Need your help - trying to change school policy

Nursing Students General Students

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I would greatly appreciate your help. After losing two more students after 5th quarter (of a 6 qtr ADN program) our class would like to put forth a proposal to lower the percentage required for remaining in the program. It would greatly help our cause if we had information from other schools of their requirements. If you could please let me know your school, city, state, and type of program (ADN, BSN, LPN, etc), the minimum gpa or percentage a student can earn before they are dropped out or what happens if a student falls below that mark for a class. THANK YOU!

ex. Seattle Central Community College, Seattle, WA, 2yr ADN, min. grade to stay in the program is 82% and if you fall below that you are dropped from the program with no option to retake a class.

Again, thank you for your input, I greatly appreciate your help. If you have additional information to add about how many students have been dropped from your program that would be great too.

Specializes in Nil..

For my school the grade scale is:

A - 92-100%

B - 85-91%

C- Don't even know because at this point you are out of the program.

I'd rather have a nurse that knows his/her stuff and passed school with high academic standards I think.

My school has a 98-100% pass rate over the past few years

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Specializes in Medical Floor RN.
Seriously, why would you want to do that? Do you honestly think lowering standards is beneficial? The high standards are why your school has a high NCLEX pass rate.

Not true. Our school, Georgia Perimeter College, Clarkston, Georgia, ADN Program has a pass rate for classes of 75% before you are dropped (with a possible option of retaking the following semester the class is offered) and our NCLEX pass rate has been 100% for many years. I do believe that 82% is a little high for the standards of dropping a potential RN from a program and believe that the students should seek to have it changed. Remember the old saying of...A "C" = RN. It is very true. I know many great nurses out there today who are practicing safely, competently, and with great confidence who didn't have to pass all of their courses with a "B" average. Good luck to you and all of your fellow students. I will pray your proposal is a success!

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Specializes in LTC, Medical, Rehab, Psych.

I know you mean well with this post but I'm at Highline (WA State also- need 80% to pass) and to correct your intentions- if you read local news, Seattle area hospitals are not hiring new grads. Unless you're already working as a tech or have some way in, you'll be hard-pressed to find a job in the short-run. Good luck, but I'm not sure that we need to pump out more nurses with lower pass rates. We're already struggling to get jobs for everybody graduating. There seems to be plenty of jobs for RNs with experience (with the exception of hiring freezes at a couple of the major hospitals), just not new grads. Take a look. It's awfully depressing. Are you working now?

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Specializes in Pediatrics, Geriatrics, LTC.

people that "don't test well" won't be able to do this. period. You have to pass the NCLEX, there's no way around it. Not everyone is cut out to be a nurse, sorry. It takes a certain amount of intelligence and adaptability. Those who are qualified and really want it, will find a way to learn it. Your comment about "don't test well" reminds me of my teaching days and the special ed kids who had the REQUIREMENT that their tests be READ to them! They get a high school diploma same as everyone else. Should we have nurses who can't read or do math as well? Nursing is not easy and it should not be dumbed down. We're talking peoples lives here!

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In my opinion there are alot of factors that should be considered when gauging if a schools pass rate is "fair". A couple that come to mind are: How many credits is the term? How many exams, points can be earned during that period?

At my ADN program in MA we need a 77% in nursing classes to pass. Each term we have one 9 credit course. There are 3 exams and a final worth 22.5% each and one paper worth 10%. Each of the three exams have 74 questions and the final has 100. The lab and clinical is pass/fail. our pass rate is 98% We lost 20 something students last term out of about 100, because they didn't score high enough on the exams to get the 77% average. These students have to reapply for the following year (courses are only offered once per year) The students who failed in the fall ALL reapplied and they accepted 6 of them back. The average GPA for appected students is probably around a 3.8 out of 4.0.

I think that how the school grades is important because if you have many grading opportunities, then having one bad day isn't as big of a deal because you will be able to make it up.

I think that when schools post their pass rate, they should also post their retention rate. I never thought to ask how many people start the program versus finish it. I am doing well in the program but just because I can memorize material and narrow down the best answer in nclex style question doesnt mean I am going to be a good nurse. (I hope I will be a good nurse!) I believe that some students are not used to the nclex style exams - I wish that there was a probation period or some sort of nclex prep class to help the strugling student before they get kicked out.

Anyway, I think that you have the right idea, trying to bring this to your schools attention but I would also consider what else the school could do to change, if they say they are not going to change the grade requirements.

Could you suggest they give more exams or quizes or more questions on each exam? Maybe that they implement a policy that if 75% of the class gets a certain question incorrect on an exam that the question be thrown out (with the reasoning that the majority of students did not understand it, the wording was poor, concept not taught properly, etc). Maybe other ways to help retain students that aren't initially good nclex style test takers?

Good luck, I hope it all works out for you!

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people that "don't test well" won't be able to do this. period. You have to pass the NCLEX, there's no way around it. Not everyone is cut out to be a nurse, sorry. It takes a certain amount of intelligence and adaptability. Those who are qualified and really want it, will find a way to learn it. Your comment about "don't test well" reminds me of my teaching days and the special ed kids who had the REQUIREMENT that their tests be READ to them! They get a high school diploma same as everyone else. Should we have nurses who can't read or do math as well? Nursing is not easy and it should not be dumbed down. We're talking peoples lives here!

The first time you did a physical assessment were you perfect? I think that if someone is in their last term and still can't take a nclex style exam then, yes that is a problem, but many schools are failing people out with 2 months of nursing school experience because they can't grasp the concept of nclex style exams. I personally think that pople should be given a chance because you are 100% correct, if you can't pass the nclex, you can't be a nurse. I don't know how to take what you said about the special ed kids, I kind of find it offensive, but maybe I am reading it wrong. I think maybe it was just a bad comparison. Special ed kids that pass highschool because someone read them their tests and record THEIR answers, SHOULD have a diploma just like everyone else. I don't think anyone is saying nursing studnets that can't read or do math should get to be nurses.

I am doing well in my program but I think it would have helped tremendously to have been exposed in my pre-req classes to nclex questions. Then once in the program, you could focus more on the nursing skills and less on figuring out this new exam style.

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My school not only has a high percentage required to pass (80%) but they also changed the grading scale so that this represents a "C". I am fine with the percentage, but when someone has gotten an 85% in a class and this is recorded on transcripts as a C, it looks bad, because everyone else operates on the standard 4.0 scale.

I think I'm right when I say the school's grading scale appears on your transcript. It does here, anyway.

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I'm sorry - but I would die if my alma mater suddenly LOWERED their passing/retention standards.

A poor economy attracts a lot of people as career-changers to so-called "guaranteed" jobs (healthcare is always seen as one of these). Some of these people would never have been attracted to nursing had it not been for the state the economy is currently in.

Also - I'm thinking that, if this attrition rate is this off, then the SCHOOL needs to rethink its criteria for admission in the first place. I'm thinking it's time for this institution to take a good hard look at itself - because with this high an attrition rate it's only shooting itself in the foot as soon as it accepts a "risky" admit. And if the attrition rate IS that high, then that's probably what's going on. They're not being very selective with who they let in - and if current waiting lists are indicative of anything, they won't have a problem being pickier.

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