... People(nurses) have posted the most interesting topics under the heading "Would you recomend...?". For instance, I am just waiting for someone to post something like "Fat nurses vs. Skinny nurses, How do I loose weight?" Or maybe, "Lazy doctors sleeping with coworker, what to do?"...
The thread is called "Would you recomend nursing as a career?" and people have posted things under that heading that have absolutely nothing to do with that topic. Again, proof to me that "Nursing is Pathetic".
Dec 8, '00Nursedude, that experience you had with your PRN employeer cutting your pay, it is so typical of all the health care employeers around here. Not only do they not care what you THINK, they do not care about YOU. The pay scales around here has been frozen for years but in some cases tehy have been going down, benefits have been cut in the past and will be cut in the future. Of course, you are aware of all these things and have discussed them many times. How these people hope to practice 21st century medicine with 19th century labor managment techniques is beyond me. Something is going to give. What I think will happen is that there will be a mass exodus of licensed personel from this area to other parts of the country where conditions are much better. This will happen just as our elderly population explodes and many hospitals have been shut down. In about two years the strain will really be showing and in five even everyday people will be aware that something has gone really wrong. They will realize this when there own family members are lying in Emergency Departments dying with out treatment.
Dec 9, '00nursedude and oramar your last two posts were right on the money. I have been both in and out of the nursing profession over the last quarter of a century. Currently in and decided to stay in and try to change the pathetic professional conditions in most areas of nursing today. Itsa 60's thing..if your not part of the solution you're part of the problem. The market place will ultimately determine wages/benefits for nurses but it will be slow in changing unless the nurses also demand the change. I would not stay in a position that cut my salary. There are otherways to save money/cut costs if necessary. Keep posting on this thread and just maybe....someday
Dec 14, '00I have been a nurse for 13 years and I agree that it has reached a pathetic state of affairs.
We all know the deal by now. Hospital Administrators who know less and less about healthcare and more about business management getting enormous salaries and bonus money.
Money that should be being spent on healthcare delivery going to so-called overseers, the HMO's and their investors.
Pharmeceutical companies and medical supply companies charging huge prices for their products.
Nurses still being looked upon as housekeepers and maids by some patients.
Nursing management becoming more and more bullying in their approach to their nurses.
Nurses fighting amongst each other over petty disagreements over who knows what, who does their job better etc,etc.
I for one am trying to get out. And it is not about burn-out or not caring anymore. You reach a point when you realize that you are being sacrificed body and soul for others who are reaping in big rewards.
As far as I can see the majority of the American people don't care about nurses very much or healthcare for that matter.
Nurses are by far inteligent, well meaning people who are being duped due to their backgrounds. We are idealists whose idealism is slowly draining us.
I am going to use my intelligence and my skills with people to go into another business that looks to the future as it is developing. A way for average everyday people to get a share of a good quality life and work at home so they can enjoy family again. My wife and I have hardly seen each other for years. She is a nurse as well and we have sacrificed enough.
Dec 14, '00Originally posted by mirn:
If we are "pathetic" , "ignorant" and "make you laugh" , perhaps it is time you find others with whom to share your opinions and let us continue with our camaraderie...
I think you missed our point that we would recommend nursing as a career IF you are dedicated to patients and not dedicated to chasing the almighty big dollar.
I don't know where nursedude works (geographically), but where I come from, nurses are quite well-paid...upwards of $25-$30 per hr. in most areas, and we are experiencing a shortage, which means large sign on bonuses for many new employees.